Ich all over the tank

[wattsupdoc]

Originally Posted by AquaKnight
http:///forum/post/3137373
Agreed. If you don't QT everything, it may suck, but get rid of the Hippo. The other fish are resistant enough, to combat your Ich levels with good diets. The Hippo will only continue to fester and allow the Ich to keep regenerating.
Also, add New Life Spectrum Pellets to your daily feeding routine.
WHAT! Get rid of the Hippo and let the others fight it? This is horrible advise, HORRIBLE!

You have but one real choice, tear the tank apart and hypo/copper EVERYONE! It isnt an easy choice but it's doable, I've done it myself. You just gotta quit whining about it and DO IT.

The cop out "it's a reef and it just wont happen" is just a whiney way of not buying a QT...

There are some other methods once the fish are isolated from the DT, but those require more advanced skills usually. The diatom filter will not effect a cure even with the UV. The Hippo IS NOT the cause and deserves a chance to be cured also.

Neither is adding the sump, thats not what precipitated this event.

Once you have done the hypo, then you will have a beautiful new QT and the problem will not occur again.

 

[wattsupdoc]

Originally Posted by jackri
http:///forum/post/3137641
You're a long ways off before I would even consider another fish. You still may end up with a total loss or not losing any and then I would wait 2 months of not seeing any ich in the tank before I made any additions or you could be repeating the cycle with a new stressed fish.
Ich sucks, period.
Do not add any new fish until you have effected a cure and obtained a QT!

 

[aquaknight]

Originally Posted by wattsupdoc
http:///forum/post/3137664
WHAT! Get rid of the Hippo and let the others fight it? This is horrible advise, HORRIBLE!

You have but one real choice, tear the tank apart and hypo/copper EVERYONE! It isnt an easy choice but it's doable, I've done it myself. You just gotta quit whining about it and DO IT.

The cop out "it's a reef and it just wont happen" is just a whiney way of not buying a QT...

There are some other methods once the fish are isolated from the DT, but those require more advanced skills usually. The diatom filter will not effect a cure even with the UV. The Hippo IS NOT the cause and deserves a chance to be cured also.

Neither is adding the sump, thats not what precipitated this event.

Once you have done the hypo, then you will have a beautiful new QT and the problem will not occur again.

What can I say? Judging from the responses from the OP, it doesn't seem like any amount of "drilling" on an online forum, is going to get him to setup a QT. Based off that, I gave my reply. I have a bit of firsthand experience with Ich infested fish, and not treating. They are the ones in our 90gal reef currently, and very similar fish, Yellow tang, chalk basses, clownfish, anthias, and a cardinal. Fed a well rounded diets, their health improved, and I see no signs of Ich, or on new additions I've added since. Some fish, IMO/IME, like my Burrfish or Hippo tangs, can not fight Ich and have to be treated, but given the list he has, I feel he can.
I'm not trying to say it's better then QTing. Of course removing all the fish to QT for 6 weeks, I'd never recommend 3, is the best idea. I just don't see the OP doing it %%.
Originally Posted by jackri
http:///forum/post/3137641
You're a long ways off before I would even consider another fish. You still may end up with a total loss or not losing any and then I would wait 2 months of not seeing any ich in the tank before I made any additions or you could be repeating the cycle with a new stressed fish.
Ich sucks, period.
Indeed, after you remove the Hippo, definitely have at least 2 months, after the fish come up to health, before you even start consider another fish.

 

[geckoxp]

Originally Posted by wattsupdoc
http:///forum/post/3137670
Do not add any new fish until you have effected a cure and obtained a QT!

