marineguys
Member
My nitrates are high. Would a DSB help?
DSB vs. SSB
- Thread starter marineguys
- Start date
bonebrake
Active Member
A DSB would help, but they are not necessary and there is probably a simpler solution.
Are you overfeeding?
Do you have too many fish?
Are you doing water changes on a regular basis?
Do you have decaying matter in the tank?
These are more likely causes of high nitrates and easier to fix.
:joy:
Are you overfeeding?
Do you have too many fish?
Are you doing water changes on a regular basis?
Do you have decaying matter in the tank?
These are more likely causes of high nitrates and easier to fix.
:joy:
marineguys
Member
I do q weekly 10% water changes with RO. Some people on this site have stated that my 3 month old 55g is overstocked. I have a few snails and hermits, 1 and 1/2in sand bed, 1 small tang, 2 clowns, 4 very small chromis, and 55lbs live rock.
Nitrates are 30-40ppm
Nitrites 0
Ammonia 0
PH 8.2
alk normal
dkh 13
Cal 440
phos 0
Should i add plants? Should i do a deeper sand bed? should i sell back a fish or 2 to the lfs? I plan on getting more live rock. not going to get a fuge.
I feed twice a day a half cube of frozen mysis and 2 pinchs of formula 2. No food is uneaten. All food is consumed in 3 min.
Nitrates are 30-40ppm
Nitrites 0
Ammonia 0
PH 8.2
alk normal
dkh 13
Cal 440
phos 0
Should i add plants? Should i do a deeper sand bed? should i sell back a fish or 2 to the lfs? I plan on getting more live rock. not going to get a fuge.
I feed twice a day a half cube of frozen mysis and 2 pinchs of formula 2. No food is uneaten. All food is consumed in 3 min.
K
kalied20
Guest
I had a nano with a deep sand bed and it never had any problems. When I moved everything to the new 90 gallon I went with about 2'' in my display. The main reason was that I have a Golden Headed Sleeper Goby that loves to dig under and around the rocks and I didn't want a landslide. Is working great in the 90. But I am using a DSB in my refuge. About 4-5" for the fauna in there.
marineguys
Member
My nitrates have now doubled within a 24 hr. period. (80ppm)
S
scoobs
Guest
sounds like something died.
bonebrake
Active Member
Originally Posted by marineguys
My nitrates have now doubled within a 24 hr. period. (80ppm)
Something definitely died or is dying. How do your corals look? Are you sure you're not missing a fish? Did you recently add a large piece of live rock that you thought was cured? Are you certain your test kit is accurate? Test the nitrates on some RO water to be certain before you take any actions.
You should do a 30-50% water change to take care of the nitrates now because if they doubled in 24 hrs. they may very well double again and that would be starting to reach toxic levels to fish. Don't rush mixing the water though, give it a full 24 hrs. to mix.
You are clearly undergoing some sort of crisis right now and hopefully your nitrate problem will resolve. If it does not and you have persistently elevated nitrates after this incident, start doing a 10 gallon water change every week or a 15-20 gallon water change every two weeks. A 10% water change every week is really not enough water turnover in a fully stocked system, especially if you lack a skimmer.
:joy:
Originally Posted by ninjamini
How does a dsb help?
A deep sand bed (4"+) can effectively process nitrates by providing an anaerobic environment for bacteria to live in that use nitrates instead of oxygen for their metabolic electron transport chains. They use nitrate to form nitrogen gas in a similar manner that we use oxygen gas to form carbon dioxide gas. However, you don't necessarily have to have a deep sand bed to have these bacteria present and working; a deep sand bed simply provides more surface area for them to live. They can setup shop in sand underneath the live rock that gets little to no water flow and in the deep recesses of the live rock itself.
:joy:
My nitrates have now doubled within a 24 hr. period. (80ppm)
Something definitely died or is dying. How do your corals look? Are you sure you're not missing a fish? Did you recently add a large piece of live rock that you thought was cured? Are you certain your test kit is accurate? Test the nitrates on some RO water to be certain before you take any actions.
You should do a 30-50% water change to take care of the nitrates now because if they doubled in 24 hrs. they may very well double again and that would be starting to reach toxic levels to fish. Don't rush mixing the water though, give it a full 24 hrs. to mix.
