Beth please help with my battle!

ca161406

Member
Well after a lot of thought I have decided to go through with a 10 week journey to heal all my fish. I was going to wait till my upgrade from 125 to 300 but the fish are looking worse. I added a PBT directly to my tank about a month ago introducing ick to my Rusty Angel, Saddle Clown, and Pink Tail Trigger. They have all fought off the ick except the PBT who is showing signs. Now my Clown and Trigger seem to have either a fungal or bacterial problem, which looks like a white film on them. I have two Green Spotted puffers that were converted from FW to SW and a Flame Hawk that have shown no signs of anything. All the fish are still active and eating and look very healthy other than the ick and fungal/bacterial problem.
My plan is to eradicate the ick in the tank by letting it sit for 10 weeks. And treat the fish with Cupramine in a QT.
Here are the questions!
1. SHOULD I treat all the fish with copper or just the ones who showed signs of the ick?
2. Will copper kill my Green Spotted Puffers? I know copper and puffers really shouldn't mix.
3. I have coral and inverts in my DT, can they carry the ick? If they can would the 10 weeks get rid of it?
4. Which fish in what tank with what meds?
-Powder Blue Tank- Ick
-Pink Tail Trigger- Fungal/ Bacterial(Had Ick)
-Rusty Angel- Fungal/ Bacterial(Had Ick)
-Saddle Clown- Fungal/ Bacterial(Had Ick)
-Flame Hawk- No signs of anything
-Green Spotted Puffer- No signs of anything
I have a 55QT and two 10QTs
Thanks to anyone who helps me along the way, I will be posting pictures for the (crappy) journey to health.
Hopefully after the 10 weeks they will be going into the upgraded tank instead of the 125.
 

florida joe

Well-Known Member
Obviously I am not Beth but my 2 cents
Treat all fish. If you are going to use copper do not add the puffer that fish is better served with hypo treatment.
While it is possible though unlikely for your coral and inverts to have the ick parasite on them in their reproductive stage keeping your tank fallow will brake the cycle.
Maracyn-Two for the bacterial infection
 

ca161406

Member
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/3196488
Obviously I am not Beth but my 2 cents
Treat all fish. If you are going to use copper do not add the puffer that fish is better served with hypo treatment.
While it is possible though unlikely for your coral and inverts to have the ick parasite on them in their reproductive stage keeping your tank fallow will brake the cycle.
Maracyn-Two for the bacterial infection
thanks for the reply
so hypo the puffers, and should i do copper on the clown hawk and angel after they bacterial/ fungal problem is gone?
so Maracyn2 over the Melifix?
 

florida joe

Well-Known Member
I like maracyn -Two any reason you do not want to hypo all your fish and are going to use copper instead ?
 

ca161406

Member
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/3196655
I like maracyn -Two any reason you do not want to hypo all your fish and are going to use copper instead ?
i hear with the seachem you have a range of 4 to work with. and now with hypo you have 1 ppt to stay in range? (correct me if im wrong)
and also my puffers are green spotted puffers i converted to SW two years ago and i really don't want to go back to brackish levels with them, yet i cant use the copper on them so im going to have to.
i did hypo once before on a humu and was successful, but i don't have time to check the SG 3+ times a day anymore
 

florida joe

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by ca161406
http:///forum/post/3196863
i hear with the seachem you have a range of 4 to work with. and now with hypo you have 1 ppt to stay in range? (correct me if im wrong)
and also my puffers are green spotted puffers i converted to SW two years ago and i really don't want to go back to brackish levels with them, yet i cant use the copper on them so im going to have to.
i did hypo once before on a humu and was successful, but i don't have time to check the SG 3+ times a day anymore
Copper and hypo kill ick as you know in two completely different ways, both need a certain level sustained in our tanks to be successful . There are to many variables involved IMO to give a stock answer as to a safe level beyond the accepted copper concentration or salinity level
 

