damsels died!

newsalt16

Member
I have a 75 gallon saltwater tank that has been cyclying for close to six weeks. It has been cycling with 60 lbs of live rock. I took the water to be tested and everything was good, but my ammonia was really high and i still had no nitrites. The guy at the fish store told me to add damsels and they would bring my ammonia high and then back down and turn it into nitrites. So i got a pair of damsels and acclimated them for an hour and then put them in my tank. Within an hour they were both dead. Whats wrong with my tank? PLease help!
 

fedukeford

Active Member
nothing wrong, you new the ammonia was high which kills fish, so why did you tourture fish if you new the levels were off?
 

chipmaker

Active Member
The tank was doing what the tank was supposed to do, and there was no need to add fish. Hope this shows you the LFS you dealt with does not know what they are doing, and is just looking for sales.......hopefull no repeat buys by you since they seem to care little for a fish when they advise to add fish to an already occuring cycle or to use a live fish to initiat a cycle when live rock will do it allby itself without adding anythin. Live and learn.......
 

coachklm

Active Member
sit back and wait you have a great cycle going on please do not add fish... or anything untill level are at zero...
thte only way thats going to happens is.....you sitting and waiting and testing every other day.
 

chipmaker

Active Member
Save the testing thing....buy a ammonia alert indicator pad, which is sold in lfs. The come with a suction cup for mounting. Just place nside tank and watch the center pad change color from yellow to green or blue or purple.....as ammonia increases. When it stsarts to revers colors and start coming back down, then do a nitirite and nitrate test.....for kicks, wait until ammonia indicator hits trhe yellow color (SAFE) zone then do a complete run of tests. NO sense wasteing test kit components and time to monitor a cycle......let the ammonia indicator do 99% of it.
 

reeffreak9

Member
:happyfish You can also add Cycle by Nutrafin. That is what I used that cycled my tank rapidly. I has massive amounts of beneficial bacteria. This is what your waiting for! Good luck, and never ask advise of your lfs, They always give bad advice, anything to make a buck I guess. Add fishies only after your amonia is at 0. Chipmaker is right it is good to use an amonia indicator, too! :happyfish
 

jdecter

Member
buy yourself a a complete test kit that usually tests, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, and PH.
In a short version of how cycling works:
the live rock have life on them that create ammonia as a waste product, they will do this naturally their whole life. The same with fish, and as a matter of fact the breaking down of food and waste all create ammonia.
Then of course with lots of ammonia in the tank, life begins its "cycle". What I mean is there are bacteria that feed on ammonia, they eat it and then make nitrite for their waste, still toxic to fish, but less than ammonia, then life begins its "cycle again" and bacteria that eat nitrite will flourish and eat the nitrite and their waste is called nitrate. Nitrate is also toxic to fish but much less than nitrite and ammonia.
a good fish only tank that is well cycled with test something like this:
0ppm Ammonia
0ppm Nitrite
0ppm to 20ppm Nitrate
Once your water reachs around 20ppm you do your water changes in a variety of ways. Some people love to do small water changes, maybe 5% each week and never have nitrate build up to high. Some people do 20% changes once a month. That will be up to your style and how much fish, and food you put in the tank (being the cause for ammonia build up).
As a cycle begins, Ammonia wont have enough "eater bacteria" to process it so it will spike and kill anything that is sensitive to it. Then over the matter of 6 weeks, a ton of ammonia eating bacteria will flourish and you'll see the ammonia slowly drop, and then nitrite will spike, killing anything sensitive to it as well, then over a few days nitrate will start to produce.
within a week or two at most from when you see nitrates starting to show up on your test. You should see Ammonia hit 0ppm as the colonies of ammonia eating bacteria finally reach the levels it needs to maintain enough bacteria to eat the level of ammonia your tank produces daily. And then in a few days the same will happen with Nitrite and then Nitrate.
You will know when your tank is ready to stock with a fish, when your Ammonia and Nitrite both hit 0ppm together for a few days.
Another thing, you shouldn't be floating a bag in your tank to get your fish use to the water, for an hour. Most Hobbiest now use a small tube and do whats called a drip method, to basically fill the bag your fish comes with with tank water over about 15minutes.
Fish don't do well in those small bags, and they need to get use to the tank salinity and trate levels slowly but not so long that they sit in a small little stressful bag for a long period.
after about 15 minutes of a constant dripping into the bag, take all the water and fish, and poor the water out and then dump the fish into the tank.
What it sounds like is you have another few weeks to a month on your cycle. Get yourself a tester kit learn the tests by doing one a day for the next two weeks (so you can clearly learn how it works and actually see how each day your ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate change, and write it in a notepad.
By the end of the two weeks you'll probably be very versed on how your test kit works, and intimate with what your waters been doing and you should clearly see your levels come ready for your fish.
Then don't rush, buy one a week at most. Let the bacteria grow with the new addition of ammonia makers (fish).
 

