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bywalker
Guest
Please ID this lion. It is about 2 1/2 inches.
jonthefishguy
Active Member
From what I can tell from a not that great of a photo, it seems it is a Spotfin lionfish. It is very similar in color to the Volitan Lionfish. However, the distinguishing white bands and the color pattern between the two make me choose Spotted over Volitan. Also Spotfinned ones have black,blue or brown dots on its pectoral fins when they are flared out.
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bywalker
Guest
I looked and could not ID it. It is in a store right now and they are saying it is a dwarf of some kind, I am just not sure what kind of dwarf it is. Here is another pic. Sorry this is the best I can get. His body is approximately 2 inches long. He has two horns, comming out of his head, that are distinguishing traits.
jonthefishguy
Active Member
Thats not a dwarf. That is a Pterois Anrennata aka Spotfin Lionfish.
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bywalker
Guest
Whats the min tank size for this guy?
jonthefishguy
Active Member
30 gallon but I say more like a 5 gallon to be comfortable and it gets about 8 inches. And eats anything that it can put in its mouth. Dont think that mouth cant open, it opens VERY wide. loves shrimp and other fish.
sepulatian
Moderator
With the pics given it cannot be confirmed that this fish is a Pterois antennata, AKA spotfin. It could very well be a Pterois radiata AKA Radiata. I would not put either one in anything under a 75. They both reach 8-9+ inches.
jonthefishguy
Active Member
I just saw your new pic. It actually is a Clearfin and not a spotfin. I can see the distinguishing white markings better and they are not in the same pattern as you would see in the spotfin. Not to mention I can vaguely see the skin on the fin and it looks more to be the clearfin which is also known as Radiata ad it gets about 10 inches.
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bywalker
Guest
The LFS is stating that it is a dwarf clearfin. Is that possible?
From my research it fits the description of an antennata. If in fact it is an antennata what is the min tank size for that species?
From my research it fits the description of an antennata. If in fact it is an antennata what is the min tank size for that species?
sepulatian
Moderator
Originally Posted by bywalker
The LFS is stating that it is a dwarf clearfin. Is that possible?
From my research it fits the description of an antennata. If in fact it is an antennata what is the min tank size for that species?
There is no dwarf clearfin that I am aware of. Spotfins grow to over 7.8 inches. I would recommend at least a 75.
The LFS is stating that it is a dwarf clearfin. Is that possible?
From my research it fits the description of an antennata. If in fact it is an antennata what is the min tank size for that species?
There is no dwarf clearfin that I am aware of. Spotfins grow to over 7.8 inches. I would recommend at least a 75.
ocean predator
Member
preity positive its a radiata lion
srfisher17
Active Member
I'm not sure; so I'll play politician and just say it is either a radiata or an antennata. In either case, it is NOT a dwarf and needs room. Some lfs would call a 2" panther grouper a "dwarf"; which I guess they are, for about a week.
fmarini
Member
It is a P Antennata, and while pointing out the different ocular projections is one way of ID'ing these fish, its not always accurate. Just remember that many P volitans and Russells w/ loose these ocular projections w/ age, and P Mombassae have the exact same as P antennata. In this case it worked only becuase you omitted P Mombassae from your search
Also those confused about P Radiatas, the easiest way to tell is look at the caudal peduncle. Only radiatas have 2 white lateral stripes.
Next, In my opinion calling these fish by their common name is nothing short of confusing: spotfins, clearfin, etc. If you look thru Scott michaels book, he called P Russells "clearfin" lions, P Volitans are called turkeyfish, what huh. Many lionfish have eye spots on their fins. P mombassase got a ton of them- they call them "devil lion"-why-not call them "alotta spotfin lion"?
If anyone cares to look up husbandry info on lionfish as well as pictures for ID feel free to google search for the "lionfish info sheet" --the first hit will pull it up, plenty of pictures, and you can see what I mentioned above
frank
Also those confused about P Radiatas, the easiest way to tell is look at the caudal peduncle. Only radiatas have 2 white lateral stripes.
Next, In my opinion calling these fish by their common name is nothing short of confusing: spotfins, clearfin, etc. If you look thru Scott michaels book, he called P Russells "clearfin" lions, P Volitans are called turkeyfish, what huh. Many lionfish have eye spots on their fins. P mombassase got a ton of them- they call them "devil lion"-why-not call them "alotta spotfin lion"?
If anyone cares to look up husbandry info on lionfish as well as pictures for ID feel free to google search for the "lionfish info sheet" --the first hit will pull it up, plenty of pictures, and you can see what I mentioned above
frank
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bywalker
Guest
Wonderful, well the LFS assured me that they are experts and said he is some form of an dwarf antennata and talked me into getting him. They assured me he was fine in my 30g nano. Now I am not so sure.
