iam fed up....

[sandman12]

well i thought i had everything good to go last night with my sump. Well i didnt the water line went down and the floor is soaking wet. SOme how water is getting out, i dont know where or how. So iam going to sell it and get
canister filter(s)
HOB fuge(s)
skimmer
help me make a combanation that would work good. I was thinking 2-24" fuges,1canister filter, and 1 skimmer. mix and match to stuff to help me make the best filteration.

 

[jacksonpt]

would you care to share with us exactly what equipment you are using for your setup? Perhaps we could help you find out why the sump approach isn't working for you. Or do you just want to scrap it, take the loss on the equipment, and buy new gear?
I know I'd be happy to help out (for whatever that's worth to you). Let us know what stuff you are using, and maybe a solution can be found.
I'm not trying to push or be a jerk or anything... I just hate to see people throw in the towel.
give us a good description of your setup...
- overflow box or drilled tank? how big are the bulkhead(s)?
- what diameter tubing/pvc are you using between overflow and sump?
- how big is your sump? how is the sump designed? is there a fuge present? skimmer?
- what return pump are you using? Internal or external to the sump?
- what diameter tubing/pvc are you using between sump and tank?
- do you have any ball valves for adjusting flow?

 

[velocity]

well i have a 72 gal bowfront and my filteration is a canister, skimmer, and two powerheads if that helps.

 

[robchuck]

Were you turning the return pump off at all after you started draining water to the tank? If so, your returns might be siphoning water out of the display into your sump, and you would need to counter that with either a check valve in your return line, or even safer, by drilling a hole in the return just below the water line (in the event of a back-siphon, air enters through the hole breaking the siphon).

 

[beaslbob]

My recommendation is to add plant life and use whatever other filtering you desire. To me skimmers are over priced and create another possible failure mode and more maintenance. For a fuge to be effective it has to be a large volumn say 30-40% of the display. To me using the display for plants is 100% of display is available for plants plus much eaiser to maintain. Add some circulation and helper filtration and the system well be very easy to maintain and reliable.

 

[zanemoseley]

Geez bob why must you insist on circulating your bad info? Its kinda like if you've got somebody in the family thats slow or ignorant and whenever someone comes over to visit you gotta say don't worry about bob he's a little slow. Just kidding bob but it does irk me when we are trying to give newbie's good info and you chime in saying you don't need a skimmer, RO/DI is worthless and grow the hell outta some macros in the display.
Originally posted by beaslbob
My recommendation is to add plant life and use whatever other filtering you desire. To me skimmers are over priced and create another possible failure mode and more maintenance. For a fuge to be effective it has to be a large volumn say 30-40% of the display. To me using the display for plants is 100% of diplay for plants plus much eaiser to maintain. Add some circulation and helper filtration and the system well be very eash to maintain and reliable.

 

[jacksonpt]

I think this is one of those times when you have to look beyond what he actually typed in his post. While I do agree with some of what he said, I also know that some thing (skimmers, RO/DI, etc.) will increase your chances for success, not guarantee success.
The point is that there are several way to run a successful tank. I ran a successful tank for almost 2 years with CC/UGF, tap water, NO lights, and no skimmer.

 

[mr. angelfish]

