Hypo not working

[flamehawk]

The saga continues....Have had my newly purchased adult emperor angel in 1.008 hypo Q tank for 3 weeks. It's not working. Still has ick which only goes away after a f/w dip which has been performed twice. Once in the beginning of treatment and another upon return from Japan trip this past sunday. While gone my son kept water level at demarkation line to ensure salinity stability. I'm thinking copper is my only option at this point. What should I do next??? If I do copper should I leave the sal @ 1.008 or raise it to normal then treat?? By the way he still is eating good and otherwise acts as if nothing is wrong.
Also not working for flame angel which is in another Q tank. He unfortunately has decided to stop eating 2 days ago. Help! Hypo just not working.
P.S. Have a glass hydrometer which I compare to needle hydro and they both read 1.008-.09.

 

[flamehawk]

I read at the water level. I bought the glass hydro because that is what was recommended on this board. The glass hydro currently reads 1.006 while the floating arm reads 1.008. I'm thinking the glass one is "more correct" but now I don't really know. Since it's been 3 weeks , you're probably right. I don't really want to wait much longer so should I use copper in the Q tank? If so do I raise salinity closer to normal?Thanks for your help. I know you are busy.

 

[beth]

You can do the copper treatment and keep the fish in hypo. How are the fish doing with stress? Are the eating still, and behaving relatively normally?
The price that you will pay for copper test kits and copper would have nearly bought you a salinity monitor.
Also, neither Terry or myself recommend glass hydrometers as the first choice for performing hyposalinity. Both of us recommend a refract. The stickied FAQ section above also recommends the refract. We say that you can use a glass hydrometer, once hobbyists on the BB say they can't get a refract.
I strongly encourage everyone to get a refract and consider it money well spent. No one minds upgrading their skimmer every 2 yrs at $200 plus a pop, so why is it so unreasonable to get a single piece of equiptment that will last as long as you do if you take care of it?

 

[beth]

Yes, in looking back on threads posted a wk or so, I see you have a PB with "spots". We were trying to dignose there to and even discussed lymphocystis?

 

[flamehawk]

Beth- PB looks like it's gotten better. Food soaked in Garlic and water changes seems to have done the trick..thanks.
Not so lucky on my adult emperor from Bali. He is in a Q tank along with the flame now. Emperor has some spots, quite sparadically placed that are salt granular size. They are slightly raised . They are symetrical. He has not been observed to be scratching at all. Has about 35-40 spots on each side. More concentrated on the front half of the body. Emperor eating well and behaving normal, including breathing.
Flame angel has no signs of spots. He is breathing heavy and is not eating. I think the hypo is getting to him and am considering moving up the salinity in a different tank for him.
I'm sorry to say I haven't a clue on how to post pics. Thanks. Really need your help.

 

[beth]

Could you post pics if you knew how? Go to the Photo Forum, I beleive that Rye posted some instructions. If you still don't get it, I can walk you thru it.

 

[flamehawk]

Went to photo forum and read....still frustrated and clueless. I'm just not very good with these things.
In any event, I'm beginning to think that the spots are not ick. Hypo level is definately right since I borrowd a refrac. from pet LFS owner and calibrated against my other hydros and thet were with in .002. Tht's to say that my salinity is actually too low at 1.004. Will raise a bit to at least .008. That said 3 weeks at this level should have done the trick if it was ick. I'm now thinking it's lymph. Flame is actually brathing too hard to keep hypo going and he's not eating. I'm going to slowly raise the sal. to 1.015. Do you agree?? I'll wait to here from you but my flame really looks stressed and I may have to go w/ my instincts. Not that concerned about emperor because he's breathing ok and eating and behaving normal. He's one tough cookie. Not so of the angel who is behaving similarly as if he were getting a f/w dip. That's why I think it's the salinity w/ him....Help. Thanks.

 

[beth]

The too low salinity will definately STRESS fish. You must not go below 1.009. The way you calibrate a refract is by droping distilled water onto the glass and waiting about 30 sections, then look at the reading. You adjust by calibrating the reading to zero.
Make sure the refract is calibrated correctly, then take another reading. If you SG is too low, start raising, but slowly. What is your PH?

 

[flamehawk]

Good thing had some distilled water around. Calibrated as you said and the difference is still the same so I'm starting to raise salintiy to 1.009. Once I get there do I continue over the next couple of days to lets say 1.015? Would the low salinity be causing the flame not to eat? We still have the issue of the white spots. They are small and concentrated on the front half of the body between the head and traveling about 3-4 inches. The back part of his body has very few dots. The closer I look the more it's beginning to look more like very small density type spots. Not like ick I've seen before. If I'm right, he'll stay in Q tank until better. As far as flame, if I can get him to eat, I'll put him in display tank in the next week or so. Doas this sound like a plan?
Another question...WHile I am aware of formalin as a dip, I haven't heard much mention of it as actual medicine for treatment. Botttle says it can be used at rate of 2 drops per gallon until all is gone then repeat after 10 days and water change. Is this an option or would it be if we were convinced he had ick and needed to use medicine in additon to hypo? Is formalin reef safe?

 

[beth]

Wish you could get a pic up. Send me a pic via email. beth@saltwaterfish.com

 

[flamehawk]

Flame angel didn't make it. I have had absolutely no luck w/ them. This one was from Vietnam and I think it was collected w/ cyanide. After eating well and acting normal for about 2 weeks it mysteriously stooped eating. It started being listless and lacked balance and bouyancy. Typical cyanide poisonong symptoms. Granted it was in hypo but It should not have caused these symptoms.
I'm done w/ trying on these fish.
Meanwhile my adult emperor still has his spots but is eating really well and behaving very normal. Patience...patience...patience.