Better Living Through Automation..ATO

[squidd]

My 210 FOWLR + 65 sump/fuge evaporates about 2-3 gallons a day...
My 54 Corner Reef + 65 sump/fuge evaps 2 gallons a day...
That's a lot of water to be pouring in each day (and makes leaving home for even a weekend kind of tough)...
And then to keep from having drastic salinity swings I had to top off a gallon or two in each tank in he morning and then again at night...
This was beginning to become a bit of an "inconvenience" for the basically laid back life style I strive for...(there's a conundrum...I work hard at being laid back )
The answer...ATO...I've looked at/tried a number of different systems, starting with a simple "drip", to gravity fed "float valves" to pressurized/pumped systems with a variety of complex float and pressure "switches", relays, etc...
The journey continues, but this is where I am today...
The reef was a pretty quick fix by going to a 24/7 kalk drip and a two gallon jug...The hard part here is to get the drip rate to match the evap rate, which varies from heat and humidity changes depending on the time of day/month/year...
I'm sure you've all seen my basement sump/fuge with blue drip jug...

 

[squidd]

Two gallons a day seems to work well with an extra gallon or so every two or three days to balance out the system...
But I still have to fill and carry a two gallon jug around daily...(more on this later)
The 210 is/was a bigger problem in that it needs a twice a day top off, part of that problem is that the rubber maid "sump" portion doesn't have enough volume to deal with more than a 5 gallon "swing" (more on this later as well, building new glass sump with overflow/skimmer/return pump baffle chambers)
In the meantime I tested the Kent "float valve" gravity fed from a 5 gallon bucket...

 

[squidd]

My "big fear/concern" with the "valve" is that if it stuck open it could flood the sump and lower the salinity...
So I ran it off the bucket for a few weeks noting that if it did stick the extra 5 gallons would not flood or change salinity to a drastic level...
I am fairly confident now that in a sump installation (no snails to jam the valve) and fresh water top off (no kalk or salt creep to clog valve) that the valve will work as designed...
So I ran a "supply line" off my RO filter to feed my 210 sump, my NSW mixing tub, and the 54 sump...
I should mention that I have an under sink RO with pressure tank and sink faucet, so it already has the "waste water" shut off solenoid and pressure switch for pump installed...(an "On Demand" system that shuts itself off/on when water is called for)
I ran a feeder line to the 210 sump and hooked it to the float valve...

 

[squidd]

Also installed a shut off valve for doing water changes...(when the sump level would change)...

 

[squidd]

So far (a couple weeks) the system has been working and the sump level doesn't change more than a 1/2" from marked line...

 

[squidd]

This weekend I plan on drilling a hole in the glass sump for my reef and installing a float valve there for RO top off...(will post pics of installed unit or my flooded basement, I'm doing it with the sump/fuge full..) :scared:
As calcium/alk levels are steady (I'm not pushing a super saturated mix), I'll probably cut back on kalk dripping and let the RO do most of the top off...Maybe some "supplements" as called for..Testing will Tell...
Stay tuned...

 

[mpls man]

Squidd, i just got done hooking up the same float system on my sump, works very well, keeps the water level at a constant level, i didn't think about putting a shut off valve on it though, i'll do that.:yes: Bang Guy has the same as well and has no complaints. post more ideas if you come up with any. on your kalk dripping tank, would this be necessary for a 75 gal, if so how did you make urs. thanks

 

[squidd]

That didn't take long at all...
Ten minutes with a dremal tool and diamond bit to drill a pilot hole...
Followed by 5 minutes work with a 1/2" glass drill, and a little touch up with the diamond bit to get a snug fit on the float valve...
Lowered the sump level to keep things dry...
Tape on inside tank to catch glass "dust"...
SLOW...on the drill bit to keep from building heat and "chatter" which can crack the tank...

 

[squidd]

A couple wraps of teflon tape on the nylon fittings will go a long way in preventing leaks under pressure...
And we're done...

 

[squidd]

For my next trick I'll be installing a "bucketless" Water change system...
For both tanks... :thinking:

 

[john bowell]

hey Squidd, help me out here, I am new to float valves and am running into many hours topping off my tank when I could be enjoying it instead. Where did you get your float valve/how much did it cost and does it just open up and let your RO water in from you kitchen unit? I have a kitchen unit as well with a line running to my basement and want to do the same.
Thanks!

 

[squidd]

If you have the 'kitchen" unit your half way there...
They usually come with a pressure solonoid to shut waste water off when the 'sink" faucet is closed...Other wise the RO unit would run constantly.
The float valves are "Kent" units and are around $15 -$18 thruogh an on-line LFS/vendor (someone who sells the RO units)...Can't mention any on this site, but if you look around I'm sure you'll find them...
They're usually used for filling a RO "storage" tub but work well in this application...

 

[john bowell]

Awesome...Thanks Squidd! I won't mention any retail online store that I bought it from but you get the "BIG" picture if you know what I mean. It cost me 15.99, a great deal.

