i want.....

[noaquariumyet]

a brown with white dotted puffer, volitan lion, and a panther grouper...in a 100 gallon fowlr....if the fish are small when i buy them can i still use a clean up crew....and will these fish even get along together.
Ok also everyone on swf. com has been very helpful..i hope in a few years i will be able to help the other newcomes....oh yeah what kind of lighting would be sufficient... thanks again everyone.

 

[bbuck_camelback]

I wouldn`t bother with the cleanup crew, all those fish you listed grow fast and would make quick work of inverts. The panther grouper will eventually outgrow a 100. IMO a full grown panther needs at least a 180. As for lighting a Normal Output setup would work, since its FOWLR you don`t need tons of light.

 

[fulcrum]

While you do have to be careful with inverts in an aggressive tank, you should be aware that if the fish are fed, and happy, they rarely mess with a cleanup crew. In my 125 I have a red volitan lion, a humu humu trigger, a niger trigger, a velvet damsel and a regal tang, and my cleanup crew in about 90% intact. I get the occasional hermit crab loss to the humu humu, but only 1 a month.
One other thing to condsider is that fact that aggressive tanks require more feeding, and produce more waste. This means higher nitrates. This means you will need either better biofiltration (including a refugium for nitrate removal) or frequent water changes.
The grouper will get too big , and from what I understand, they grow pretty quickly.

 

[armageddon]

The Panther Grouper is extremely fast growing. They are one of the fastest growing saltwater fish. Possibly the fastest.

 

[bbuck_camelback]

Just because you keep your aggressive fish well fed, doesn`t mean they still don`t want to eat your inverts. IMO don`t waste your money, sooner or later those inverts will be ate.

 

[acez28]

i would say get the cleanup crew.....they help with my tank alot. My puffer is a very messy eater and they usually are on what he drops in seconds.

 

[bbuck_camelback]

You got to be kidding me, he wants a panther grouper, a lionfish, and a puffer. If you don`t mind wasting money then go for it, it`s your tank.

 

[fulcrum]

The lion could care less about snails and hermits. I believe the grouper is the same. I dont have one, but I think puffers will take the time to pull dinner out of a shell, but as I said...you might lose the occasional cleanup animal. I have lost 6 hermits in 4 months to my humu humu. So he gets the satisfaction of hunting a little live food, and it cost me 6 bucks in 4 months. Hardly a waste of money.
Now I would stay completely away from anything in the shrimp and crab (other than hermits) family. Those would be dinner in a heartbeat.

 

[acez28]

not necessarily....my puffer has been living months with my CBS. My huma huma stayed 1 year with my CBS

 

[bbuck_camelback]

here is a profile of the panther grouper-
The Panther Grouper, also known as the Polka-Dot Grouper, is an off-white fish with orderly polka-dots over the entire body that add a festive touch to your aquarium. It is found in crevices and swims along the reefs of the Indo-Pacific, where it can attain a size of up to 20". The polka-dots camouflage the fish and act as a disrupter by breaking up the body shape so that other fish and would-be predators cannot identify it.
This is a very hardy and long-lived animal provided it is kept in an ample-sized, fish-only aquarium of 100 gallons or larger, with sufficient filtration. They grow rapidly, so be sure that the tank you have them in is of sufficient size.The Panther Grouper will eat any fish and invertebrates it can swallow.
In the aquarium, it can be fed a number of different foods such as dried or fresh fish, squid, prawns, silversides, freeze-dried krill, or other comparable foods.
I`m not trying to argue with you guys just stating a difference of opinion.

 

[fulcrum]

I think that's a very accurate description of the grouper. The way a grouper eats is by gulping a whole animal. It does not have the finesse to pick a hermit or snail out of a shell (like a trigger does), and it wont swallow the shell. I think the inverts referred to in that description are one's without a shell, like shrimp, slugs, crabs (that aren't hermits).
In my opinion, hermits and snails are cheap and relatively safe. You might lose a few, but that is not a huge financial loss. The benefit of the ones that survive far outweighs the loss.
I dont think you are arguing at all. The point of this board is to post as much information and points of view as possible. Keep it up!

 

[noaquariumyet]

ok so if a grouper is too big for that tank then what else would go well with the puffer and the lion....also in a large aggresive tank what keeps the tank clean, what are some algae eaters that wont get eaten by these fish...

 

[armageddon]

You might get some more results by posting a question in the aggressive forum.

 

[fulcrum]

The aggressive forum is a good idea.
They will tell you that a puffer and lion should not be in the same tank together.
I would choose one or the other, and supplement with triggers and a smaller grouper (I think miniatus is smaller).
You can keep the tank clean with hermits and snails, just know that you will lose them on occasion.