I will moniter him and keep you all posted. His first night he ate a ghost shrimp, but will not eat Mysis yet. He seems to be doing find and perching on rockwork and on the sand searching at night. Nonetheless, he has to eat and I am sure I will spend more time getting him to eat than the LFS. He is in my 30g nano with a baby SFE and a baby valentini puffer. The SFE is 5 inches and the puffer is 1.5 inches.
Question is, since he seems like one of the smaller (full size) lions, how long can I keep him in this setup before I need to get rid of him or upgrade his home. Right now his main body is slightly under 2 inches.
FYI: Before I get reccomendations to take him back, my last resort at this point is to take him back to the LFS. They probably dont care wether or not he eats and/or finds a good home since they cannot even properly ID him. I dont want to stress him out anymore than necessary, just to have him sold to someone else who will run into the same problem. His best bet for survival at this point is with me. Any advise would be great, now after the fact.
Thanks.
I will moniter him and keep you all posted. His first night he ate a ghost shrimp, but will not eat Mysis yet. He seems to be doing find and perching on rockwork and on the sand searching at night. Nonetheless, he has to eat and I am sure I will spend more time getting him to eat than the LFS. He is in my 30g nano with a baby SFE and a baby valentini puffer. The SFE is 5 inches and the puffer is 1.5 inches.
Question is, since he seems like one of the smaller (full size) lions, how long can I keep him in this setup before I need to get rid of him or upgrade his home. Right now his main body is slightly under 2 inches.
FYI: Before I get reccomendations to take him back, my last resort at this point is to take him back to the LFS. They probably dont care wether or not he eats and/or finds a good home since they cannot even properly ID him. I dont want to stress him out anymore than necessary, just to have him sold to someone else who will run into the same problem. His best bet for survival at this point is with me. Any advise would be great, now after the fact.
Thanks.
fmarini
Member
Ya know what----
let me play devils advocate here, lets assume your LFS has it right.
I say this becuase primarily we're trying to ID this fish based off a few crappy cell phone pixs.
So let me ask..... on the pec fin membranes--do you see lateral stripes(like you see here: http://www.shallenbergerphoto.com/pages/Lionfish2.htm), or eye spots.(do you have the lionfish info sheet to know what I'm talking about)
I don't see eye spots, also the Pec fin rays appear reddish.
Assuming from above, it would ID this fish as Pterois Sphex, the hawaiian lionfish.
It would be a smaller sized lionfish approx 7" (not really a dwarf but smaller than a full sized antennata), and they look similar if not identical to a P Antennata when juvenile (yet another reason not to use ocular projections as identifiers), but dont look anything like an antennata when adult.Obviously you got a very small juvie fish
Could it be?????
You got a better picture yet?
Lastly, expect the lionfish to eat only live food for the first few weeks or more. You have get these guys acclimated to your tank and feel good, before you start the weaning process. Lots of live ghost shrimp please
frank
let me play devils advocate here, lets assume your LFS has it right.
I say this becuase primarily we're trying to ID this fish based off a few crappy cell phone pixs.
So let me ask..... on the pec fin membranes--do you see lateral stripes(like you see here: http://www.shallenbergerphoto.com/pages/Lionfish2.htm), or eye spots.(do you have the lionfish info sheet to know what I'm talking about)
I don't see eye spots, also the Pec fin rays appear reddish.
Assuming from above, it would ID this fish as Pterois Sphex, the hawaiian lionfish.
It would be a smaller sized lionfish approx 7" (not really a dwarf but smaller than a full sized antennata), and they look similar if not identical to a P Antennata when juvenile (yet another reason not to use ocular projections as identifiers), but dont look anything like an antennata when adult.Obviously you got a very small juvie fish
Could it be?????
You got a better picture yet?
Lastly, expect the lionfish to eat only live food for the first few weeks or more. You have get these guys acclimated to your tank and feel good, before you start the weaning process. Lots of live ghost shrimp please
frank
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bywalker
Guest
Well, not quite sure what happened but he died. I woke up this morning and he was stuck between two rocks with his mouth wide open. He seemed fine the day before. I called the LFS and told them that #1: I dont believe the lion was a dwarf, and #2: he died. They said it probably was because he choked on the ghost shrimp he ate. Anyway, they are going to order me a true dwarf zebra, which is what I was looking for all along. Too bad, cuz this guy was real cool looking.
After analyzing him more, I am almost possitive he was an antennata.
After analyzing him more, I am almost possitive he was an antennata.