Who said I was going to add fish in the tank after I lost a couple and dealing with this issue that could take months to get over? I was simply asking on a whim what would be a good addition (down the road). I am giving the hippo every chance I can get to get over this and from the looks of it he is winning the battle a bit with some of the changes I have made.
I'm trying to get through this issue and have it gone before doing any further additions on anything period. Going through this crap is a good learning experience more then anything...
I never took the advice to get rid of the hippo and wont because I love the species more then anything. I understand now that they are not an easy fish to keep like some make it out to be...I plan on heading to my LFS and seeing if they can help QT since I have invested a small fortune with them on the setup...maybe asking to much but hey its a shot if they can do it.
Catching all the fish and putting them in the right size tank is not a small task that everyone seems to make it out to be....

 

[geckoxp]

Before this gets out of hand here...I love how people assume that this and that will not happen. I guess maybe I need to explain myself here. I am going to try and fight the war IN THE TANK!! I do not have room for a large 50+G tank to put the fish into..PERIOD. I have my other half bitching about things as it is and having to set that up at the moment is NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.
My plan now is if the LFS could possibly help me out with the hippo since he is the most affected by ich right now. My other fish such as the yellow tang, gramma, blenny, percs, diamond goby, wrasse are seemingly doing ok right now with retreating signs of infection...my hippo is looking better as well surprisingly...not cured but doing better. He is not going down the toilet PERIOD.
So before people go through the ringer I have certain things I have to deal with and restrictions that are preventing me from going out and getting a fully blown huge QT tank for ALL the fish...
Again...I appreciate all the help! I understand what needs to be done and I am working with what I can to do the right thing. No fish, no additions, no nothing will happen in quite some time and way after I deal with ich and setting up a small QT tank for new additions.
Thank you again!

 

[cranberry]

Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3134189
The higher temp does nothing to ich...it just makes the fish happier and stronger.
What is your basis for this statement? I would like to have a discussion about that in general.
But in the meantime....
In dealing with ich, I feel it's potentially harmful advice. I mean no disrespect.
Ich loves the gills, so a fishes respiratory status is already compromised. Besides direct gill filament damage, the mere presence of the parasites cluched on the filaments impedes gas exchange. Increasing the temperature reduces the waters capacity to retain 02 making less 02 available to the fish. They have to gill harder to keep their blood concentration up. Many fish die of hypoxia from the ick alone in a tank supersaturated with 02. We would not be helping by making less available.
Ich reproduces faster at higher temperatures. In an environment without a treatment present that is simply creating more parasites to suckle on your fish. You want to slooooow the cycle while trying to improve the tank's environment and the fishes overall health so they don't have to contend with massive numbers while you prime them.
Increased numbers of ich, reduced available 02, speeding of up the metabolism and making the fish more "active" will cause stress.... giving ich another foothold.

 

[outlaw69]

Good luck I just went through the same thing. Lucky for me my tank is f & LR so I finally used copper after using ick attack for two weeks. I lost 2 cromis a orange shoulder tang and a humu trigger. Mine turned out to be velvet the copper cleared it up on the remaining fish which I almost lost my dog face puffer came out of it with a big sore on its side and about half of its fins gone and the other humu trigger was getting gaps in its tail. I used copper and metrodinazole and brought them back from the dead they have both recovered and are growing their fins and healing well. it sucks hard I feel your pain I also thought that I didn't have room or money for a QT but it is alot less expensive than the money I spent fighting the disease. I just set up a 20 gal long. and nothing will go into any of my other three tanks without going in there first. once again good luck and I hope everything turns out for the best

 

[geckoxp]

Originally Posted by outlaw69
http:///forum/post/3139973
Good luck I just went through the same thing. Lucky for me my tank is f & LR so I finally used copper after using ick attack for two weeks. I lost 2 cromis a orange shoulder tang and a humu trigger. Mine turned out to be velvet the copper cleared it up on the remaining fish which I almost lost my dog face puffer came out of it with a big sore on its side and about half of its fins gone and the other humu trigger was getting gaps in its tail. I used copper and metrodinazole and brought them back from the dead they have both recovered and are growing their fins and healing well. it sucks hard I feel your pain I also thought that I didn't have room or money for a QT but it is alot less expensive than the money I spent fighting the disease. I just set up a 20 gal long. and nothing will go into any of my other three tanks without going in there first. once again good luck and I hope everything turns out for the best
Ha yah thanks for the advice...I lost the flame angel, 2 firefish, bicolor blenny to it so far but all the rest but the hippo and yellow tang are affected...slowly but surely they are getting better as the ich is dieing off in the tank before they attach to the fish. I picked up a cleaner shrimp with a couple more going in before the end of this. No other fish or coral are going in until well after this is well over...and then before going in more caution will be taken!!! I have a new lighting system on the way so I am going to focus in on other things before more livestock goes in the tank.

