darthtang aw
Active Member
To the aftermath of the result of the "Arab Summer" in the middle east. Things are about to get volatile.
are you paying attention?
- Thread starter darthtang aw
- Start date
snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
More information?
I don't keep up with the news. It's hard enough paying the bills and putting gas in my tank every week without having to worry about foreign affairs.
So, should we be looking at another war? Higher gas prices? Some officials put in jail? what?
Should I be stocking up on food and water and searching for a nearby cave?
I don't keep up with the news. It's hard enough paying the bills and putting gas in my tank every week without having to worry about foreign affairs.
So, should we be looking at another war? Higher gas prices? Some officials put in jail? what?
Should I be stocking up on food and water and searching for a nearby cave?
mantisman51
Active Member
Like most liberal ideas, it has failed. But the results don't matter, just the warm and fuzzy feeling liberals get from knowing they tried. Let's break it down, however, because I think it deserves more than a snarky response. Obama helped depose Muslim leaders friendly to the U.S. and helped install Islamist governments hostile to the U.S. and Israel. The supposed atrocities of these "dictators" has been far surpassed by their "Arab Spring" counterparts-such as the near-daily slaughter of Christians in Egypt and the killing and expulsion of Christian and Jews in Morocco and Tunisia and the tribal retribution killings in Libya. But just because Obama helped topple the former governments and is supporting (with our tax dollars) those in power now doing all the killing, we can't blame him...right?
darthtang aw
Active Member
Actually, the killing of a few christians is not my major global concern. I know that sounds callous...but in the grand scheme of what is going on, it is small potatoes.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/24/us-egypt-israel-idUSBRE83N17W20120424
I also read another article about the natural gas treaty being suspended...
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/24/us-egypt-israel-idUSBRE83N17W20120424
I also read another article about the natural gas treaty being suspended...
mantisman51
Active Member
I agree, however, it is symptomatic of radicals running the country. That means they will be supporting anti-American and anti-Israeli groups. That does matter. The rats we have killed and driven out of Iraq and Afghanistan will now scurry to these new sponsor countries.
jerthunter
Active Member
Wait wait... are you saying the the middle east has been turned into a volatile region? Oh my goodness, I cannot believe what I am hearing. When I was there durning my time in the service it was like disney world, a place of joy and happiness where arabs and jews walked hand in hand down streets lined with sugar plums. It was so peaceful I don't even know why we went there, maybe they were rewarding us by sending us to the happiest place on earth. And now Obama comes in and single handedly creates this hatred between arabs, jews, and christians.
reefraff
Active Member
0bama actively participated in the ouster of a government that was a ally in the war on terror and another who at least was no longer openly supporting terrorists and did nothing when the same opportunity was presented in a country that is a state sponsor of terror. But you go ahead and keep your head in the magic kingdom......
jerthunter
Active Member
So you are upset that we got involved in Libya but not Syria?
mantisman51
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerthunter http:///t/391454/are-you-paying-attention#post_3471787
Wait wait... are you saying the the middle east has been turned into a volatile region? Oh my goodness, I cannot believe what I am hearing. When I was there durning my time in the service it was like disney world, a place of joy and happiness where arabs and jews walked hand in hand down streets lined with sugar plums. It was so peaceful I don't even know why we went there, maybe they were rewarding us by sending us to the happiest place on earth. And now Obama comes in and single handedly creates this hatred between arabs, jews, and christians.
Nice slight-of-hand. We had America friendly leaders in the 3 countries I mentioned. And they were relatively safe for Jews and Christians. Now they are controlled by Islamists who subscribe to Wahibi Islam and jihad, who Obama supported AND the Muslim Brotherhood left town a couple weeks ago with a billion and a half of my (and yours) tax dollars. The same Muslim Brotherhood who was banned in Egypt when Mubarak ran the joint and the same Muslim Brotherhood who has called for jihad against us and ending the peace treaty with Israel. Your blind loyalty to the democrats, any democrat, is an example of what's wrong with this country. Bush spent like a drunk sailor and ran up the debt and the democrats(rightly) condemned him for it. The solution by Obama? Spend 4x more and run up the debt further and then blame Bush and the democrats(like you) think it's great. Same thing with the Middle East. More enemies in power and more turmoil makes things better? How about you start thinking about our country first and your party second?
Originally Posted by Jerthunter http:///t/391454/are-you-paying-attention#post_3471787
Wait wait... are you saying the the middle east has been turned into a volatile region? Oh my goodness, I cannot believe what I am hearing. When I was there durning my time in the service it was like disney world, a place of joy and happiness where arabs and jews walked hand in hand down streets lined with sugar plums. It was so peaceful I don't even know why we went there, maybe they were rewarding us by sending us to the happiest place on earth. And now Obama comes in and single handedly creates this hatred between arabs, jews, and christians.
Nice slight-of-hand. We had America friendly leaders in the 3 countries I mentioned. And they were relatively safe for Jews and Christians. Now they are controlled by Islamists who subscribe to Wahibi Islam and jihad, who Obama supported AND the Muslim Brotherhood left town a couple weeks ago with a billion and a half of my (and yours) tax dollars. The same Muslim Brotherhood who was banned in Egypt when Mubarak ran the joint and the same Muslim Brotherhood who has called for jihad against us and ending the peace treaty with Israel. Your blind loyalty to the democrats, any democrat, is an example of what's wrong with this country. Bush spent like a drunk sailor and ran up the debt and the democrats(rightly) condemned him for it. The solution by Obama? Spend 4x more and run up the debt further and then blame Bush and the democrats(like you) think it's great. Same thing with the Middle East. More enemies in power and more turmoil makes things better? How about you start thinking about our country first and your party second?
jerthunter
Active Member
If yyou keep telling me I am an Obama supporter I may believe you and vote for him.
