I need pump help

[flower]

I HATE my lifter pump...it doesn't like me much either.
I was told I could use a regular maxi-jet to attach to my CPR overflow. I always purchase the wrong thing it seems.....so here is a picture of a maxi-jet...in the picture I see the tube already attached, and this pump has a hanging thing to help it stay right at the top of the tank by the overflow where I need it. All the others have those suction cups, and I think we can agree that those don't stay put. I can't find the little maxi jet ones with a magnet.
Is this the right one?

 

[flower]

This is a picture of the one I purchased that doesn't work...the little air tube goes INSIDE the nub and it doesn't make a tight enough seal I guess.

 

[al&burke]

I think that is a good one Flower, let's see what Shawn says

 

[2quills]

What model is that?

 

[flower]

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///t/394402/i-need-pump-help#post_3510559
What model is that?
Hi,
It's on e-bay...I was looking to see what type it is that I need to get...I have gotten what doesn't work 2Xs now. I don't need a powerful pump, just enough to do what the lifter pump does, and have nothing exposed that the seahorses would wrap their tails around and get hurt on. They assume the user wants it for an undergravel filter....but I want it to do the lifter pumps job...I don't know if that makes a difference.
Here is the info e-bay posted:
$22.95
Dive Power 200 Submersible Aquarium Power head/Pump 200gph Tom / Oscar Enterprises
Adding a power head to an undergravel filter improves the system by moving more water through the gravel, oxygenates the water and improves biological capabilities.
Features:

• 
  Tapered riser adapter fits all undergravel filters.
• 
  Adjustable hanger bracket (for 85, 125 & 200)
• 
  Stay-Stick silicon suction cups
  Epoxy sealed motor
  Air filter Flow diffuser (except Model: 40)

 

[acrylic51]

Curious why a little silicone around the nub wouldn't solve the seal issue......The 2 pumps look very similar to me.....

 

[flower]

Quote:
Originally Posted by acrylic51 http:///t/394402/i-need-pump-help#post_3510576
Curious why a little silicone around the nub wouldn't solve the seal issue......The 2 pumps look very similar to me.....
I have to be able to remove the air tube to replace it when it gets nasty...so sealing it permanently to the nub didn't seem like a good thing to do.
So they LOOK the same...see my dilemma...
The second pump pic, has the tube that goes INSIDE the nub. I tried the white tape, and every little jar or bump...it comes lose, and without a pump my CPR overflows. I don't know that it isn't making a good seal ... until that overflow happens. Which is what the lifter pump is doing to me...not every time, just when I least expect it to.
The first pump pic, has the nub that the tube slides over and seals ... but does it draw air/water from that nub, and will it do the same job as a lifter pump?...Is that the right gizmo that I need?

 

[2quills]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flower http:///t/394402/i-need-pump-help#post_3510563
I don't need a powerful pump, just enough to do what the lifter pump does, and have nothing exposed that the seahorses would wrap their tails around and get hurt on. They assume the user wants it for an undergravel filter....but I want it to do the lifter pumps job...I don't know if that makes a difference.
I don't see why it would make a difference. But i'm leaning towards the idea that if you want to use it to replace what the aqua lifter does than you don't want something too small. The bigger the pump, the more air pull or suction it will have to help keep the overflow functioning reliably. So it may be a bit counterintuitive in this case with the horses to do what you propose. Although I know there are plenty of folks who have used power heads for this very purpose before. I think beaslbob uses them on his diy pvc overflow IIRC. Maybe he'll chime in on size.
I wonder if small zip ties would help clamp off some of the suction loss on the pump that you have?

 

[flower]

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///t/394402/i-need-pump-help#post_3510588
I wonder if small zip ties would help clamp off some of the suction loss on the pump that you have?
The hard plastic the pump is made of won't clamp with a zip tie...the nub is made so the air tube line goes inside of it instead of fit over it.

 

[al&burke]

What is you got some rigid tubing that would fit over the square nub and fit the round fitting on your CPR, you could crazy glue the short piece onto your existing pump and attached the flexible tubing to it.

 

[flower]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Al&Burke http:///t/394402/i-need-pump-help#post_3510714
What is you got some rigid tubing that would fit over the square nub and fit the round fitting on your CPR, you could crazy glue the short piece onto your existing pump and attached the flexible tubing to it.
The air hose fits over the rigid tube...so the rigid tube is smaller than the hose that's already too small, the next size up is too large to fit inside. Although some silicone might fill in the gap. I will have to purchase some silicone to find out if that would work..

