Any suggetions?

[garou]

My husband and I inherited from a friend, his 3 yr old bow front, 40 gal tank. He only had fish in there, as he kept it 74-75 degrees, and fed them mysis (one cube) 2 times a day, and even then, cut back. So we happen to recieve:
1 of each::
clown fish
'dory' fish
fire fin
yellow tail blue damsel
and
blue leg hermit
2 - red leg hermits
2-3 snails
It was doing fairly well, till reciently.
We picked up 3 emerald crabs, a cleaner shrimp, and 3 nassarius snails.
Also picking up some corals: 2 polyps, a mushroom, and a pulseing xenia.
we got as well one: feather duster, a serpent starfish, and an anemone.
the one fish we purchased was a yellow tang.
now these were all added each weekend. So it was not a horrific influx of new bodys. Letting everyone aclimate properly, and as Isaid: till reciently, things were going well.
However we unfortunately over fed. This raised the amonia. We lost the tang initally, then our dory, and nearly everything else has been following the downward death spiral. We've got the test strips, and also have gone to our LFS, and she's tested our water: all water parameters are on score once more.
What we have not lost:
Clown
fire fin
Yellow tail Damsel
blue hermit
snails (all)
Emeralds
Cleaner shrimp
feather duster
our mushroom is looking very bad, and our anemone has never really open up into those lovely long flowing fingers.
We have now: green AND red alge on the tank walls. not just the red we started with.
Theres a good amount of bristleworms we have found as well.
Admitidly we did no research till reciently. And we did not think we over fed, but we learned very fast, we had. Our flow is not like the LFS's flow and my husband tends to not 'top off' the tank.
I am looking for suggestions, ideas, and any links within the forum that can help us learn more on how to bring our tank back into great health.
I'm going to post links to pix I took of the tank earlier today, so that the shroom and anemone can be looked at.
Right now, the anemone is puffing up all over, not sending its 'fingers' up and out, but like and 'all over bloat'.
Thank you for your time and please be patient with us, we know now to research, ask, and research more.
PIX:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v682/Garouwerks/Pix%20to%20hand%20over/050211122033.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v682/Garouwerks/Pix%20to%20hand%20over/050211122015.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v682/Garouwerks/Pix%20to%20hand%20over/050211121947.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v682/Garouwerks/Pix%20to%20hand%20over/050211121913.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v682/Garouwerks/Pix%20to%20hand%20over/050211121849.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v682/Garouwerks/Pix%20to%20hand%20over/050211121820.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v682/Garouwerks/Pix%20to%20hand%20over/050211121805.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v682/Garouwerks/Pix%20to%20hand%20over/050211121743.jpg
Our clown loves to host the red alge in the corner. >.< but it is what we got when our friend gave it to us. Again, thank you for your thoughts!

 

[btldreef]

Welcome!
Any chance that you know how much gallons per hour (GPH) your pump is?
Do you have any powerheads? What type? How strong?
Get rid of the test strips, they're not accurate. Get yourself SeaChem test kits if you can, or if you're willing to spend the extra money, go with ELOS or Salifert (don't use Saliferts nitrate kit, it's terrible). If you can't, API will do. DO NOT buy Red Sea test kits, they're terrible. Also, don't trust that your LFS is testing your water and telling you it's perfect, remember, they need to sell, and they can't really sell if your water quality is not up to par. Far to often, LFS's lie about water quality or have old test kits.
How long has the tank been in your possession? How did you move it?
No tangs for this tank, it's not large enough.
You have some aiptasia anemones in your tank. They need to be eradicated. I prefer to use Aiptasia X to get rid of them. Joe's Juice is another popular and easy way.
Exactly what were you feeding? How often and how much?
What do you have for filtration? Is it a hang on back filter or is there a sump attached to this tank?
Can you post a full tank shot?
You definitely need more clean up crew (CUC) members (snails, hermits, shrimp, etc).
I'd recommend getting rid of the damsel. As they grow, they get really aggressive and will attack the other fish. Ultimately, they'll decide what you can and can't (including your hand) have in the tank.
Did you mean Fire Fish? I'm not sure what a fire fin is.
The red algae is cyano. It's actually bacteria, not algae. It feeds off of excess nutrients in the tank and usually forms where there is a lack of flow. I'd recommend siphoning off as much as possibly and cutting back on feeding (which you said you were doing). You might want to also add another powerhead or aim one at the areas where the cyano seems to be forming the most. DO NOT use Red Slime Remover.
I'd recommend returning the anemone. Anemones need stable tanks with perfect water parameters. It doesn't sound like your tank is stable enough for one at this moment. If it dies in your tank, you could toxify your tank, so it's better to get rid of it and buy another one when your tank is ready.
Are you running any carbon in your filtration system?

 

[nikesb]

tangs should be kept in much larger aquariums. a 40gallon is definately not the right size for them.
also from your pictures, i recommend increasing the flow in your tank by adding a powerhead. this will help get rid of alot of your cyano

 

[btldreef]

Also, for more info, You can view the Recommend Threads in the New Hobbyist section. There seems to be an issue with them right now and they're not working, but they should be fixed shortly.

