Can ich become resistant to hypo if sg is brought down slowly

[jshepherd]

I have had a powder blue in a 30g qt since 6/12. I kept him in with rocks for 2 weeks but decided that it is probably best to hypo just in case. When I removed the rocks out to do hypo he instantly showed signs of ick all over from stress I assume.
I proceeded to lower sg to hypo but with being busy it took 3-4 days if I recall.
He has been eating fine and has shown no signs of ich since hypo which has been 6 weeks now. I do recall it may have gotten to 1.010 when we had a bad lightning strike and was very busy repairing damaged computers etc. which was 4 weeks ago. I have since kept it at 1.008-1.009. I have been bringing him out of hypo for 4 days now and it is at 1.020 so far.
Is he safe to go in the DT or should I now also do cupramine? I read somehere that ich can adapt to low sg so if this is true then I have solved nothing.

 

[al mc]

While it is possible that some of the Ich survived the slowly lowered hyposalinity treatment, it is unlikely. I have had only one failure of hyposalinity personally (and I hypo all new fish in a QT/HT). I do not know if the Ich was resistent or I let the salinity levels rise by not topping off frequently enough...It was a Hippo Tang that I did successfully treat with
Cupramine. This particular fish showed recurrence of Ich about 4 days after I brought the QT salinity back to 1.026.
Leave him in the Qt for another few days. Look at him with a magnifying glass. If you see no parasites IMHO it would be safe to put him in your DT.
Almost forgot.....Did he come to you with Ich or did it develop signs in your DT? If you had him in your DT then all the fish need to be treated and the DT left fishless for about 6 weeks.

 

[jshepherd]

Thanks for the reply.
He came to my from the lfs looking fine but I was smart enough to know better with a pb tang. Nothing has seen the DT without being in the QT except my first blenny but he was in there alone for a month before anything else was put in.
I must say that is was crazy how fast the ich showed up when i spooked him pulling the rock out. I then put the rock in a tuperware tube with no fish since week 2 so it should be safe now as well.
I am almost afraid to admidt it but I have tried to scare him by moving things and removing some of the pvc tubes etc. to see if the stress will show up but so far so good.
I really cannot wait for him to go to the 150g dt where he will be much happier.
Here is the thread with a pic of him in the qt before I pulled the rock.
https://forums.saltwaterfish.com/t/323952/powder-blue-tang

 

[beth]

How long has it been since you have seen ich, and what are you using to measure salinity?

 

[jshepherd]

It has been well over a month since I have seen anything. I have one of those $50 refract. The line is not as sharp as I would like and when getting this close I tried to lean towards 1.008.
sg is at 1.023 today so tomorrow the last change should put it at 1.025. It takes some playing around to know how much to change, I cannot believe how much water had to be added to bring it down. That is why it took me longer than I wanted to get it to 1.009.

 

[sepulatian]

You may want to observe him for a few more days. He should be fine though. The SG has been at 1.008-1.009 for over four weeks.

 

[jshepherd]

I will shoot for this weekend. I know I have kept it kept it down since I was just questioning if I somehow made a a super ich parasite haha.

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by jshepherd
http:///forum/post/2714501
I will shoot for this weekend. I know I have kept it kept it down since I was just questioning if I somehow made a a super ich parasite haha.
There is always the possibility. Ich usually becomes visible again, if it is still there, as the SG is being raised. It is better to wait a few more days just to be safe though.

 

[tizzo]

I'm a little curious as to what you did with the rocks that were in the tank before you started hypo.

 

[jshepherd]

Originally Posted by Tizzo
http:///forum/post/2714827
I'm a little curious as to what you did with the rocks that were in the tank before you started hypo.
There are about 40-50 lbs that I have sitting in a 45 tupperware container with a modded mj1200 and a heater. They have been fishless long enough they should soon be safe as well if not already. It is very nice looking live rock.
I also have a 45 gallon cycled tank that I will put the rock in and keep the 30 as a hospital tank. Not sure what fish to put in it yet.

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by jshepherd
http:///forum/post/2714997
There are about 40-50 lbs that I have sitting in a 45 tupperware container with a modded mj1200 and a heater. They have been fishless long enough they should soon be safe as well if not already. It is very nice looking live rock.
I also have a 45 gallon cycled tank that I will put the rock in and keep the 30 as a hospital tank. Not sure what fish to put in it yet.
You do not need that much rock in a hospital tank. My two QT's currently have about 5 lbs each in them. They each started with none at all. Once the fish were in then the rock was added. It is just for added biological filtration. Should a fish get sick then it is a small amount of rock to remove into a bucket.