 

[2quills]

I have an old power heat that was a cheapy from one of the big chain pet stores and the venturi (plastic nub/nipple) that the air hose fits to is the same as my aqua lifter. The air hose fits over the nub and not into it. Is the air tubing on the pump that you have smaller than standard air tube? If so then yes I would try a larger power head. The more suction the better. It works the same way on skimmer pumps that draw air into the pump via the air tubing. The flow of the water through the pump creates a vacuum so it will suck mostly water and air bubbles via the air tube from the overflow.
Also, I don't see why you couldn't use a little dab of silicone just for reassuring a good seal. It cleans off easy or you can cut a small piece of the end of the hose when you need to pull it off and clean the pump or something. Just leave the end attached to the pump alone so it doesn't have to re cure before going in the water.

 

[acrylic51]

Thanks Corey.....That's what I was meaning about the silicone.....Could provide a decent seal and if needed could easily be removed to clean the tubing......A side note, if the hose is just a hair to small to fit over;around the pump nipple why not heat the hose in some boiling water to stretch it a bit......Once it cools should be a snug fit......

 

[flower]

Quote:
Originally Posted by acrylic51 http:///t/394402/i-need-pump-help#post_3510723
Thanks Corey.....That's what I was meaning about the silicone.....Could provide a decent seal and if needed could easily be removed to clean the tubing......A side note, if the hose is just a hair to small to fit over;around the pump nipple why not heat the hose in some boiling water to stretch it a bit......Once it cools should be a snug fit......

Hi,
No way about the boiling water...I tried that. I will get some silicone and see if I can do something with it. I have the new lifter pump, I'm going to get the pre-filter and not use the new one without it, being clogged is no doubt what the constant problem is. Once everything is up and running again I can experiment and see if I can get the maxi-jet to seal and work like it should to replace the lifter pump.
I'm a little confused about the pump size thing...now you guys are saying bigger is better
I thought I had to match the overflow pump with the sump pump. I have no idea HOW to go about figuring that out, you guys told me what to purchase and I followed instructions...Then I copied the design from the 90gs sump system, for the 56g. Then you guys told me what size pumps to get for that system. I was just matching the GPH that I originally had on the that pump.

 

[acrylic51]

Flower your not changing the flow going to the sump or anything with the return pump.....Corey is just recommending stronger PH to suck air from the overflow box......

 

[2quills]

Flower your not changing the flow going to the sump or anything with the return pump.....Corey is just recommending stronger PH to suck air from the overflow box......
Yep!

 

[flower]

Quote:
Originally Posted by acrylic51 http:///t/394402/i-need-pump-help#post_3510740
Flower your not changing the flow going to the sump or anything with the return pump.....Corey is just recommending stronger PH to suck air from the overflow box......
2Quills yepped you...I'm still confused. I totally understand how the pump works, and I understand about the more suction the better concept. But won't the greater suction change how fast the overflow drains...therefore changing they way the two work together now?
So as you see, I'm confused about the top pump matching the return pump...As I understand it, the return pump has to not push more than the top tank can be emptied, they have to work together, one not faster than the other. So I'm not questioning what you guys are talking about now...I asking about the return pump matching the pump on top....is that "synchronized union" NOT as I understand it?
I hope that makes sense.

 

[2quills]

The amount of water that the power head draws out of the overflow is of minor insignificance to the amount of water being pushed through the overflow by the return pump. I wouldn't even worry about it.
Remember you're not plumbing the powerheads input to the overflow. You're simply running the air tube from the nipple on the overflow to the nipple (venturi) on the powerheads output.
So you're only talking about it pulling a few gallons an hour out of the overflow vs a few hundred that is being pushed through it via the return pump.
HTH

 

[flower]

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///t/394402/i-need-pump-help#post_3510788
The amount of water that the power head draws out of the overflow is of minor insignificance to the amount of water being pushed through the overflow by the return pump. I wouldn't even worry about it.
Remember you're not plumbing the powerheads input to the overflow. You're simply running the air tube from the nipple on the overflow to the nipple (venturi) on the powerheads output.
So you're only talking about it pulling a few gallons an hour out of the overflow vs a few hundred that is being pushed through it via the return pump.
HTH
LOL...I understood the "don't even worry about it" So that's just what I will do. In simple speak...can you explain why the CPR overflow needs a lifter pump? Do all overflow boxes need such a thing? Maybe I could change my overflow box, so a pump isn't even needed....

 

[fishhugger]

Over time air bubbles could get trapped inside the top of the upside down U shaped chamber. If enough air accumulates in that chamber it would break the siphon and cause a catastrophic overflow. Having the lifter pump continuously running helps to ensure that any air bubbles will be sucked out of the chamber to prevent that scenario.
I have a CPR overflow now also, that I will get running tomorrow. You need to have a check valve after the venturi so it will not allow water to flow backwards into the CPR overflow Then you COULD run it without the pump, but its probably a bad idea......even with the pump you need to have the check valve which CPR was so kind enough to not provide =P.....even those its only like 50 cents