beth

Administrator
Staff member
I wouldn't do copper on tangs, and I wouldn't do it on a new QT either. A well established QT will take a major biological hit from copper (not to mention the antibiotic you are considering). Are the QTs you mentioned well cycled?
Hypo should work well, and you only need a month, not 10 weeks. Ich will be gone from the display within 2-3 weeks.
Do you have a refractometer?
Can you post some good digital pictures of your sick fish with what you feel may be a bacterial infection?
You don't need to check water 3x a day for hypo. If you are getting a lot of evaporation in your QT, just leave tank lights off during the day, and check the salinity once a day. Nothing more is needed.
I'd start with hypo-ing all the fish. And get up the pics if you can. It is not unusual for fish with ich to develop a slime-coat film over their body (due to the irritation of the parasites), which could be mistaken for an infection.
 

florida joe

Well-Known Member
Ich will be gone from the display within 2-3 weeks.
I respectfully disagree with Beth on this.
I give you this scenario.
The day you remove your fish from your DT the ick parasite is in its free swimming stage fallen off your fish. Now it has 18hrs to settle on some substrate to reproduce. In its reproductive stage it can take up to 28 days to divided. Once again in its free swimming stage it has up to 48hrs to find a host or it will die. Add up the time line and you have approximately 30 days. That is IMO the minimum time you should leave your tank fallow
 

al mc

Active Member
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/3197347
I respectfully disagree with Beth on this.
I give you this scenario.
The day you remove your fish from your DT the ick parasite is in its free swimming stage fallen off your fish. Now it has 18hrs to settle on some substrate to reproduce. In its reproductive stage it can take up to 28 days to divided. Once again in its free swimming stage it has up to 48hrs to find a host or it will die. Add up the time line and you have approximately 30 days. That is IMO the minimum time you should leave your tank fallow
I try not to agree with Joe
but I have to support him on the length of a fallow DT here. I would minimally go 4 weeks and personally have gone with 6 weeks of a fallow tank to make sure the Ich was eradicated. Why go through all the trouble of the QT/hypo for 4 weeks and take a chance that the Ich returns when you put them back in the DT.
 

ca161406

Member
thank everyone for all the replies!
the qt tanks are non cycled but i have a 200g barrel of SW pre mixed and will be changing water daily if the specs are out of place.
i will be posting pics of everything including the set ups and dosing schedules
I have set up now a 20g long with a tetra 30 power filter that i moved my clown into over night. i decided to use the Melifix on it because i have stock piles of the stuff(i use it as a coral dip for new arrives). over night it seems that its cloudy eye and film have gone away.
i guess im going to go a head and use hypo. Beth i do have a refractometer. how long do i need to leave the water at 1.007-1.008?
ill get pics up either tomorrow or later tonight to make sure the bacteral/ fungal infection is not the slime coat you were talking about.
thanks again everyone!
 

beth

Administrator
Staff member
The specific gravity on the refractometer needs to be at 1/009, not lower or higher. Your refractometer likely measures salinity as well, this should be at 14ppt.
3 weeks in hypo starting to count after no spots are seen for a few days.
 

ca161406

Member
Heres the pics
PBT


you can see the Ick on its face and side. it isn't super bad but still its ick. the tang is still really active and colorful to my surprise
 

ca161406

Member
the best pic of the trigger i can get..its scared of the camera lol. but you can see the white gunk above its eye. its also on the right side a lil too

20g with clown. the clowns symptoms are 100% gone
 

ca161406

Member
what i was thinking to do next
A
-Add puffers to the tank with the clown, drop to hypo.
-Add hawk and angel to additional 20gal and drop to hypo.
-Add trigger and tang to 55gal dose melifix and drop to hypo.
or
B
-add puffers and hawk to tank with the clown, drop to hypo
-add trigger, angel, and tang to 55 dose melifix and drop to hypo.
which would you choose?
i think A would be better because it puts less of a load on the tanks especially the one with the tang, yet i would have to buy another 20gal set up.
thanks for any help!
 

beth

Administrator
Staff member
How big is the puffer? Not sure I'd want a puffer in with a clownfish.
 

garick

Member
Don't green spots eat pretty much anything in the tank with them? The last time I had gsp's they even ate an oscar which was 10x bigger than they were like sharks on a whale
 
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