You are clearly undergoing some sort of crisis right now and hopefully your nitrate problem will resolve. If it does not and you have persistently elevated nitrates after this incident, start doing a 10 gallon water change every week or a 15-20 gallon water change every two weeks. A 10% water change every week is really not enough water turnover in a fully stocked system, especially if you lack a skimmer.
:joy:
Originally Posted by ninjamini
How does a dsb help?
A deep sand bed (4"+) can effectively process nitrates by providing an anaerobic environment for bacteria to live in that use nitrates instead of oxygen for their metabolic electron transport chains. They use nitrate to form nitrogen gas in a similar manner that we use oxygen gas to form carbon dioxide gas. However, you don't necessarily have to have a deep sand bed to have these bacteria present and working; a deep sand bed simply provides more surface area for them to live. They can setup shop in sand underneath the live rock that gets little to no water flow and in the deep recesses of the live rock itself.
:joy:
mark_d
Member
Originally Posted by Catawaba
More rock.
Stocked to the max IMO...especially as the fish get bigger.
DSB would help a bit.
More water changes, less food.
Pellets in AM
Mysis in PM
JMHO
:thinking:
Why not just feed once a day and alternate between types of food? I had high nitrates in my system when i fed twice a day. Once seems to work just fine.
More rock.
Stocked to the max IMO...especially as the fish get bigger.
DSB would help a bit.
More water changes, less food.
Pellets in AM
Mysis in PM
JMHO
:thinking:
Why not just feed once a day and alternate between types of food? I had high nitrates in my system when i fed twice a day. Once seems to work just fine.
bonebrake
Active Member
Originally Posted by ninjamini
Would a DSB also hold deturus increasing nitrates as well?
That is one of the counter arguments to deep sand beds, but all sand beds hold detritus. If detritus gets buried underneath the sand where it cannot decompose in an aerobic environment and it decomposes in an anaerobic environment, it can be turned back up to pollute your water at a later date depending on what said detritus was originally and how deep it was buried, but it has been shown that deep sand beds definitely lower nitrates and provide a net positive benefit when properly care for.
:joy:
Would a DSB also hold deturus increasing nitrates as well?
That is one of the counter arguments to deep sand beds, but all sand beds hold detritus. If detritus gets buried underneath the sand where it cannot decompose in an aerobic environment and it decomposes in an anaerobic environment, it can be turned back up to pollute your water at a later date depending on what said detritus was originally and how deep it was buried, but it has been shown that deep sand beds definitely lower nitrates and provide a net positive benefit when properly care for.
:joy:
marineguys
Member
Nothing has died. Corals look good.... for now. Nitrates went down to 40ppm the next morning. Will do a big water change tomorrow. I can not find the root of the cause. I tested the kit on plain RO water and it ruled negative. Debating making a deeper sand bed, removing 2 chromis, etc.
bonebrake
Active Member
Please do not take offense to this, but are you sure you're reading or performing the test correctly? It is highly unlikely that the nitrates could be 40 ppm one day, 80 ppm the next, and 40 ppm the day after that without some sort of testing error or a problem with the test itself. Is this a dipstick test? They are notoriously known for being inaccurate.
:notsure:
:notsure:
russy pelican
Member
My best reef aquarist friend is a DSB guy, no skimmer, I'm the opposite... no sand, high skimming. We each have better luck with different specimens, but I see potential trouble with DSBs. And my softies and fish do better (IMO).
marineguys
Member
Fuge is not gunna happen, sorry. I have a API test kit. Seems good. I tested the clean water RO I have stored and it was negative. tested my tank water right afetr and it was 80ppm. I think because I had just fed? Was 40ppm when I woke up today. I will check again tonight and do a 100% water change tomorrow with the slow mix method. I wish I knew the cause though. A lot of peope on this site whome shall remain nameless, say this thing or the other like you are overstocked or feeding too much etc but yet it's none of these things. If trates don't go down afetr the water change i may just give up.
saltn00b
Active Member
i had a problem and still do to some extent with trates. If your sand bed is not a DSB, 4"+ then it should be <1". otherwise you are in a no-man's land of sand depth, which is not beneficial at all. also, do you have and sand -stirring critters? cerith / nassarius snails and the like ? these all can help keep your bed healthy and your trates low.
also, do you have some sort of flow over your bed and no dead spots?
also, do you have some sort of flow over your bed and no dead spots?