 

[garou]

Thank you for the welcome and the replys!
I had been reading over and over articles on the sea horses, when our tank took the dump. It's been depressing, but we both know we can and will get it back to: holy cow! with help and time.
Now to your questions:
Quote:
Any chance that you know how much gallons per hour (GPH) your pump is?
Do you have any powerheads? What type? How strong?
Well, we did not get any papers from our friend, but we do know it's a JEBO 835. And it's running on 2 of them. I will get you pix if you need them.
Quote:
Get rid of the test strips, they're not accurate. Get yourself SeaChem test kits if you can, or if you're willing to spend the extra money, go with ELOS or Salifert (don't use Saliferts nitrate kit, it's terrible). If you can't, API will do. DO NOT buy Red Sea test kits, they're terrible. Also, don't trust that your LFS is testing your water and telling you it's perfect, remember, they need to sell, and they can't really sell if your water quality is not up to par. Far to often, LFS's lie about water quality or have old test kits.
We will look into the SeaChem for sure, thank you. Both of us have wanted a Salt water tank since we were teens, and already love this one, issues and all. I don't -think- our LFS owner would lie, but, I do see where she would and does want to sell. they only sell SWF however, and nothing else. but yes, I get you, some trust, not full trust. Thank you.
Quote:
How long has the tank been in your possession? How did you move it?
No tangs for this tank, it's not large enough.
You have some aiptasia anemones in your tank. They need to be eradicated. I prefer to use Aiptasia X to get rid of them. Joe's Juice is another popular and easy way.
Exactly what were you feeding? How often and how much?
What do you have for filtration? Is it a hang on back filter or is there a sump attached to this tank?
Can you post a full tank shot?
You definitely need more clean up crew (CUC) members (snails, hermits, shrimp, etc).

I'd recommend getting rid of the damsel. As they grow, they get really aggressive and will attack the other fish. Ultimately, they'll decide what you can and can't (including your hand) have in the tank.
Did you mean Fire Fish? I'm not sure what a fire fin is.
We have had the tank aprox 2-3 months. Doug and Cowboy(the hubby), moved it aprox half mile (little less) in Dougs truck. It happen to still hold the fish in it. -I- realise now, that was HORRIBLE. However, with how things were going, it HAD to be moved, and theyhad no time to bag the fish. Sad I know. They were in a half tank of water for transport.
Ok: No tangs will be got from now on.
The LFS owner called the anemones, glass anemones. But we get ya, so they will be got rid of.
Feeding:
hikari brine shrimp, frozen, 2 times a day, 1/2 cube each feeding. (such was not the case 3 weeks back )
No sump. And the filter is in the JEBO.
Shot will be posted tonight.
I had been pushing for more CUC, lol. So thank you for that back up. We will certanly get more. I need to know however: we have 3 Emerald crabs, can we get more? Or would that be bad juju? We don't want more bad juju.
It will be a little time before we can get another tank, so we will keep the damsel in there for now. But it will be moved for sure. Already with the loss of the 'Dory', and the yellow tang, it's getting more agressive. However IT leaves US alone while our Clown .. she's our biter, and literally chases my husbands hand and bites it, or the net, or the little claw hand he picked up. She's our lil bull dog.
Yes: Firefish Goby. Sorry I got the name wrong, Doug called it a fire fin.
Quote:
The red algae is cyano. It's actually bacteria, not algae. It feeds off of excess nutrients in the tank and usually forms where there is a lack of flow. I'd recommend siphoning off as much as possibly and cutting back on feeding (which you said you were doing). You might want to also add another powerhead or aim one at the areas where the cyano seems to be forming the most. DO NOT use Red Slime Remover.
I'd recommend returning the anemone. Anemones need stable tanks with perfect water parameters. It doesn't sound like your tank is stable enough for one at this moment. If it dies in your tank, you could toxify your tank, so it's better to get rid of it and buy another one when your tank is ready.
Are you running any carbon in your filtration system?
Cyano: Well then that helps. We will get out our siphon, and clean that out with the magnetic glass cleaner, and suck it out as well. as for the powerheads.. initally the tank had a long green tube that comes with the JEBO. It has holes all along it, and the flow was so so. Cowboy hooked up both JEBO's and added on a high flow powerhead. (it is 'fan' shaped and can be aimed) One there was the higher water flow, things began to look bit by bit better.
The shroom is still really unhappy, and at your suggestions, tonight we took out the anemone.
Cowboy said that the carbon has been running since we got it. So Doug had it in there for some time, and we have to sak him how llong he had it in there. But there is NOW a new carbon pouch in the JEBO.
I will look over the recommend threads for sure. I have been awaiting their return with (ha ha) 'baited breath'.
to nikeSB:
Thank you as well! We'llnot get another tang now. -chuckle- And I will have to get a better corner picture where the Cyano is, as it's now turning a dark mucky brown color. (hence the need to now for sure siphon it out)

 