 

[jemshores]

Hi Gecko...I have a post in this section regarding the use of a product my LFS uses; with proven success. If you are willing to think outside the box, especially with us reef tank keepers, take a look at it. I have not completed the treatment (one more day before 25% WC) but my fish/tank look wonderful. Is this a long term "cure"...I don't know. But the other methods of treatment don't guarantee that ich won't reappear either. I just happened to choose this method and I am thrilled.

 

[florida joe]

Originally Posted by Cranberry
http:///forum/post/3137755
What is your basis for this statement? I would like to have a discussion about that in general.
But in the meantime....
In dealing with ich, I feel it's potentially harmful advice. I mean no disrespect.
Ich loves the gills, so a fishes respiratory status is already compromised. Besides direct gill filament damage, the mere presence of the parasites cluched on the filaments impedes gas exchange. Increasing the temperature reduces the waters capacity to retain 02 making less 02 available to the fish. They have to gill harder to keep their blood concentration up. Many fish die of hypoxia from the ick alone in a tank supersaturated with 02. We would not be helping by making less available.
Ich reproduces faster at higher temperatures. In an environment without a treatment present that is simply creating more parasites to suckle on your fish. You want to slooooow the cycle while trying to improve the tank's environment and the fishes overall health so they don't have to contend with massive numbers while you prime them.
Increased numbers of ich, reduced available 02, speeding of up the metabolism and making the fish more "active" will cause stress.... giving ich another foothold.

What is your basis for this statement? I would like to have a discussion about that in general.
The reason behind the high
Temperature is to speed up the metabolism of the ich parasite, causing it to go through its life cycle faster allowing the hobbyist to treat the parasite in its vulnerable stages in a shorter overall time frame

 

[florida joe]

Originally Posted by Cranberry
http:///forum/post/3137755
What is your basis for this statement? I would like to have a discussion about that in general.
But in the meantime....
In dealing with ich, I feel it's potentially harmful advice. I mean no disrespect.
Ich loves the gills, so a fishes respiratory status is already compromised. Besides direct gill filament damage, the mere presence of the parasites cluched on the filaments impedes gas exchange. Increasing the temperature reduces the waters capacity to retain 02 making less 02 available to the fish. They have to gill harder to keep their blood concentration up. Many fish die of hypoxia from the ick alone in a tank supersaturated with 02. We would not be helping by making less available.
Ich reproduces faster at higher temperatures. In an environment without a treatment present that is simply creating more parasites to suckle on your fish. You want to slooooow the cycle while trying to improve the tank's environment and the fishes overall health so they don't have to contend with massive numbers while you prime them.
Increased numbers of ich, reduced available 02, speeding of up the metabolism and making the fish more "active" will cause stress.... giving ich another foothold.
Cran
The reason behind the high
Temperature is to speed up the metabolism of the ich parasite, causing it to go through its life cycle faster allowing the hobbyist to treat the parasite in its vulnerable stages in a shorter overall time frame

 

[cranberry]

Ya, I get that it makes the cycle go faster.... but there are way more important things to consider like the three reasons I outlined. If the mode of treatment does more harm than good and isn't necessary, it should be avoided IMO.
My inquiry was really about the statement "The higher temp does nothing to ich...it just makes the fish happier and stronger.". THAT'S what I would like some data on.

 

[florida joe]

Don’t hold your breath