My project has officially started... I'm going to have some questions

crimzy

crimzy

Active Member
It's not quite the magnitude of some of the other projects around here but it's going to be pretty time consuming and I'm going to have a few questions as things go.
The final project will be:
300 gallon display on the main floor with plumbing into the basement. Filtration will be a 50 gallon refugium and then a 300 gallon rubbermaid sump. The goals here are (1) larger tank, more fish of course, and (2) ease of maintenance. I will have a bin/rubbermaid just to keep some mixed saltwater in for ease of water changes.
As of today, I have started the process by hiring the plumber to install the laundry tub sink in the basement. I have also located a couple of options to pick up the sump but I have to find some time to get out there.
The display will be a 300 gallon acrylic (96" x 24" x 30") unless I happen to find a larger, used tank for a reasonable price before I buy.
Here are a couple of my initial questions:
The tank will sit perpendicular to the floor joists on an internal wall. Should I reinforce the floor? How?
300 gallon acrylic comes in 1/2" and 3/4". Is there a real risk to going with the 1/2"? Do you think it's likely to crack?
What size pvc should the overflow be drilled for and how many lines?
What size return line and what size return pump? The distance from the sump to the display will probably be about 12-15 feet.
As far as transferring my current tank over, I am planning to set up the system and let it run for a while just to assure that it's stable before I move my fish, rock and sand over. Of course, I'll get used rock and sand for the new tank and then just add mine to it. Anyone have a better idea?
I'm sure I'll think of more questions as I go. Thanks for any advice.
 
spiderwoman

spiderwoman

Active Member
Sounds like a very exciting project. I for one will be keeping my eye on it !!!
Are you planning on running a closed loop?
 
crimzy

crimzy

Active Member
Originally Posted by SpiderWoman
http:///forum/post/2559790
Sounds like a very exciting project. I for one will be keeping my eye on it !!!
Are you planning on running a closed loop?
No, I don't think so. The tank will be FOWLR. No need to over-complicate the situation.
 
kjr_trig

kjr_trig

Active Member
Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2559787
It's not quite the magnitude of some of the other projects around here but it's going to be pretty time consuming and I'm going to have a few questions as things go.
The final project will be:
300 gallon display on the main floor with plumbing into the basement. Filtration will be a 50 gallon refugium and then a 300 gallon rubbermaid sump. The goals here are (1) larger tank, more fish of course, and (2) ease of maintenance. I will have a bin/rubbermaid just to keep some mixed saltwater in for ease of water changes.
As of today, I have started the process by hiring the plumber to install the laundry tub sink in the basement. I have also located a couple of options to pick up the sump but I have to find some time to get out there.
The display will be a 300 gallon acrylic (96" x 24" x 30") unless I happen to find a larger, used tank for a reasonable price before I buy.
Here are a couple of my initial questions:
The tank will sit perpendicular to the floor joists on an internal wall. Should I reinforce the floor? How?
300 gallon acrylic comes in 1/2" and 3/4". Is there a real risk to going with the 1/2"? Do you think it's likely to crack?
What size pvc should the overflow be drilled for and how many lines?
What size return line and what size return pump? The distance from the sump to the display will probably be about 12-15 feet.
As far as transferring my current tank over, I am planning to set up the system and let it run for a while just to assure that it's stable before I move my fish, rock and sand over. Of course, I'll get used rock and sand for the new tank and then just add mine to it. Anyone have a better idea?
I'm sure I'll think of more questions as I go. Thanks for any advice.

Awesome project Crimzy, your Ray (and whatever else) will like their new tank.
I just went through a lot of you are asking as I was between the 240 and 300, I went 240 as a lot of people convinced me 30 inch tanks were tough to clean and work on....Don't listen, do the 300

Can't answer the ? about the floor, I emailed my builder the specs and got the ok
I wouldn't think any risk in 1/2 inch whatsoever, my 240 is 3/8 acrylic.
I have 2 overflows with 1 inch bulkheads, had I done the 300 that wouldn't have changed...Build Durso Standpipes for the overflow, they are awesome, easy to do and far quieter than the junk Tenecor did for me, there is a great DIY website for them when the time comes.
My understanding is distance from the sump doesn't matter, it only matters how much higher the return has to go (I could be wrong)...I have a Mag 18, I would do the next size up, I think its the 24....I just like Mag pumps, very reliable.
You going to do black sand again?
 