[garou]

Picture of the front.
Now it bows, so it's hard to get it all in there. Tell me what you want, and I'll snap it tomorrow for you.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v682/Garouwerks/Pix%20to%20hand%20over/050211223242.jpg

 

[nikesb]

definately add more flow. if you want a well worth it power head, look into a vortech mp10. its expensive but it provides tons of flow as well as different modes to run them on. otherwise look into some koralias (probably 2-3 of them would work out well). i guarantee you though that the mp10 will be one of the better things you can get

 

[btldreef]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Garou http:///forum/thread/385497/any-suggetions#post_3380919
Thank you for the welcome and the replys!
I had been reading over and over articles on the sea horses, when our tank took the dump. It's been depressing, but we both know we can and will get it back to: holy cow! with help and time.
Now to your questions:
Well, we did not get any papers from our friend, but we do know it's a JEBO 835. And it's running on 2 of them. I will get you pix if you need them.
Not the best filter for a saltwater tank, but it will do.
We will look into the SeaChem for sure, thank you. Both of us have wanted a Salt water tank since we were teens, and already love this one, issues and all. I don't -think- our LFS owner would lie, but, I do see where she would and does want to sell. they only sell SWF however, and nothing else. but yes, I get you, some trust, not full trust. Thank you.
Unfortunately, you'd be surprised. Especially with the way the economy is right now. There's a lot of people jumping ship in this hobby.
We have had the tank aprox 2-3 months. Doug and Cowboy(the hubby), moved it aprox half mile (little less) in Dougs truck. It happen to still hold the fish in it. -I- realise now, that was HORRIBLE. However, with how things were going, it HAD to be moved, and theyhad no time to bag the fish. Sad I know. They were in a half tank of water for transport.
Ok. So you have to look at it as your tank is only about 3 months old. With a move like that, a lot got shook up. You're lucking you didn't loose your fish in the move. But I'm sure it started a little "mini cycle" again.
Ok: No tangs will be got from now on. I know it stinks, but your tank just isn't large enough. I actually wouldn't add any more fish, especially until you get rid of the damsel. Look at the Coral Beauty Angelfish (dwarf angelfish) or African Flameback dwarf angelfish, those would work well for you once the tank settles.
The LFS owner called the anemones, glass anemones. But we get ya, so they will be got rid of. Glass anemone is another name for aiptasia.
Feeding:
hikari brine shrimp, frozen, 2 times a day, 1/2 cube each feeding. (such was not the case 3 weeks back ) Brine shrimp is really garbage. Get yourself some better foods. Feeding your fish brine is like giving a child popcorn: it will fill them up, but it has little to know nutritional value. Look into Mysis Shrimp (PE Mysis is best), Emerald Entree and Marine Cuisine.

No sump. And the filter is in the JEBO.
Shot will be posted tonight.
I had been pushing for more CUC, lol. So thank you for that back up. We will certanly get more. I need to know however: we have 3 Emerald crabs, can we get more? Or would that be bad juju? We don't want more bad juju. Personally, I am not a fan of ANY crabs in a reef tank. On numerous occasions, crabs go rogue and decide to start eating coral, attacking fish, killing snails, etc. I just got tired of it. I have none, except for a porcelain anemone crab in my reef, and intend to keep it that way from here on out. If the ones you have are behaving thus far, leave them, but don't add more.I would add a lot more snails:
15 Nassarius
15 Trochus
10 Astrea or 15 Nerites
10 Ceriths
It will be a little time before we can get another tank, so we will keep the damsel in there for now. But it will be moved for sure. Already with the loss of the 'Dory', and the yellow tang, it's getting more agressive. However IT leaves US alone while our Clown .. she's our biter, and literally chases my husbands hand and bites it, or the net, or the little claw hand he picked up. She's our lil bull dog. My suggestion would actually be to get rid of the damsel all together. Trade it in to the LFS, even if it's just for more fish food. You're not going to want that guy in any of your tanks ultimately. Clowns can be bullies, they're part of the damsel family. There are ways to help get them to calm down. If you can bare it, only feed around your hand, or even out of your hand. She'll learn that she only gets fed if the hand is there. If this doesn't work (and it might not, depends how old she is) try this:
Using two people. While one has their hand in the tank, the other uses the fish net to keep the bad fish away. Catch it in the net if you can and hold it there while you work in the tank. If you can't catch it, keep it cornered, or in as little space as you can. My clowns fear the Almight Fish Net. My female was relentless, and taking small chunks out of my husbands hand, we had enough, and taught her to behave using the net. Now, they have anemones, and are too busy spawning to be bothered with even eating half the time.
Yes: Firefish Goby. Sorry I got the name wrong, Doug called it a fire fin. No big deal. I assumed that's what it was, just wanted to be sure.
Cyano: Well then that helps. We will get out our siphon, and clean that out with the magnetic glass cleaner, and suck it out as well. as for the powerheads.. initally the tank had a long green tube that comes with the JEBO. It has holes all along it, and the flow was so so. Cowboy hooked up both JEBO's and added on a high flow powerhead. (it is 'fan' shaped and can be aimed) One there was the higher water flow, things began to look bit by bit better. After looking at your full tank shot, it definitely looks like you guys need some more mid/lower level flow in the tank. You have great surface agitation from the filters, but there's not enough flow at the lower levels. I'd recommend a Koralia 1 or 2, possibly two of them, one on each "side" of the tank. Bow fronts can be tricky with flow, so you're going to need a little bit more than a standard tank of similar size would need.
The shroom is still really unhappy, and at your suggestions, tonight we took out the anemone. Probably a good idea.
Cowboy said that the carbon has been running since we got it. So Doug had it in there for some time, and we have to sak him how llong he had it in there. But there is NOW a new carbon pouch in the JEBO. Carbon, with exception of Chemi Pure and Chemi Pure Elite, only is effective for about two weeks, then it needs to be changed. Chemi Pure claims to last 3-6 months, I change every 2.
I will look over the recommend threads for sure. I have been awaiting their return with (ha ha) 'baited breath'. Unfortunately we've been having some upgrading clitches on this site as of late, hopefully they get worked out in a timely matter.
to nikeSB:
Thank you as well! We'llnot get another tang now. -chuckle- And I will have to get a better corner picture where the Cyano is, as it's now turning a dark mucky brown color. (hence the need to now for sure siphon it out)
I definitely recommend more powerheads.
Siphon out as much of that cyano as you can. It's not terrible, and where it's forming really looks like it's in areas that are not recieving enough flow.
Cut feeding back even more for the time being. You only have three small fish. Half a cube daily is enough. But do start feeding them better food. You might also want to look into Boyd's VitaChem vitamins to soak the food in before feeding. Healthy fish = Happy fish.
I think you're going to enjoy it here!