Originally posted by zanemoseley
Geez bob why must you insist on circulating your bad info? Its kinda like if you've got somebody in the family thats slow or ignorant and whenever someone comes over to visit you gotta say don't worry about bob he's a little slow. Just kidding bob but it does irk me when we are trying to give newbie's good info and you chime in saying you don't need a skimmer, RO/DI is worthless and grow the hell outta some macros in the display.
Surprises! At first I was spectical of what Bob is trying to preach us. Done extremely research and it got me by surprise that many of things Bob have been trying to tell us was right.
Soon I am going to set up a 29 gallon with tap water like Bob have been preaching to us.
Bottomline Bob is trying to encourage us to save tonnes of money and clear up the confusion between natural's syetm v.s aquarium industries' claims. So you can be able to afford a LARGE tank one day.
Ask yourself that question? How do the lake and ocean clean their water from sewer dumpings, litters, factories' dumpings, and even public aquarium dumping saltwater in lake!? Who took care of that? Bottomline P L A N T S Just like our trees are taking care of our pollute air. Bad water = bad for us. Good water = Good for us. That includes fish. That is something that certain individual and their area should do research within your local water.
After experiment with one of my 29 gallon by using tap water along with a 24 inch CPR fuge (Algae) and I will definately post the result. Right now I am very spectical of buying a RO/DI as I had my own critical eye and have came into my realization that RO/DI do cause problems in the aquarium as claimed by many of the aquarist in several forums as the fact, itself, spoke for.
My very repuation SW LFS using tap water in their system. Something to :thinking: about that.
I am not trying to start flame wars as I feel that Bob ought have some "patting on his back" for shed us some lights to save us money, confusions, "something that we ought to be aware of something that aquarium industries may dont want us to know but your money?" and frastuations. Also thank you for educating us regard to plant as natural filtration.
So............
Your tank and your decision.........
Spectical? Unsure? Leary? Solution? How about try it and see for yourself and see that for yourself? (That what I am going to do.)
Hey Bob! Do not ever be discourage-felt and I am more than certain that someday you will be hail with respects. :happy:

 

[sandman12]

here u go jack
135gallon galls tank
overflow with 1" pvc drain with a ball valve
30 gallon sump for 150 gallons
3100 rio return pump
return line is all pvc with a ball valve
MY mom said if in a week it still leaks i have to get rid of the whole tank becuase we just got $10,000 worht of wood floors.
so i dont want to take the chance and have to get rid of the tank.
i was thinking of maybe section off about 6" from the back of the tank with glass for an in tnak fuge, but i already have water in the tank so i dunno. I wouldnt mind trying to get the wet/dry to work but its been almost a week now with lots of research and no luck. I am about 80% sure that it is not the sump leaking becuase i checked it yesterday but soemthing is and it only leaks when the system is going. I dont think its worth the chance of ruining r brand new wood floors.

 

[beaslbob]

Originally posted by Mr. Angelfish
.....
Hey Bob! Do not ever be discourage-felt and I am more than certain that someday you will be hail with respects. :happy:

To mr. anglefish. Awwwww, shuckie dern, farm out, outta state
Gee you actually confirmed what I have been saying. Boy your stock is gonna be real low here.
I know it will work for you. Just remember to get the plant life established as the very first thing. then do the rest.
Hopefully we can prevent future newbies from having dead fish, cloudy aquariums, and in the case of this thread floods.
Sandman: with your problems with the sump I recommend you do everything in the tank. To preserve your macros/plants, culture them in a seperate container. that way you can feed you tank each week and keep a fresh supply of plant life going. And your plant loving lifestock (esp tangs and angles) will love it. After awhile you will have enough the plants will last through the week. At that point things get realy easy to maintain.

 

[sandman12]

so ur saying i dont need and filteration just live plants in the display tank? Can i see a pic of ur tank please?

 

[beaslbob]

Originally posted by sandman12
so ur saying i dont need and filteration just live plants in the display tank? Can i see a pic of ur tank please?
NO what I actually stated was use plants for the primary filtration with some circulation and helper filtration. What you stated is absolutely true for FW. plants, sand, fish, no circulation of other filtration of any kind. In Fw the result is a system that ony requires replacing evap water and feeding the fish. And the fish are not only healthy buy are reproducing as well.
My 20g macro culture tank only has powerhead. the water is clear and nitrates are 0.0. My 55g was not started with plants as the first thing, I used darker rocks, and run a tetratec and sump/refug. After three months i then found out about macros and plants and macros were added. From that time on things started to stabilize. If I had done the macros/plants as the first thing then all my original problems would have been avoided.
will try to attach pic but look at saltyreefnut's tank ih his thread for trading his halimedia. He has used tap with no water changes for 26 years.