 

[daceman89]

Originally posted by Squidd
For my next trick I'll be installing a "bucketless" Water change system...
For both tanks... :thinking:
how will you install a bucketless water change system and where will you mix the salt to use for water change

 

[daceman89]

Originally posted by Squidd
For my next trick I'll be installing a "bucketless" Water change system...
For both tanks... :thinking:
how will you install a bucketless water change system and where will you mix the salt to use for water change

 

[squidd]

Mixing "NSW" (new salt water) for WCs will be done in the NSW mixing tank...in basement...and filled by ATO system...
I still have to add salt and adjust for temp and salinity...
Then the plan is to pump it up from there..to each tank...
And at the same time pump "or" siphon out "old water" to drain line in an automated fashion... NO buckets..
The trick is to balance out the "inflow" of NSW and the draining of the old water to keep tank level stable and not activate the "top off" system...
As well as not draining "NSW" tub and damaging pump AND not "overdraining" tank and run short of replacement water...
:thinking:
Pumping up and NOT over filling the tank is easy...
Shutting down the pump when the NSW tub is low is easy...
Pump or siphon the Old water, drain is easy...
Not "overdraining" old water is easy...
"BALANCING" the Infill with the Drain "rate" is taking a bit of "experimenting" ... need to match pumps and flow rates to drain rates and adjust line sizes, etc...

 

[daceman89]

Originally posted by Squidd
Mixing "NSW" (new salt water) for WCs will be done in the NSW mixing tank...in basement...and filled by ATO system...
I still have to add salt and adjust for temp and salinity...
Then the plan is to pump it up from there..to each tank...
And at the same time pump "or" siphon out "old water" to drain line in an automated fashion... NO buckets..
The trick is to balance out the "inflow" of NSW and the draining of the old water to keep tank level stable and not activate the "top off" system...
As well as not draining "NSW" tub and damaging pump AND not "overdraining" tank and run short of replacement water...
:thinking:
Pumping up and NOT over filling the tank is easy...
Shutting down the pump when the NSW tub is low is easy...
Pump or siphon the Old water, drain is easy...
Not "overdraining" old water is easy...
"BALANCING" the Infill with the Drain "rate" is taking a bit of "experimenting" ... need to match pumps and flow rates to drain rates and adjust line sizes, etc...
I'm am going to upgrade to a 180 gallon tank and i need some help setting it up.I had a 80gallon reef on the first floor then we drilled to basement an ran 1" pvc piping feeding water into a 75 gallon gravity feed then then had overflo leading under tank into a sump with protein skimmer in it then out of protein through uv light back into sump out of sump through iwalki 55 feeding back upstairs. I'm getting ride of everything but i want to use a simila setup. My 180 will be upstairs and will gravity feed overflo down stairs.I'm going to buy the kalk reactor and calcium reactor from MRC and a litermeter3. also posted a tread to determine which protein skimmer i should get ETSS or MRC .Also i would like to know if I should go with Acrylic or Tub sump in basement and should i get a external Protein skimmer and would i need a refuge if i use Calcium Reactor with Co2 tank and ph monitor.
This is all the items i will need help with to set up in basement.
Sump
Protein Skimmer and need pump
Refuge (if needed)
Calcium Reactor
Co2 Tank
Co2 Regulator
Ph monitor
Nilsen Reactor
UV light
Iwalki Pump Feeding water back upstairs
Litermeter3
Rodi Top off
And bucketless Water Change setup if possible
Also let me know if i'm missing something.
Please draw me,send pic or explain to me how to set this up.
I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[squidd]

Sounds like it's going to be quite the set up...:yes:
I "could" draw you a picture, but it may not apply...
Ever hear the phrase "There's more than one way to skin a Cat"...
A lot of the "detail" in how the system is going to work (or be set up) is going to depend on the parts and pieces you get and what order you get them in...
You have quite a list there but still some variables that would change install "design"...Are you going to purchase ALL the pieces and set it up at one time or collect and add as the system "evolves"
Some of it will be "self evident" and fall into place ( this "has to" go here, because it feeds off of that) and some will be "choices" (this "could" go here or here or I could feed both of these or...)
As far as "tubs" and tanks are concerned I like glass...I like the "control" I have in sizing, baffleing, and strength...I "tried" the "Rubber Maid" route on my 210 sump, and it "works" it's "OK" but I look at it and know I could build it more effecitve and a better layout than "what you can find" on the shelf...
Skimmers.. I'm a fan of Euro Reef...Hands down...
A calcium reactor would not "negate" the need for a refugium They serve two different purposes...(unless your thinking pH control via RDP) I have mine setup as an "Algal Scrubber" for the "export" of nutrients through harvesting of excess growth...
I don't see anything that covers "chemical" filtration (running carbon, phosphate removal etc..) on your list.
HTH

 

[daceman89]

i'm getting a fluidize chamber but don't know where i should use phos or carb.

 

[pas13]

Hi Squidd-
Can you tell me how you did the blue jug with the float valve that you showed in the first picture or point me to a previous link where you explained it? Thanks.
BTW- let me just say that I think it is awsome all the help you give to people on this site! I feel like I should send you a tuition check after reading your posts. (I hope that my sucking up working because I anticipate needing your help with a sump in the very near future. )