 

[garou]

thank you both again!
all the suggestions are helping us for sure.
The Anemone, removed, did indeed die. So thank you for that help. Depressing over the loss, but, moving forward and getting this done right now, so we don't continue to loose these lovely critters.
The filter is not the best, but your right, for now, it's gonna just do (or rather THEY are, since theres 2 in use).
And the LFS owner, your right, with the economy, could indeed be fibbin to us. Tho shes smarter than the local chain pet stores here. Still, the help here has, even in the short time, better. So thank you all.
What should I look for/do since theres more than likely this "mini cycle" going on? (Point out any other messages that you think answer as well if you desire) I keep looking for those pinned messages to get active, so I feel silly re-asking questions that have answers.
-chuckles- NO worrys on weather the tangs are not ideal. We want ideal for the tank. Are the Angel and Flameback you mention viable in a reef tank tha has corals? We are hoping that once we get this flow issue fixed, we can add at least some legit corals in. No more anemones, least till we can get this right. And if not this tank then in another when we are able. (Going to move slower now with the tank).
Food: before the tank took a (ha ha >.<) 'dive', we also fed Mysis, Cyclops, Reef Plankton, Rotifers, Krill, and 'Marine Cuisine'. We cut it back to the brine. When the amonia rose up, Cowboy changed out 5 gal of the water, and then 2 days later another 5. We droped to no feeding for 3 days, then started with the 1/2 a brine cube for the past week (2 times a day). We can easily change to the mysis, and cut the feedings to less than 1/2 no problem. (ideas and suggestions here are wanted). We -know- we overfed now. and tho everything for 3 weeks looked amazing and happy as a rainbow, it took the dump just as fast. So we are very willing to hear from everyone just what is the best way to feed and exactly what.
No more crabs, sounds very do-able. Snails will be got. And thank you very much for the list. I will write that down on my 'what we need' list. More flow, snails, etc. Thank you!
We can call the LFS and see if she will trade or purchase the damsel. She's said she could with fry (if we were to have some). And thank you for your clow fish suggestions, we're gonna have to try them so she gets off her 'I'm bigger than you! you human hand you!' -chompchompchomp-
I agree, the flow in the tank is weird. Its like a 1/3 of a pie. Curved where the crust is, and sliced on the sides/back sharply. I suggested PVC, with those 'fan-like' heads. But what your suggesting is that the flow needs to go 'down' the side (top to bottom), not JUST across the top. Would the PVC, with the 'fans' down it from the top of the tank to the bottom be a good idea? I was thinking: one pipe across the top, and then L shape it down the left side. This way the intake would draw the flow towards it off the bow. Least I assume so. >.<
Should we keep carbon in the filter? I've read NOT to, and also TO do that, I'm pretty darned confused on that.
---

