Does democracy work when you're in the minority?

I had an interesting discussion today with one of my customers at my shop. He is an across the board independent, so I don't think he really cares R vs. D with the discussion we were having.
Basically, I said I saw a certain sense of irony with the fact that most people who have started the "Obama is a socialist" theme, are also the same people who bleed red, white, and blue across the boards. Meaning they are firm believers in the constitution and the basic tenants of democracy in general.
That being said, why do people tend to have no problem at all with democracy when it's in their favor, but the second they are in the minority, they start to sling mud?
It goes both ways, don't get me wrong. But you never hear someone these days who is on the right say something along the lines of "Well, I certainly don't agree with the last electoral results or the direction they have sent the country, but I respect the fact that the majority of the American people chose this president, and therefore his policies, which is what the basis of democracy is."
So on one hand, they beat the constitution and democracy down your throat, but on the other hand they think that the "people" are all ignorant and stupid, and democracy with "misinformed citizens" would never work. But when the vote swings in their particular political view, then "democracy is working".
So make up your mind, you know? If you believe by the people, for the people, then you can't complain when you aren't happy with the results just because they aren't what you wanted personally?
It's a good question, and I'm not sure exactly how I feel about the whole thing.
Thouhgts?
 

darthtang aw

Active Member
who is "they" when you are referring to this part?
So on one hand, they beat the constitution and democracy down your throat, but on the other hand they think that the "people" are all ignorant and stupid, and democracy with "misinformed citizens" would never work. But when the vote swings in their particular political view, then "democracy is working".
 
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
http:///forum/post/3251092
who is "they" when you are referring to this part?
So on one hand, they beat the constitution and democracy down your throat, but on the other hand they think that the "people" are all ignorant and stupid, and democracy with "misinformed citizens" would never work. But when the vote swings in their particular political view, then "democracy is working".
Anyone on either side of the aisle who is in the minority but still is a firm believer in democracy. Right now it's the Obama bashing righties, a few years ago is was the Bush bashing lefties. Basically anyone who loves democracy, but only when it works in their favor.
 

darthtang aw

Active Member
Originally Posted by TheClemsonKid
http:///forum/post/3251100
Anyone on either side of the aisle who is in the minority but still is a firm believer in democracy. Right now it's the Obama bashing righties, a few years ago is was the Bush bashing lefties. Basically anyone who loves democracy, but only when it works in their favor.
I don't know of anyone that says democracy doesn't work when they are in the minority. regardless of political persuasion.Everyone I know says we have to vote these guys out.
 

reefraff

Active Member
I think there is little doubt left as to whether Obama is a socialist or not. I don't get how that somehow means I have a problem with our constitutional republic. What I have an issue with is Obama and his media lackeys offered up the false impression he was some kind of centrist when his record showed otherwise. He's there and we are screwed until 2012.
I think my biggest issue is with voters too dumb or lazy to learn the truth about the candidates.
 
Originally Posted by reefraff
http:///forum/post/3251106
I think there is little doubt left as to whether Obama is a socialist or not. I don't get how that somehow means I have a problem with our constitutional republic. What I have an issue with is Obama and his media lackeys offered up the false impression he was some kind of centrist when his record showed otherwise. He's there and we are screwed until 2012.
I think my biggest issue is with voters too dumb or lazy to learn the truth about the candidates.
I'm not saying you in general. It's just there are a lot of people who love the fact that the United States was built on the fact that the people get to vote for who they want as their leaders, yet when the majority chose someone who isn't "their guy", you hear a lot of them say "democracy is broken".
 

darthtang aw

Active Member
Originally Posted by TheClemsonKid
http:///forum/post/3251124
I'm not saying you in general. It's just there are a lot of people who love the fact that the United States was built on the fact that the people get to vote for who they want as their leaders, yet when the majority chose someone who isn't "their guy", you hear a lot of them say "democracy is broken".
The only people I have ever heard or seen say such a thing is those in the major media.......the average citizen I have yet to see say this. If those in the minority believed that, there would not be tea party movements and such.
 

stdreb27

Active Member
First off I don't buy that people voted for Obama thus voted for his policies. Because I think Obama and his media wackies tried very hard to hide their true intent. And to this day they do that. Remember them pitching healthcare as a free market idea. That simply isn't true. He was parading himself as a unifier and moderate. Which is a load of BS.
I also dont' buy this Bush bashed people. The guy didn't even defend himself against some very salacious accusations.
 

