New hobbyist having trouble with skimmer among other things...

[schiller]

Hello Everyone!
I have been reading for months and *attempting* to get myself going right (though I know I have done a few things awry already...), but I have been having some issues that I can't seem to find an answer to. I was hoping to pick a few expert brains for advice. I will start with the major specific issues, followed by my specs in case it will help with some insight. I know this is long, so sorry in advance. Here goes:
First of all, I FINALLY received my protein skimmer in the mail today, and kicking my hind end now. Not only is it a headache causer.. (I was so excited at how quiet my setup was prior to its installation), but it stops my heart every time I mess with it. Anytime I try to adjust it (whether that is to remove the cup or change its placement) the cycle suction on the "return side of the box?" is lost and quickly fills up to overflow onto my floor before it catches up with itself... Secondly, (given it has only been on a few hours) there is no scum film goodness produced (I know I should leave it overnight, or days, but I am really concerned about it overflowing. What if I loose power and this flows straight on the floor?? I do live in the country and it happens..more often than not...). Thirdly, I have bubbles galore in the "bubble producing area" but foam that raises up? um, no...maybe 1/4" of it at best regardless of where I put the reservoir cup. Yes, I have held my finger over the air tube to prime the sucker...and yes, it almost over flowed.. and what do I do? I try it again! and again..and again... still this little amount of foam. Lastly as far as the skimmer is concerned, What level do I place the cup? I remember reading about skimming wet with it in the water, or skimming dry...but I am not sure. I've placed it where the bubbles reach the bottom of the outside of the collection cup (is this dry?)...I've placed it where they come up the tube half way...(wet?) I dunno..no change...and where is that foam?? Is my tank just that clean? can't be! I've had some fish, live rock, etc for...a month now? I am crystal clear though (love that!) I would love to just take this sucker off, but I wanna be the best that I can be to my little guys...
OK, I think the thing that bothers me most the next is the behavior my Royal Gramma has taken on... He is rubbing his cheek on the rock, and today the sand... I have looked his over until I am cross-eyed. I see no trauma, no parasites, no obvious signs of irritation.. He eats, he sleeps, and I am sure he poops *feels like she is describing her babies* A few (the best I can identify) common bristle worms have creeped into view since I have rearranged my live rock, but I have not seen any contact made between the two. (I've tried to catch these buggers unsuccessfully...I have tried to make a trap..unsuccessfully... I will try a trap again I guess). Water quality is good... (I check daily and have never seen a fluctuation except a little on SG and I have used RO water. I keep it at 1.0245, temp has never budged from 78, pH hangs around 8.2, 0 nitrates, 0 nitrites, 0 ammonia) any ideas?
The next thing that has me concerned is stocking the tank. I am so worried about overstocking, but about three different sources have all told me my list is good to go. Mind if I post it for you to give it a glance over? I'd hate to get to my goal (LPS!!! YAY!!) and find out I can't have it because of something I put in there already. Just how many corals could I stock my 56gal Column with (esp when considering my fish list) before it would be way too much? There HAS to be a limit somewhere and everyone just seems to shrug when I ask.
Here is the list, followed by my tank equipment. I've tried to check for compatibility:
Fish:
(2) Ocellaris clowns (have 1 atm)
(1) Royal Gramma
(1) Purple firefish Goby
(1) Yellow watchman goby (on the wish list...is he gonna be okay with the above?)
(2) Spotted Pajama Cardinals (on wish list. I know not to mix species and to add them at the same time)
(1) Dwarf Flame Angelfish or Coral Beauty Angelfish (on wish list. Questionable seeing my LPS goal?)
I know that Tangs, Damselfish, Triggerfish, Butterflies, are a no no and Mandarins only in 1.5+ yr tank with copopods, etc..
Inverts:
(2) Skunk Cleaner Shrimp
(1) Peppermint shrimp
(1) Hermit Crab (I have an electric blue knuckle, but he has taken residence in a cave and won't come out *sniffle* )
(???) snails - I know it is recommended to have...a couple dozen I guess? but my LFS says no on them... Should I split the difference with 10 bumblebees? or go all out and get 10 bumble, 10 nassarius, and 2 turbo? Is Hermie going to bother the snails?
I'd love a feather duster, clam, and brittle star too. Clam will come with the LPS though.
LPS coral is my goal, but I'm not gonna list those How many would be the right amount with the above? Could I get a max of about 10? 5? Don't you think there is too much above for my LPS goal?
Here is my equipment:
56 gal Column (of which I am having trouble stacking my rock high enough.. I've got them slightly over half atm)
Radion XR30 (coming for Christmas)
Vortech MP10 pump (by Christmas)
Vortech battery backup (on that ever-growing wish list)
Fluval 306 Canister
Reef Octopus HOB BH1000
200W heater
15lbs sand (just a column guys, not as big of a footprint here..)
45lbs Fiji live rock that came with bristle worms and aiptasia...unfortunately not all the fun things I have read others receiving. I am fighting my aiptasia. I'm down to just one I hope, but he keeps coming back after my treatments...)
I think that sums it up for now. Thanks in advance for any advice!