1/2 a cube daily on the food, we can do. We can even cut that into 1/4's if necessary. (to feed 2 times a day). Vitamins can be got. And we have been looking at more flow and for sure powerheads. This just emphasizes the need, so thank you (and thank you nike SB).
More questions:
When we clean the bacteria out, should we remove the rocks? Cleaning under what is there? I have this red hot desire to mix the sand up, and clean it like you would a fresh water tank. I was told that is a NONO. However theres a soft green tint within the sand that you can see from the front of the tank. Not ATOP it, but within it. As if you were looking in on an ant farm, so you can see that theres small thin lines within the strata and its all green. When I see pictures of other tanks, none have that look.
Should we also remove old snail and crab shells? (hermit shells).
The rock currently is just setting atop one another. They are not solid, but we are able to move it all around. Cowboy has not moved the base rock, only the upper rock. Should we stabelize that? And if so, what would be the best thing to use to do that?
I appologise for sounding like a dummy, and I have been reading many of the posts, but none have answered these off the wall questions I have. And with all the stuff in the sand, or on the rocks I have this desire to scrub and clean it all. lol. But I have been good, and waited, asked, and now asking more and looking up on this and other Message Boards how to care for this little environment. It was also established, so I wasn't clear if we could move things around and how far to go in cleaning it all up.
Thank you again for your time. I will be sure to keep asking, and as well keep you all up to date on whats going on with it. I know this weekend we were looking to upgrade the flow/powerheads. So with the help you all give, we'll get her nice and happy!

 

[btldreef]

Glad to hear that the anemone issue was addressed before it became an issue in the tank.
The filters, together, are fine, and should be for quite some time. I would add new carbon to them. I prefer Chemi Pure Elite, but any activated carbon fir a marine tank is fine. There are some people out there that believe that running carbon can cause Head and Lateral Line Erosion (HLLE) in fish, specifically in tangs. I do not find this to be very true in my own experience. I actually will not run any tank, especially a reef, without carbon. In my 155, I have carbon running in a bag in the sump, in a carbon reactor AND in my Fluval (used for extra flow and media storage). This tank currently houses 3 juvenile/young adult tangs. All of them are very healthy, happy fish. I've even nursed a Sailfin Tang back to health in the same tank and it grew very quickly with no signs of HLLE ever. In my opinion, the benefits of carbon far out weigh the risks.
If your tests are reading good (0ppm ammonia and nitrite and minimal nitrate) you're mini cycle that occurred from the move is probably over. To be sure, keep up on testing and water changes. I prefer weekly water changes of 10-20%. To be safe, do not add any other fish for about a month.
Yes, both dwarf angels I suggested are considered reef safe. The dwarf angels that are considered the safest are: Coral Beauty, Flame Angel, African Flameback, Cherub. That being said, there is always a risk with any angelfish, but most people don't experience many issues with these, especially the CB and Flameback. There us always a risk with any fish, I've even had a clown fish that ate coral!
I'd also do a pair of Skunk Cleaner Shrimp, don't remember if I mentioned that earlier...
I think the PVC idea would cause too many micro bubbles with arenot good for fish. I'd stick with the more conventional powerheads like the Koralia or Tunze. If you can spend the extra money, the EcoTech VorTech MP 10 and MP40 are width their weight in gold. U would place one powerhead on each side of your "pie slice" placed as centered as possible and aimed diagonally down and towards the front glass. Every tank is different, so it will take some time to find exactlythe right spot for each. You may even find that you need a third because of the shape, but with your two filters and the good surface agitation the are providing, I would start with 2.
1/4 a cube twice a day would be good. Go back to Mysis shrimp. Stop the krill and other stuff. Add 1/2 a cube of either rotifers, cyclops or reef plankton once a week for the corals in place of one meal, the fish will eat some as well. Use the krill and brine as a treat, sparingly. I actually would nor use the rotifers, plankton or cyclops until the red slime situation subsides more, otherwise, these things will just feed it.
I don't think removing the rock is necessary at this point, it might kick up a lot of detritus. If you want to move to rocks, do a large water change afterwards. If you want to scrub the rocks, do so in saltwater, not fresh anchor in the tank.
Do not stir the sand bed. The Nassarius snails I suggested will keep it safely stirred. If you stir it, you will cause an ammonia spike. The "ant farm" look you're seeing is good, you're sand is alive. Mine looks similar, I'll post a pic tomorrow o ce I'm home and the lights are on.

 

[sweatervest13]

I don't have any different suggestions then the other but wanted to say welcome and Good Luck with getting things straight. The willingness to correct things is sometimes half the battle.

 

[garou]

We would not have known the anemone's demise would have casued toxic issues, so thank you.
I've been taking literal notes. Thank you all for the advice.
We're going to get the better testers, and we sure did not know about the water change notion. We were told once a month change it, if that. I noticed that the salt content keeps lowering (the reading). It is within correct parameters: it's 1.024 currently. but we had it up to: 1.025/.026, just last night. Could he filters be removeing the salt? And, more so, from all my reading: Corals like higher salt. It's the reason we have continued to keep it up at 1.026.
I wrote down all the CUC and the shrimp now, and the fish suggestions as well. Thank ya!
I found the test kits here on SWF, they are very do-able. And I found the Koralia. Would the 240 of that item (https://www.saltwaterfish.com/Hydor-Koralia-240_p_3287.html) be acceptable?
And we can and will cut back on the food stuff.
Tho another question I have on 'food'. What is your take (and others please) on seaweed salad. It is green marine algae, and like the dried nori paper used in sushi dishes, but for fish. We were told to feed the fish it on a suction cup clip.
--------------other questions we have thought on:
Is distilled water ok to use?
Should we use the sea water the LFS owner keeps on hand, (she keeps it in large moving containers. and we are only 2 hrs from the Pacific) or should we 'make our own'?
After the month or two of letting the tank become stable, when it is are any of these fish advisable to get?
6 line wrasse
Hawkfish
2nd clown
The blue hippo tang/'dory', and Yellow tang are not good for the tank.. why? Knowing would help in our choices later, and Doug had the hippo/'dory' in the tank initially. We do not have to have another, I am just wanting to learn.