crimzy

crimzy

Active Member
Originally Posted by kjr_trig
http:///forum/post/2559860
Awesome project Crimzy, your Ray (and whatever else) will like their new tank.
I just went through a lot of you are asking as I was between the 240 and 300, I went 240 as a lot of people convinced me 30 inch tanks were tough to clean and work on....Don't listen, do the 300

Can't answer the ? about the floor, I emailed my builder the specs and got the ok
I wouldn't think any risk in 1/2 inch whatsoever, my 240 is 3/8 acrylic.
I have 2 overflows with 1 inch bulkheads, had I done the 300 that wouldn't have changed...Build Durso Standpipes for the overflow, they are awesome, easy to do and far quieter than the junk Tenecor did for me, there is a great DIY website for them when the time comes.
My understanding is distance from the sump doesn't matter, it only matters how much higher the return has to go (I could be wrong)...I have a Mag 18, I would do the next size up, I think its the 24....I just like Mag pumps, very reliable.
You going to do black sand again?
Definitely going to go with the black sand. I like mag pumps too... have the 18 in my 225 but I didn't know if I'd need something external.
I'll do white sand in the sump, with a bunch of critters, inverts and some damsels or other small fish just to get rid of uneaten food.
 
scopus tang

scopus tang

Active Member
Sounds like a very exciting project. I'm not an expert by any means, but I think that I would definitely have the floor checked out prior to the build. You may get told you're ok, but I would be pretty iffy on a tank that large. You may have to go in and put a support beam beneath the floor joists the same direction as the tank. Could require anything from a couple of 2x6s to a laminate beam depending on your joist span and size. JMO. I'll also be following this thread.
 
crimzy

crimzy

Active Member
Well I'm starting to get things ready in the basement. I'm doing the system backwards, fuge and sump first, then plumbing, then I will connect the tank last when everything else is set up.
I had a nice surprise today. I was getting set for the new sink and sump coming Monday and I noticed that the wall where the tank will sit has the house's support beam directly beneath it.

I'm still going to talk to a builder about whether I need to reinforce the floor in some way, but at this point I'm optimistic. If there is anyone in building or construction here that can give me their opinions then I'd really appreciate it. Thanks.
 
veni vidi vici

veni vidi vici

Active Member
Crimzy ,your floor will be ok.Just make sure that the weight is distributed evenly.A steel stand with legs is likely to poke holes through the floor if there arent any joist directly below them.Im a union carpenter and ive been building homes for 20+ years .Just to give you a little background on my knowledge.
I guess i should tell you this too.your floor joist are wood,and wood does flex and twist over time so at some point some where down the road it "May or may not" need to be beefed up like Scopus said.But there wont be any immediate concern.No tank crashing through floor in the middle of night lol.
 
crimzy

crimzy

Active Member
Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/2563437
Crimzy ,your floor will be ok.Just make sure that the weight is distributed evenly.A steel stand with legs is likely to poke holes through the floor if there arent any joist directly below them.Im a union carpenter and ive been building homes for 20+ years .Just to give you a little background on my knowledge.
I guess i should tell you this too.your floor joist are wood,and wood does flex and twist over time so at some point some where down the road it "May or may not" need to be beefed up like Scopus said.But there wont be any immediate concern.No tank crashing through floor in the middle of night lol.
That's good to know.
The other thing that I've been thinking about is how to do the transfer and stabilize the system. I was considering putting ls and lr into the sump with a powerhead and trying to start a cycle in there before adding the display to the system.
Then when the display comes, I will use all of the lr, ls, and water that I currently have. Should I just change all my lr, ls and water and fish at once? I will have to add some new sand and water (of course) at that point. Or should I play it safe and try to get a cycle started in the display before moving everything over? What do you think?
 
crimzy

crimzy

Active Member
There's been an interesting turn of events. I have located a guy here, and accepted his offer to buy his 450 gallon tank (96" x 36" x 30").
This is much better than I expected. Assuming that there are no problems, I will be getting the tank, stand, canopy and 5 metal halide lights for less than I was going to spend on a new 300 gallon with stand and canopy.