 

[snakeblitz33]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schiller http:///t/392664/new-hobbyist-having-trouble-with-skimmer-among-other-things#post_3488185
Hello Everyone! Hi!

Welcome to the forums. I hope you enjoy your stay.
I have been reading for months and *attempting* to get myself going right (though I know I have done a few things awry already...), but I have been having some issues that I can't seem to find an answer to. I was hoping to pick a few expert brains for advice. I will start with the major specific issues, followed by my specs in case it will help with some insight. I know this is long, so sorry in advance. No problem. We like questions here, and we love to give answers. Here goes:
First of all, I FINALLY received my protein skimmer in the mail today,WooHOO!!! and kicking my hind end now.

Not only is it a headache causer.. (I was so excited at how quiet my setup was prior to its installation), but it stops my heart every time I mess with it. Anytime I try to adjust it (whether that is to remove the cup or change its placement) the cycle suction on the "return side of the box?" is lost and quickly fills up to overflow onto my floor before it catches up with itself... A video would be better. Or, a picture would be ok too... I know the skimmer you are talking about, but I'm not sure what you are referencing. Secondly, (given it has only been on a few hours) there is no scum film goodness produced (I know I should leave it overnight, or days, but I am really concerned about it overflowing. You got to leave it on or else it won't produce skimmate. It also takes a few days to "break in" and produce skimmate. The break in period varies with each skimmer and each setup. What if I loose power and this flows straight on the floor?? It looks like it has a built in overflow in it that is big enough to drain all the excess water caused by siphoning. Also, it kind of functions as an external overflow in that once the power is off, the water is held in the box and has only to drain back into the tank. I do live in the country and it happens..more often than not...). Call that power company! lol You may need to start thinking about protecting your saltwater investment by investing in an electric generator dedicated to your tank. Thirdly, I have bubbles galore in the "bubble producing area" but foam that raises up? um, no...maybe 1/4" of it at best regardless of where I put the reservoir cup. It's still breaking in. Yes, I have held my finger over the air tube to prime the sucker...and yes, it almost over flowed.. and what do I do? I try it again! and again..and again... still this little amount of foam. Holding your finger over the airline tube does not let it produce bubbles. No air is being sucked into the pump. Lastly as far as the skimmer is concerned, What level do I place the cup? :#ff0000;">You can skim either wet or dry. When your skimmer finally breaks in, play with it enough to where it will produce a nice, very dark tea color but not so dry that its a sludge. The lower the bubbles, the dryer the skimmate - the higher the bubbles the wetter the skimmate. Usually, it's best to stay midrange between the two. I remember reading about skimming wet with it in the water, or skimming dry...but I am not sure. I've placed it where the bubbles reach the bottom of the outside of the collection cup (is this dry?)...I've placed it where they come up the tube half way...(wet?) I dunno..no change...and where is that foam?? Is my tank just that clean? can't be! I've had some fish, live rock, etc for...a month now? I am crystal clear though (love that!) I would love to just take this sucker off, but I wanna be the best that I can be to my little guys... Rightly so - it's best to run a skimmer with a lot of LPS corals. LPS corals love to eat - and the excess organics do have to be removed.
OK, I think the thing that bothers me most the next is the behavior my Royal Gramma has taken on... He is rubbing his cheek on the rock, and today the sand... I have looked his over until I am cross-eyed. As long as there isn't any little dots on him, signs of fin rot, popeye or anything, then it is normal behavior. I see no trauma, no parasites, no obvious signs of irritation..

He eats, he sleeps, and I am sure he poops *feels like she is describing her babies* Can't help but think of my own too. A few (the best I can identify) common bristle worms have creeped into view since I have rearranged my live rock, but I have not seen any contact made between the two. Most bristle worms are actually beneficial to the system. They will eat leftover foods and devour dead organisms which may pollute your water with ammonia. Leave them in. There are only two types of bristle worms that are bad - one can grow REALLY BIG and the other one can sting. Most common bristle worms that we find in our aquariums are common detrivores and nothing to worry about. (I've tried to catch these buggers unsuccessfully...I have tried to make a trap..unsuccessfully... I will try a trap again I guess). Water quality is good... (I check daily and have never seen a fluctuation except a little on SG and I have used RO water. I keep it at 1.0245, temp has never budged from 78, pH hangs around 8.2, 0 nitrates, 0 nitrites, 0 ammonia) any ideas?
The next thing that has me concerned is stocking the tank. I am so worried about overstocking, but about three different sources have all told me my list is good to go. Yeah, a lot of people don't really mind overstocking and then making up for it with equipment. At least you are going about it the smart way. Mind if I post it for you to give it a glance over?