 

[jshepherd]

Sorry I did not make that clear. I only had a few decent size rocks in the qt.
I already have 200 lbs in the 150. I had the rest in a tub. I now have 3 tanks. 1 is the dt 150g 2nd is a 45 that now has the lr and the 30 that has pvc tubes in it for a qt/hospital tank.

 

[jshepherd]

Well I just aclimated the powder blue and put him in the DT. I watched him in the styrafoam container and in the qt to be sure there was no ich.
My Dt starting pushing some small air bubbles becasue the refug went low with the water so I seen some bubbles on him at first.
I closely watched the powder blue and I could see what looked like specs on his pectoral fins. The rest of his body looked perfect. I sorta freaked out and pulled him back out after approx 5 minutes. He is back in the QT and the specks are still there, no better no worse but when you can see through his pectoral fins they are not perfectly clear.
What should I do? Is there a chance if it is still ich that nothing dropped off and infected my DT. I am so frustrated at this point if my dt has ich then I am done. 2 months of trying to do the right thing and I am afraid it was all a waste of time.

 

[sepulatian]

If you are that concerned then you can treat him with copper. It may be nothing at all. Fish get air bubbles on them and they get faded stress marks, especially tangs. I would just watch him in the QT. It is up to you.

 

[jshepherd]

thanks for the responce.
How long if the dt happend to get some that came off the powder blue would the fish in the dt show it? I thought that if they did not attach within a few hours that the ich parasite would die.
I did not get bothered about his stress marking but the clear pectoral fins on both sides had blemishes. They are still there so I am sure it is not bubbles now. i can possibly get a pic but I don't think it would tell you much.
If I treat with cupramine now for 3 weeks is it 100% absolutely gone ?
maybe I am being paranoid but I feel better being this way than just throwing them in and hoping like many do.

 

[emeralcrab]

This is just my experience. Had a baby blue hippo tang, got ich in QT because of ammonia in my well water. Fixed that and then hypo'd for over the time you were suppose to. Have a refracto to measure SG, well when I put her in the 150g with in a little bit she looked like she had about 3 ich pieces on her. I was so bummed, but decided to watch her, they went away and I never ever had ich in my 150g show up, even when fish were stressed to the max when the tank started leaking and I had to move them to a stock tank. She unfortunately decided to go carpet surfing out of the stock tank. The others are now in their new 210g. I wish I would of covered the holding tank. I really hated loosing her.
I had her for over 2 years.

 

[jshepherd]

Still no more or less spots on him. Maybe it is a blemish on his pectoral fin? I have teken a dozen pics and nothing shows it. You have to be at a point you can see through his fin and it is not really a circular spot.

 

[florida joe]

Just to answer you original question NO ick is not effected by the duration of time involved to reach a salinity level where there is not enough osmotic pressure differential for fluid exchange to allow the ick parasite to multiply and survive

 

[jshepherd]

Thanks Joe,
I would have thought it was stressed more to bring it down in a certain time but in this hobby I am finding it is not good to assume.
I have cupramine , copper test kit and the seachem ammonia test kit coming in the morning but am debating if I should use it or not. The powder blue has no circular ich looking anything but does have the few small marks on his left pectoral fin. I wish I really knew if I have ever really seen ich. I am so paranoid at this point.
in the 150 is
md yelllow tang
sm clown
md clown
5 sm chromis
sm lawnmower blenny
I would hate to have these guys get infected from my inexperience.

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2718390
Just to answer you original question NO ick is not effected by the duration of time involved to reach a salinity level where there is not enough osmotic pressure differential for fluid exchange to allow the ick parasite to multiply and survive
I disagree. Ich is one of the most adaptive parasites that we know of in SW fish keeping. If a person were to take several weeks to bring the SG down then there I fully believe that the parasite can adapt to the lower SG. There are strains of ich that can survive a properly done hypo. It is rare, but it happens. The 48 hours is important. It allows the fish enough adaptation, but not the parasite. In this case, you will see the spot fall off within week if it is ich. Keep him in Qt for a week from when you saw it. If it is still there then it is not ich.