Blaming Obama for the turmoil in the middle east is ridiculous, it has always been a volatile area.
So what three countries are you referring to that had America friendly leaders? Egypt is one, and Obama asked him to step down AFTER it was apparent he was on his way out anyways.
Same guy in still king of Morocco, so you must think Tunisia and Libya were close American allies huh?
Blaming Obama for the turmoil in the middle east is ridiculous, it has always been a volatile area.
So what three countries are you referring to that had America friendly leaders? Egypt is one, and Obama asked him to step down AFTER it was apparent he was on his way out anyways.
Same guy in still king of Morocco, so you must think Tunisia and Libya were close American allies huh?
ironeagle2006
Active Member
The Old President of Eygpt may have had Issues but Compared to the BS the Leadership of Syria has done for the LAST YEAR to their OWN people the Crap IRAN does to their OWN People he was decent to them. Yes he was a Jackoff at times BUT at least he does not have a City under SIEGE for a YEAR killed THOUSANDS of WOMEN AND CHILDERN buried them in Mass Graves. In Iran they are wanting to Kill Someone that had the Guts to Change his Religon do we do that here. Eygpt has gone BACKWARDS now they are Killing people for Refusing to become Muslims. Women are being STONED for not wearing Burkas in Public. What did we do help the Taliban take over Egypt it Seems.
reefraff
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerthunter http:///t/391454/are-you-paying-attention#post_3471798
So you are upset that we got involved in Libya but not Syria?
Egypt and Libya. Neither were causing trouble but we got involved. Syria is Iran's right hand stooge in aiding terrorists and we don't try to force them out? Egypt is a major player in keeping the Israel/Palestinian "stable", Odds that the new regime will be willing to continue in that direction are slim to none
Originally Posted by Jerthunter http:///t/391454/are-you-paying-attention#post_3471798
So you are upset that we got involved in Libya but not Syria?
Egypt and Libya. Neither were causing trouble but we got involved. Syria is Iran's right hand stooge in aiding terrorists and we don't try to force them out? Egypt is a major player in keeping the Israel/Palestinian "stable", Odds that the new regime will be willing to continue in that direction are slim to none
mantisman51
Active Member
In Morocco the king had to accept a power-sharing deal with radicals, much like the Saudis have for 40 years. Before this the king kept radicals out. This line of reasoning reminds me of the American left claiming communist takeovers in small countries really weren't an issue for the U.S. But as Venezuela and Ecuador have proved, small nations fueled by communism or Afghanistan and Pakistan fueled by radical Islam can and do pose a serious threat to the U.S. and our allies. Another great example of a president screwing an ally then allowing the country to be taken over is Bush with Musharaf and Bush with Chavez. In Venezuela the army had deposed Chavez and Bush threatened to embargo the country if Chavez wasn't returned to power. Now he is the biggest threat to the U.S. in the Western Hemisphere. So it goes both ways, but I think the Islamist threat is far greater than the communist threat...for now. And that is why I have focused on the 3 main failures of Obama.
p.s. Vote for whomever you think would be best. I never vote for whomever seems the most popular or photogenic.
p.s. Vote for whomever you think would be best. I never vote for whomever seems the most popular or photogenic.
mantisman51
Active Member
No, I don't think we should get involved in Syria for the same reason we shouldn't have got involved in the other revolutions. We don't know who is going to sweep in to take his place.
jerthunter
Active Member
I have no doubt that in many cases these revolutions have resulted in potentially worse individuals coming to power. I also know from history that many of America's worst enemies are individuals that had previously been friendly to us, who were given money, weapons, or technology to 'help' us out, and then later turned using our own resources agianst us.
This long pre-dates Obama as does the violence and conflict in the middle east.
With the exception of Libya and Syria, the US' involvement in the collapse of dictators has largely been very minor until it was apparent the dictator was on the way out anyways. Once is was clear the Mubarak wasn't going to stay in power we had little choice but to pretend that is what we wanted. The fact is once these governments were about to be toppled Russia, Iran, China, etc. were all looking to get involved and to try to shape the new government in a way that was most favorable to them. I do not believe it would have been in our best interest to sit on the sidelines and watch.
This long pre-dates Obama as does the violence and conflict in the middle east.
With the exception of Libya and Syria, the US' involvement in the collapse of dictators has largely been very minor until it was apparent the dictator was on the way out anyways. Once is was clear the Mubarak wasn't going to stay in power we had little choice but to pretend that is what we wanted. The fact is once these governments were about to be toppled Russia, Iran, China, etc. were all looking to get involved and to try to shape the new government in a way that was most favorable to them. I do not believe it would have been in our best interest to sit on the sidelines and watch.
darthtang aw
Active Member
I have no doubt that in many cases these revolutions have resulted in potentially worse individuals coming to power. I also know from history that many of America's worst enemies are individuals that had previously been friendly to us, who were given money, weapons, or technology to 'help' us out, and then later turned using our own resources agianst us.
This long pre-dates Obama as does the violence and conflict in the middle east.
With the exception of Libya and Syria, the US' involvement in the collapse of dictators has largely been very minor until it was apparent the dictator was on the way out anyways. Once is was clear the Mubarak wasn't going to stay in power we had little choice but to pretend that is what we wanted. The fact is once these governments were about to be toppled Russia, Iran, China, etc. were all looking to get involved and to try to shape the new government in a way that was most favorable to them. I do not believe it would have been in our best interest to sit on the sidelines and watch.
Had we done nothing, how might the outcome have differed?