 

[sandman12]

ok looks good so what lighitng do i need for this? it will be a FOWLR with shrooms and maybe zoos. THanks alot for all ur help.
NOw iam thinking up selling my sump and spending the money on a canister filter some power heads and iam going to use my bak pak cpr skimmer, sound good? O and of course all the plants ans stuff

 

[aarone]

Originally posted by zanemoseley
Geez bob why must you insist on circulating your bad info? Its kinda like if you've got somebody in the family thats slow or ignorant and whenever someone comes over to visit you gotta say don't worry about bob he's a little slow. Just kidding bob but it does irk me when we are trying to give newbie's good info and you chime in saying you don't need a skimmer, RO/DI is worthless and grow the hell outta some macros in the display.
everyone has their opinion, and apparantley bobs works out just fine for him. he doesnt seem to have problems with his plants in the display system.
aaron

 

[azonic]

Originally posted by beaslbob
NO what I actually stated was use plants for the primary filtration with some circulation and helper filtration. What you stated is absolutely true for FW. plants, sand, fish, no circulation of other filtration of any kind. In Fw the result is a system that ony requires replacing evap water and feeding the fish. And the fish are not only healthy buy are reproducing as well.
My 20g macro culture tank only has powerhead. the water is clear and nitrates are 0.0. My 55g was not started with plants as the first thing, I used darker rocks, and run a tetratec and sump/refug. After three months i then found out about macros and plants and macros were added. From that time on things started to stabilize. If I had done the macros/plants as the first thing then all my original problems would have been avoided.
will try to attach pic but look at saltyreefnut's tank ih his thread for trading his halimedia. He has used tap with no water changes for 26 years.
You remind me of the jehovah's witness crowd that come to my door trying to preach to me about their far superior religion.

 

[jacksonpt]

Originally posted by sandman12
here u go jack
135gallon galls tank
overflow with 1" pvc drain with a ball valve
30 gallon sump for 150 gallons
3100 rio return pump
return line is all pvc with a ball valve
OK, now, do you know... is the problems due to a leak, or is the sump or tank overflowing? When you say the water level went down, do you mean the water level in the tank, or in the sump?
I assume you had everything running ok for a time (before the flood). During this time, when things were working well, how full was the sump?
The return line from the sump enters the tank... is there a spray bar bar or anything, or does the return line just empty into the tank? Is it possible for you to post a few pictures of this?
I'm sure we can get it worked out for you... it's just hard to do if I can't see the setup in person. That's why I have to ask a zillion questions.

 

[beaslbob]

Originally posted by sandman12
ok looks good so what lighitng do i need for this? it will be a FOWLR with shrooms and maybe zoos. THanks alot for all ur help.

welcome. My lighting is $7.99 4' utility fixtures. I use two and each has two tubes. So I have 4 4' tubes which were on sale fo $.88 for two tubes. They are the 3300 lumen daylight type tubes.
NOw iam thinking up selling my sump and spending the money on a canister filter some power heads and iam going to use my bak pak cpr skimmer, sound good? O and of course all the plants ans stuff
Sounds like a plan to me. Canister may be overkill and does require some upkeep. As I said before I don't like or use skimmers. You could probably get by with some powerheads for circulation and keep the skimmer and/or canister on hand for emergencies. I have a canister I got for instance. Have not turned it on for months.
You could trouble shoot you sump also. the water is comming from someplace. But I don't have a good feeling you would ever trust that especially with the concerns about the floor.

 

[nm reef]

I am going to close this thread...the potential for continued trouble in regard to advice on plants as a primary filtration is simply too much!
Please...even though the vast majority of reefkeepers will dispute the advice offered above...refrain from openly flaming a member for statements that they believe to be true. I'd like to keep our forum flame free dispite the temptation to turn up the heat!
Personally I think jacksonpt and a few others offered some advice and information that would be much more likely to be successful than the "macro solution". This forum has had numerous threads in regard to establishing a successful sump/refugium system. If you need help properly setting up either or both simply ask and I'm sure members here will help all they can. The bottom line is if a poll was conducted I'm sure that more folks would support a sump/refugium over excessive plants in the display. I'm simply saying look at numerous methods and see for yourself how many use the "macro solution" method of reefkeeping.
beaslebob....I wish you much success...seriously I do!!:thinking:

 

[bang guy]

"overflow with 1" pvc drain with a ball valve"
Is this a commercial Overflow or is it home made?
If it's homemade can you describe it in detail?
I believe this is the breakpoint for your system.