I'm definitely going to reinforce the floor now.

(I hesitate to even post this for fear of jinxing things but I can't restrain myself).
 
kjr_trig

kjr_trig

Active Member
Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2564881
There's been an interesting turn of events. I have located a guy here, and accepted his offer to buy his 450 gallon tank (96" x 36" x 30").
This is much better than I expected. Assuming that there are no problems, I will be getting the tank, stand, canopy and 5 metal halide lights for less than I was going to spend on a new 300 gallon with stand and canopy.

I'm definitely going to reinforce the floor now.

(I hesitate to even post this for fear of jinxing things but I can't restrain myself).
Very cool, 36 inch base you can do amazing aquascaping...Do the metal halides change your plans at all? Reef tank?
 
crimzy

crimzy

Active Member
Originally Posted by kjr_trig
http:///forum/post/2565055
Very cool, 36 inch base you can do amazing aquascaping...Do the metal halides change your plans at all? Reef tank?
Well, they do a bit. I will add a few corals here and there but I won't fill the thing with corals. All of my fish are reef safe but I don't want anything like xenia that will sting my ray, and I can't do much in the way of inverts. But I'll have a little fun with zoos and shrooms and some simple, colorful stuff.
 
al mc

al mc

Active Member
Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2563586
That's good to know.
The other thing that I've been thinking about is how to do the transfer and stabilize the system. I was considering putting ls and lr into the sump with a powerhead and trying to start a cycle in there before adding the display to the system.
Then when the display comes, I will use all of the lr, ls, and water that I currently have. Should I just change all my lr, ls and water and fish at once? I will have to add some new sand and water (of course) at that point. Or should I play it safe and try to get a cycle started in the display before moving everything over? What do you think?
Congrats on the 450g! Personally I would discard the old sand or be prepared to rinse it very well. The amount of s..it in it would amaze you and pollute the new set up. I would also have all the LR you are planning to use cured in advance then make the transfer all in one day IF you can get enough water prepared to fill the system. With 450 gallons I would suggest an external pump..like a sequence hammerhead..even the mag 36 may not move enough water for you. I had one originally on a 175g reef/100 gallon refugium and felt the Mag36 was not moving enough water from the basement to the first floor display.
 
scopus tang

scopus tang

Active Member
Personally, I would keep the top 1" or 2" of your existing sand; if you rinse or toss it, you will lose all your benefical microfauna. Rinsing the remaining sand is up to you, personally I don't, as I want to transfer as much of the existing bacteria as possible. I would as stated precure all your LR ahead of time if possible. Being able to add everything at once, although it can make for a very long day or weekend, is less stressful on everthing in the end. Good luck, and get lots of help ~ thats a huge system to move.
 
crimzy

crimzy

Active Member
Originally Posted by Scopus Tang
http:///forum/post/2567922
Personally, I would keep the top 1" or 2" of your existing sand; if you rinse or toss it, you will lose all your benefical microfauna. Rinsing the remaining sand is up to you, personally I don't, as I want to transfer as much of the existing bacteria as possible. I would as stated precure all your LR ahead of time if possible. Being able to add everything at once, although it can make for a very long day or weekend, is less stressful on everthing in the end. Good luck, and get lots of help ~ thats a huge system to move.
I'm going to keep all of my existing sand. I have to add more so I want to keep as much bacteria as possible. By the time I add the sand/fish/rock to the display, I plan to have the new system running with new sand in the display and cycled sand/rock in the sump. I will let/force the system to cycle before moving everything over from my display. At least this is the plan as of now.
 
scopus tang

scopus tang

Active Member
Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2567964
I'm going to keep all of my existing sand. I have to add more so I want to keep as much bacteria as possible. By the time I add the sand/fish/rock to the display, I plan to have the new system running with new sand in the display and cycled sand/rock in the sump. I will let/force the system to cycle before moving everything over from my display. At least this is the plan as of now.
Sounds good, keep the top 1 to 2 inches of your existing sand as the final layer of sand for you new system. If you can, use baserock to create the base of your rockwork so that it is already present beneath the sand bed and you don't have to disrupt your sandbed once you add the the cured LR. Just a suggestion.
 
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