 

[patti w]

i too bought a dory blue hippo and a yellow tang for our 55g. that tank is too small for those two fish. now i have to figure out what to do with them. i also saw some apstatia in your tank. also known as glass anenome. ive heard it stings some fish and coral. causes probs and takes over the tank. kill it while you can.

 

[garou]

Thank you both sweatervest and patti. We are more than willing to learn and listen! The only way to improve is to keep moving forward!
I am very happy that I ran across this forum, and for all the help that you members have given us.

 

[btldreef]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Garou http:///forum/thread/385497/any-suggetions#post_3381119
We would not have known the anemone's demise would have casued toxic issues, so thank you.
I've been taking literal notes. Thank you all for the advice.
We're going to get the better testers, and we sure did not know about the water change notion. We were told once a month change it, if that. I noticed that the salt content keeps lowering (the reading). It is within correct parameters: it's 1.024 currently. but we had it up to: 1.025/.026, just last night. Could he filters be removeing the salt? And, more so, from all my reading: Corals like higher salt. It's the reason we have continued to keep it up at 1.026. I like to keep my tanks at 1.025. It's the happy medium, there's room for error without things going bad quickly. How are you testing your specific gravity (salinity)? You're probably loosing salt due to what's called "salt creep", when the salt is crusting up on the top edges of the aquarium, etc.
I wrote down all the CUC and the shrimp now, and the fish suggestions as well. Thank ya! My pleasure
I found the test kits here on SWF, they are very do-able. And I found the Koralia. Would the 240 of that item (https://www.saltwaterfish.com/Hydor-Koralia-240_p_3287.html) be acceptable? I'd go with the 425 version. Possibly even one 425 and one a 550.
And we can and will cut back on the food stuff.
Tho another question I have on 'food'. What is your take (and others please) on seaweed salad. It is green marine algae, and like the dried nori paper used in sushi dishes, but for fish. We were told to feed the fish it on a suction cup clip. I haven't used Seaweed Salad, but I've used those macro algaes just by different brands. I prefer algae sheets in different varieties. The two brands I like the most are Ocean Nutrition and Julian Sprung's (made by Two Little Fishies). I much prefer the sheets over flakes and pellets.
--------------other questions we have thought on:
Is distilled water ok to use? Yes. Technically it's the best to use, but getting an RODI unit is really the most economical option in the long wrong. Air Water Ice make great units, so do Water General.
Should we use the sea water the LFS owner keeps on hand, (she keeps it in large moving containers. and we are only 2 hrs from the Pacific) or should we 'make our own'? I prefer to go the "make your own" route. This way you know exactly what water is being used and what salt, etc. Having your own supplies will help when you have a catastrophe and need fresh water ASAP, which undoubtedly happens to all of us at some point.
After the month or two of letting the tank become stable, when it is are any of these fish advisable to get?
6 line wrasse They're pretty, but many are aggressive. If you're absolutely set on having this fish, make it the last addition.
Hawkfish What type? Many are not compatible with shrimp
2nd clown it might actually help calm down your female. Make sure that you get a smaller clown than your female and make sure they're the same species.
The blue hippo tang/'dory', and Yellow tang are not good for the tank.. why? Knowing would help in our choices later, and Doug had the hippo/'dory' in the tank initially. We do not have to have another, I am just wanting to learn. Well, with the hippo tang, they get sick easily, especially in regards to marine ich. Tangs are open water swimmers, and even when they're young, they need tons of swimming room (6ft+ long tanks), or they'll just pace the tank and become stressed. They're also grazers, they need established tanks with established live rock so that they can graze at the filamentous algae throughout the day. This is their main diet, and they need it in order to have a healthy immune system. They also don't like unstable tanks. Even when purchasing a smaller one, they get stressed in the smaller tank and usually don't do well. It can also stunt their growth.

I'm sending you a PM about the powerheads.