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by TheClemsonKid
http:///forum/post/3251124
I'm not saying you in general. It's just there are a lot of people who love the fact that the United States was built on the fact that the people get to vote for who they want as their leaders, yet when the majority chose someone who isn't "their guy", you hear a lot of them say "democracy is broken".
Got ya. Seems to me we hear that out of Hollywood more than anywhere else lol! Yeah I remember the people saying Clinton was going to declare martial law and postpone the 2000 election, And saying the same thing about Bush in 04
 

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/3251157
First off I don't buy that people voted for Obama thus voted for his policies. Because I think Obama and his media wackies tried very hard to hide their true intent. And to this day they do that. Remember them pitching healthcare as a free market idea. That simply isn't true. He was parading himself as a unifier and moderate. Which is a load of BS.
I also dont' buy this Bush bashed people. The guy didn't even defend himself against some very salacious accusations.
Bush was a fool for not responding to a lot of the lies spread about him. On the other hand you have Obama going after people he should ignore
 

uneverno

Active Member
The problem, as I see it, is that there is only one aisle. It is not the Constitution that prevents additional parties from participating in the process. It is the RNC, DNC, and their complicit media outlets which do so.
Representative government (as opposed to Democracy) is what the Constitution provides for. The RNC and DNC have seen to it that they are to be the only viable choices.
The Constitution does not preclude coalition government. The 2 remaining parties have.
As a Liberal, I love the Constitution and what it stands for. What I hate is what the Parties - both of them - have made of it.
 

geridoc

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/3251157
First off I don't buy that people voted for Obama thus voted for his policies. Because I think Obama and his media wackies tried very hard to hide their true intent. And to this day they do that. Remember them pitching healthcare as a free market idea. That simply isn't true. He was parading himself as a unifier and moderate. Which is a load of BS.
I also dont' buy this Bush bashed people. The guy didn't even defend himself against some very salacious accusations.
Tried to hide their true intent? He ran explicitly on providing universal health care, and is using (regulated free-market) private insurance companies to run the thing
 

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by GeriDoc
http:///forum/post/3251296
Tried to hide their true intent? He ran explicitly on providing universal health care, and is using (regulated free-market) private insurance companies to run the thing
No he didn't, infact if you remember in one of the debates with hilary he lambasted her for advocating a mandate for purchasing health insurance.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AOJB...layer_embedded
:)
There is little doubt in my mind that he intended to do this. See I put stock in the people he surrounded himself with, like his pastor, and the domestic terrorists. But you can't deny Obama was cast by the media, as a moderate, anyone who said anything otherwise was a right wing extremist. Hell even republicans were saying, oh he's gonna govern from the middle. Point out his pastor was an insane raging lunatic. Or that he was friends with a guy who tried to bomb the pentagon and police stations, oh he wasn't influence by them at all. (never mind that his advisors now are almost as bad)
I'll give you half of that, he is creating a government controlled market environment designed to put insurance companies out of business.
 

kjr_trig

Active Member
I of course believe in democracy...Unfortunately, I also think a majority of America is cluless and horribly irresponsible. I also understand how the country was very frustrated with the Bush regime.
Hopefully having a Congress with what? an 18% approval rating or something? Will lead to better decisions this fall.
 

uneverno

Active Member
Except that we don't live in a Democracy, we live in a Representative Republic. The difference is both subtle and monumental.
 

ibanez

Member
I don't get how anyone doesn't understand that power corrupts all. No one is immune. It doesn't matter what party, rush limbaugh, bill o'reilly, who ever it may be, has an agenda, seeks and hungers for power, to push their agenda. It all comes down to greed and money, and seeking fame. Nothing is holy, nothing is pure, and no one is perfect, but everyone thinks they are right--until they learn they are wrong. They learn they are wrong, when their ideas, philosophies, and practices prove to be the downfall of society.
 
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