Anyone use an auto shut off for their return pump?

phoenix73

phoenix73

Member
My wife is asking me how I am going to guarantee that if there is a problem with my PVC overflow, I will not flood the house.
I am looking at adding one of the Little Giant piggy back pump shut offs to the return pump.
Converts any manual pump, up through 1/2 HP (10 max. run amps), to automatic. When mounted to 5-MSP or 6-CIM-R pump, "on" level range is 6" - 9" (15.2cm - 22.8cm), "off" level range is 1" - 4" (2.54cm - 10.2cm).
It is around $30 and looks like it could be a good emergency backup. You basically plug the return pump into the shut off.
I did a search for this and couldn't find anyone using one on here.
Thanks
 
salty blues

salty blues

Active Member
Originally Posted by phoenix73
http:///forum/post/3038903
My wife is asking me how I am going to guarantee that if there is a problem with my PVC overflow, I will not flood the house.
I am looking at adding one of the Little Giant piggy back pump shut offs to the return pump.
Converts any manual pump, up through 1/2 HP (10 max. run amps), to automatic. When mounted to 5-MSP or 6-CIM-R pump, "on" level range is 6" - 9" (15.2cm - 22.8cm), "off" level range is 1" - 4" (2.54cm - 10.2cm).
It is around $30 and looks like it could be a good emergency backup. You basically plug the return pump into the shut off.
I did a search for this and couldn't find anyone using one on here.
Thanks
I use to worry about floods too, 'till I drilled my tank. You might want to consider that route.
 
todj2002

todj2002

Member
have ur return pump set up high or in an alone chamber where it can only pump a few gallons back before it runs out of water. worse case u burn up ur pump but wont flood ur house.
 
S

shrimpy brains

Guest
Been thinking about this myself, as am setting up a new tank with refuge. Found lots of float valves that will turn on small pump for auto top off and such. I've only found one(which I will most likely get) it's on that auction site. It has a floating sensor connected to an outlet that will shut off when the water level gets too low. It's $65 and I've been searching for something a little cheaper. But it would definitely be worth the peice of mind, to not overflow tank and not burn out pump!! Hope this helps.
 
scsinet

scsinet

Active Member
The problem isn't the return pump. You generally don't want enough water in your sump to begin with that the tank would overflow if the overflows stopped working.
What you need to be concerned about is uncontrolled siphoning from the main tank should the main pump fail.
A float switch on the pump really isn't gonna afford you any protection except from pump burnout.
 
S

shrimpy brains

Guest
Good point SCSI, and I have the utmost respsect for your expertise. So don't take offense, heres the way I see it.
If the overflows get clogged up or the waterline goes to low, there will be no overflow there. Then the problem(as SCSI stated) is reverse siphon to pump.
To take care of that, just drill a small hole in return line just below the water surface. (that will let air in line and break siphon,pretty sure I learned that one from SCSI) So, now ther should be no problem with overflow from refuge. Hopefully, you don't have enough water in your return pump section to overflow your tank, but if you do, or if you have an auto top off feeding your refuge(and you are away) there is a chance that return pump could send to much water to DT, thus oveflowing it.
So, a float valve that will shut off your return pump, could prevent an overflow problem, in addition to saving you pump form burn out. JMHO
 
scsinet

scsinet

Active Member
Originally Posted by Shrimpy Brains
http:///forum/post/3039316
if you have an auto top off feeding your refuge(and you are away) there is a chance that return pump could send to much water to DT, thus oveflowing it.
So, a float valve that will shut off your return pump, could prevent an overflow problem, in addition to saving you pump form burn out. JMHO

I can still see a flood scenario here.
Okay... automatic top-off attached to sump... pump has float switch to shut it off in low water.
Overflow clogs up. Pump stops when the flow switch detects low water in sump.
ATO kicks on, fills the sump back up. Pump comes back on, dumping that "load" of water into the tank. Pump shuts back off...
ATO kicks on, fills sump back up...
Again, the problem is not the return pump, in this case, it would be the ATO.
One might think that the way around this would be to put the float switch for the ATO in the tank, but you can't, becuase in and overflow/sump setup, the water level fluctuates in the sump, not the tank.
Ultimately, there is no way of completely preventing a flood. However, you can mitigate it by using siphon breaks as shrimpy suggested, and ensuring that your sump (and ATO reservoir if you use one) does not contain enough water to completely overflow the tank. This negates the need of a float switch for the pump.
Whatever you do, you should TEST your different failure scenarios. Test pulling the plug to the tank. Test breaking the siphon in the overflow... make sure everything works as intended before you leave the tank alone.
 
S

shrimpy brains

Guest
Drat!! He fooled all my wonderful plan!

OP, seems the only thing left is to go to SCSI's 180 tank build thread. Check out the basin he built in lower of stand to catch overflow, if it happens.
 
phoenix73

phoenix73

Member
my logic was a little flawed. I see what I need to do now. Although I think that the best solution may be to have a backup overflow anyway.
Thanks!!
 
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