 

[garou]

Well, it stay round 1.o24, Cowboy was trying to keep it at 1.026, and I don't see any salt build up at the top of the tank, or on the lid. I'm just thinking it's that the gallon he hadded, wasn't enough. And there are two testors we have for it, one on the ******** of the glass and the other is a hand held plastic thing. Sorry I didn't go look, I can for you tomorrow/later today for sure. (had to get up and it is at the low point, safe but not 1.025, and lol, I had to take the light off, and found that your right, there was salt -under- the light on the glass tank top. -facepalm-
I wrote down the version numbers, thank you. And got your message.
Knowing the seaweed is ok, that puts my mind at ease. We decided to feed it to the fish mon. wed. fri.
Okay, on the distilled water: we need to know for sure if over the counter DISTILLED, or REVERSE OSMOSIS is better?
Also: My parents have a hydrocolator (hi-drok-oh-lator). It removes everything from the water. Is useing THAT water appropriate?
I can ask them the name of the machine if you need to know it.
We'll be making our own water from now on. so knowing what we cn and can't use for SURE will really prevent any issues down the road on that part.
Fish:
The 6 line was for the bristle worms. they are big, and nasty and kept eating the remaining corals. (which were 2 and are now all ka-put) One just finsihed off the shroom, and others wrecked havoc on the polyps that were fine till they were found 3 days ago. Near when the whole mess blew up on us. >.<
Hawkfish I was curious about. We are honestly looking only for reef safe, and little to no tank critters eating upon one another. We realise it will happen some, but if the hawkfish is gonna be a pain, lets leave it out.
and the clown is a: tank raised false percula. Shes not happy we are cleaning off that bacteria. She liked hosting it. >.<
as for the info on the Hippo tang; Thank you. lol. I read that the tank was ok size wise, one place, and the LFS said they were ok, and of course we recieved the tank with it. So I really appreciate the input.
Friday we plan to get the test kit and power heads. And onthe weekend we will do the water change out. With some rock scrubbing to get the bacteria out.

 

[btldreef]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Garou http:///forum/thread/385497/any-suggetions#post_3381238
Well, it stay round 1.o24, Cowboy was trying to keep it at 1.026, and I don't see any salt build up at the top of the tank, or on the lid. I'm just thinking it's that the gallon he hadded, wasn't enough. And there are two testors we have for it, one on the ******** of the glass and the other is a hand held plastic thing. Sorry I didn't go look, I can for you tomorrow/later today for sure. (had to get up and it is at the low point, safe but not 1.025, and lol, I had to take the light off, and found that your right, there was salt -under- the light on the glass tank top. -facepalm- it's natural for that to occur and it will sneak up on you. It sounds like you're using swing arm hydrometers. Definitely look into getting a refractometer. This site sells them for around $50 and they're far more accurate. Swing arms are known to not read correctly. My swing arm is off my .07, which is a big deal, another one I have is off by .03. I've also had ones that worked for awhile and then just slowly started reading incorrectly.
I wrote down the version numbers, thank you. And got your message.
Knowing the seaweed is ok, that puts my mind at ease. We decided to feed it to the fish mon. wed. fri. IMO, that might be too much. You don't have that many algae consumers right now. I'd do no more than two days a week with the seaweed salad.
Okay, on the distilled water: we need to know for sure if over the counter DISTILLED, or REVERSE OSMOSIS is better? This is up for debate. I'd go with RO personally, from your own RO filters. If you do not have your own, then I'd go with bottled distilled.
Also: My parents have a hydrocolator (hi-drok-oh-lator). It removes everything from the water. Is useing THAT water appropriate?
I can ask them the name of the machine if you need to know it. Honestly, I have no idea what that is, LOL. I'll have to look it up. I'm going to assume that it's a water purifying system for home use. If that's the case, I'm not a super huge fan of them for aquarium use.
We'll be making our own water from now on. so knowing what we cn and can't use for SURE will really prevent any issues down the road on that part.
Fish:
The 6 line was for the bristle worms. they are big, and nasty and kept eating the remaining corals. (which were 2 and are now all ka-put) One just finsihed off the shroom, and others wrecked havoc on the polyps that were fine till they were found 3 days ago. Near when the whole mess blew up on us. >.< Bristle worms should not be eating corals. Have you seen them do this? go here: http://www.lionfishlair.com/hitchhiker/hitchhiker.shtml and see if you can match up what you have with what you see in the tank. I know there's a lot of info out there that says how horrible bristle worms are and that they sting, etc, but the truth is that the common bristle worm (Eurythoe sp.) are great additions to the tank and the best members of a CUC. If you have common bristle worms, it's something else that is eating your corals. If you have a Fire worm (Hermodice caranculata), or a Bobbit Worm (Eunice aphroditois), then you have an issue, and the Six Line will do little to help with the problem.
Hawkfish I was curious about. We are honestly looking only for reef safe, and little to no tank critters eating upon one another. We realise it will happen some, but if the hawkfish is gonna be a pain, lets leave it out. It depends on the variety, some are okay, others are not. All hawkfish are a risk, but some are considered much safer than others. They are cool fish nonetheless.
and the clown is a: tank raised false percula. Shes not happy we are cleaning off that bacteria. She liked hosting it. >.< A false percula is an Ocellaris Clown (Amphiprion ocellaris). She'll get over and find something else, LOL
as for the info on the Hippo tang; Thank you. lol. I read that the tank was ok size wise, one place, and the LFS said they were ok, and of course we recieved the tank with it. So I really appreciate the input. There's some really poor info out there about these guys :-( The movie "Find Nemo" has done nothing to help this fish either. Everyone wants "Dory," and not many realize that Dory is not that easy to keep.
Friday we plan to get the test kit and power heads. And onthe weekend we will do the water change out. With some rock scrubbing to get the bacteria out. Sounds good, Scrub the rocks in the water change water.