biggredd

Member
butting in a little. I just started my cycle on 5-22 with 120 pounds of live sand, 35 pounds of base rock, and 30 pounds of live rock. I assume that is enough to get an effective cycle started? I also plan to start making my own rock this weekend and having it seed from the LR.
 

dmjordan

Active Member
Originally Posted by Biggredd
butting in a little. I just started my cycle on 5-22 with 120 pounds of live sand, 35 pounds of base rock, and 30 pounds of live rock. I assume that is enough to get an effective cycle started? I also plan to start making my own rock this weekend and having it seed from the LR.
If the LR is not fully cured than yes. As the LR cures it will start your cycle. Check your ammonia in a couple of days. If there is no sign of ammonia throw in a raw shrimp. Don't cycle with fish.
If the LR is fully cured just throw in a raw shrimp.
 
M

medic79

Guest
Just a thought and maybe mute point buy now but adding biospira by marineland products (it's an additive any decent LFS should have) it contains all the natural bacteria found in a good running system and can sometimes balance ammonia not 0 it out outthe cycle still has to that itself it will bring it within tolerable limits. Add it after your water change it just kickstarts your cycle it does not replace it!!!!! Therefore speeding it a little not all the way. I say repeatedly this because I told one guy this and he went home added it then went to his ***** the next day and bought $200 worth of fish and they all died. It helps within 24-48 hours you willl see measured differences in ammonia, nitrates, nitrites, and should level an ph. Just remeber to wait a week and check your water conditions before adding any live stock.It's a great tool but not a magic juice. And good luck
 

ghettotang

Member
Hey my suggestion to you is I would wait until you tank is fully cycle. Don't add any kind of fish until all your chemical is all the down to ZERO. This what most new hobbylist people are having problem with is they can't wait until their tank is fully cycle. This is what I see most of the problem. The reason why I said that because when I started doing saltwater fish is that i didn't wait until my tank is fully cycle. My LFS told me I need this and that. So i took their advice, but I took a wrong advice. So my uncle taught me and he's good.
I hope this would help you
 

ghettotang

Member
Hey my suggestion to you is I would wait until you tank is fully cycle. Don't add any kind of fish until all your chemical is all the down to ZERO. This what most new hobbylist people are having problem with is they can't wait until their tank is fully cycle. This is what I see most of the problem. The reason why I said that because when I started doing saltwater fish is that i didn't wait until my tank is fully cycle. My LFS told me I need this and that. So i took their advice, but I took a wrong advice. So my uncle taught me and he's good.
I hope this would help you
 

sepulatian

Moderator
Another thing, you shouldn't be floating a bag in your tank to get your fish use to the water, for an hour. Most Hobbiest now use a small tube and do whats called a drip method, to basically fill the bag your fish comes with with tank water over about 15minutes.
Fish don't do well in those small bags, and they need to get use to the tank salinity and trate levels slowly but not so long that they sit in a small little stressful bag for a long period.
after about 15 minutes of a constant dripping into the bag, take all the water and fish, and poor the water out and then dump the fish into the tank.

I agree you should have waited to add fish. Jdecter, I am sorry but I completely disagree with your method for aclimation.15 mins. is no where near enough acclimation time. Fish should be put in a bucket with the water from LFS. Take a long piece of airline tubing and tie a knot in it, syphon the tank water into the bucket with the fish. (the knot will cause it to drip, not flow, into the bucket.) when ph and salinity are the same as your QT then net the fish and put it in the qt. Disgard the water in the bucket. The whole aclimation process should take from 2-4 hrs. If you do it too fast you will risk osmotic shock. I am sorry to have to disagree with you, but we don't want people to be led wrong. There is a link in the FAQ forum with detailed instructions on acclimation time.
 
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