 

[monsinour]

I agree about the power heads. I have a 56 coloumn style tank with 2x of the 240's in there. While it works, I wish I would have gone just a tad larger on the heads. Definatly think about switching out your filters for something else. Either a canister ( i dont recomend ) or a sump/fuge ( i do recomend ) to replace those HOB units. Both options will increase flow in the DT and make life better for your inhabitants. I also agree on the Chemi-pure carbon. Its what I use in my sump. I have them replaced on a rotating schedule and its time for me to get some more. Of to the web to place my order.
As far as information, reading on this forum is where I acquired the majority of my info. Keep asking those questions as just about everyone here wants to help.

 

[garou]

Yes on the 2 swing arms for the salt content. We are going to get the refractometer. thank you.
I have yet to re-feed them the seaweed, so can do it fri. However the 3 in there seem un interested in it. The tangs were the piggys on it.
We'll get the RO from the grocer till we can afford a system to make our own.
The hydrocolator, now it has an RO system that attaches to it. You pump the water thru that, then into the machine where it steams it, and then that steam collects in the basin. It holds something like 20 gal of purified water. It extracts everything from the water. I was told that it even removes the oxygen from it. So that it makes it Bad water for fresh tanks. Now I just looked up Hydrocollator, and I apparently and clearly got the whole thing wrong. we used that item when we did massage >.> However, I did happen to recall now, it is a Distiller. So not the small steam heated bags you use to relax muscles, but a Steam Distiller. Now I feel like a goof. But all in all would the Distilled be acceptable?? Cause we could hook that up and get the water from there.
I looked up the worms on the linked site. They are usual Bristleworms. Cowboy said it was just eatign the dead shroom, so, it was doing its job. Tho knowing they are like 'maggots' of the water is sorta icky. (Maggots eat up refuse as well. Both are needed just meh.
we'll leave out the wrasse, and the hawkfish, tho get a smaller clown when we're ready, month or two. We want to get the turboheads, and testers, then the CUC, and the supplys to change out the water as well as an appropriate QT tank. For now I'll be looking over different fish, ask more questions, and learn more!
thank you for the info on the Hippo. That makes WAY more sense. And we for sure are gonna get that bacteria outa the tank this weekend.
-----
With the link you gave me I did discover that we happen to have picked up a tube snail or two. Theres thin strands like spider webs they loose into the current. IF I can get a picture, I will. but its tiny and the camera only presses so close. lol
Monsinour, thank you so much for your input. I've been keeping notes so will add your suggestion to them.
Cowboy still thinks theres plenty of movement in the water, but we will get the powerheads. lol. Things in the tank are finally setteling down. The water is clearer, and the fish are calmer. The small CUC we have are at work, and cleaning nicely. I'll post up a shot tomorrow/later.
I got to look through and read the 101 post, and will be printing it out ASAP to have on hand.
I have more questions, this time on CUC and then on fish, and on then on tank temp.
for CUC; are 'peppermint shrimp' ok, and are nudibranch ok? (gonna put them on my 'what to get for CUC' list)
now for fish:
Hamet, Anthias, Basslet, and Blenny. I've been looking them over and reading what I have found, but via experience, are any of them acceptable to a reef tank? And more specificaly, knowing what we have currently, our tank?
I was also interested in corals, and would really love some suggestions on those as well please.
Or if theres a suggestin list, that would be awesome too!
We will NOT be adding things as fast this time, and will be cautious this time as well. I'm really likeing my tank again, and want that to continue. So first clean up, and CUC. A month wait or more, then new fish additions after a nice QT. Corals will be a few monts if not longer from now. We just want to be prepaired and know what to do ahead of time. Yey!
Last thing: Here where we live, the tank in the AM is about 77-78 degrees. However round 2-3 in the early eve, it rises to 80.5 or so. nothing over 80.7 tho. That is most certanly within the parameters listed and talked on all over. Thing is, is this safe for the fish? for it is a 2 degree jump. Would lowering it to 75 be a smart thing? then it will only rise to 77-78. It's just starting to get hot for us humans, and will get into the 100's in the summer outside, so I need to figure this out before -that- happens, and we find we literally made fish stew casue the exterior house temp got up to 110. (ug).

 

[garou]

Well, the temp outside the tank in the house (till we poped the AC on) was 81, and the digital thermometer was showing the same. We are gonna get an internal thermometer for sure.
I turned off the lights, open the lid, and turned the heater down another degree or two. 76 clearly is still too high. This is however teaching me, I will (IF we do it) need a chiller for a seahorse tank (IF we do it).
so the list for shoping is:
thermometer
test kit
powerheads
turkey baster
And CUC.