I'd hate to get to my goal (LPS!!! YAY!!) and find out I can't have it because of something I put in there already. Just how many corals could I stock my 56gal Column with (esp when considering my fish list) before it would be way too much? Most LPS will continuously grow and split throughout their entire lifetimes which is on average 100 years. A single head of frogspawn in ten years can be the size of a beach ball with the proper nutrition and chemical balance. I don't believe you will keep the same exact tank over the next ten years without upgrading - so there really isn't too much concern. There HAS to be a limit somewhere and everyone just seems to shrug when I ask. There is a limit. Eventually everything will grow into one another. Some LPS corals have stinging nematocysts like corals from the family Euphyllia and have to be a half a foot to a foot away from other corals. Other corals, such as open brain corals can grow quite large over time and need a lot of sandbed space. Plate corals are not an LPS coral, but actually of the family Fungidae - Even though they do have a hard endoskeleton. They all have their maxiumum adult sizes - which over many years, proper nutrition and chemical balance they will reach. Is it realistic that you only keep one colony of hammer coral in a 56g for the next ten years? No. This is why many aquarists reach a point to where they will "Frag" their corals into smaller versions of the whole. Fragging not only gives space in your aquarium but it can also help get you credit at your live fish store - as well as come inhandy for trading with other hobbyists or selling online. It may be a few years until you reach that point, however. There is a lot to learn from now until then.
Here is the list, followed by my tank equipment. I've tried to check for compatibility:
Fish:
(2) Ocellaris clowns (have 1 atm) Should have introduced them at the same time.
(1) Royal Gramma I love this fish. Make sure you have an egg crate top on your tank or else the little bugger will most likely jump.
(1) Purple firefish Goby So you have this one already or you want this one?
(1) Yellow watchman goby (on the wish list...is he gonna be okay with the above?) Nice - but they stir up sand a lot.
(2) Spotted Pajama Cardinals (on wish list. I know not to mix species and to add them at the same time) I like cardinals. Maybe you should look at ALL of the cardinal species for sale instead of just settling between banggai or pajama. There are some really cool species of cardinals out there.
(1) Dwarf Flame Angelfish or Coral Beauty Angelfish (on wish list. Questionable seeing my LPS goal?) Since this is a column tank, I would advise against getting either one of these. The tank simply does not have enough swimming room.
I know that Tangs, Damselfish, Triggerfish, Butterflies, are a no no and Mandarins only in 1.5+ yr tank with copopods, etc.. Besides having an established aquarium for mandarins, you should also have an active live refugium going to continuously produce copepods for mandarin consumption.
Inverts:
(2) Skunk Cleaner Shrimp

(1) Peppermint shrimp

(1) Hermit Crab (I have an electric blue knuckle, but he has taken residence in a cave and won't come out *sniffle* ) I would either get hermits or snails. Hermits will eat snails over time - and for no good reason. Hermits are great for excess food cleanup while snails are great herbivores. Nassarius snails also eat excess foods - so that may be something to look into - and give hermie back to the store.
(???) snails - I know it is recommended to have...a couple dozen I guess? but my LFS says no on them... Should I split the difference with 10 bumblebees? or go all out and get 10 bumble, 10 nassarius, and 2 turbo? Is Hermie going to bother the snails?
I'd love a feather duster, clam, and brittle star too. Clam will come with the LPS though. Light isn't the only factor in keeping a clam - and for LPS for that matter. You also need to know how to keep high calcium, alkalinity and magnesium levels - and keep them steady. This is a difficult tasks for most new aquarists to manage.
LPS coral is my goal, but I'm not gonna list those How many would be the right amount with the above? Could I get a max of about 10? 5? Don't you think there is too much above for my LPS goal? Instead of looking for a number, read and research about each individual coral, their care and requirements. Some LPS corals have different care and requirements than others. You should research their needs and taylor your tank and future coral purchases around your already exhisting coral pets. Some corals require large areas while some corals grow slow - some corals grow fast. Some corals overgrow some corals... and so on and so forth. You need to be able to map out your tank and decide how you want it to look before you even purchase the first coral. Also - In this case, a lot of LPS corals prefer to lay on the sandbed - such as brains, open brains, fungia (plate corals) and so on and so forth. Make sure you have enough sandbed for what you want to purchase. If your sandbed is at a premium, make sure that you choose carefully which coral you choose. Keep in mind that Euphyllia corals such as torch, hammer and frogspawn and their variations have stinging cells called nematocysts which will sting corals nearby that are trying to encroach upon their territory. Make sure you give them enough space.
Here is my equipment:
56 gal Column (of which I am having trouble stacking my rock high enough.. I've got them slightly over half atm) You should research more ways to force your rocks to stack higher. Some include drilling your rock and fitting it onto PVC pipe or acrylic rods to Marcorocks Mortar mix. There is also an underwater epoxy that you can use to stick your rocks together and make them higher.
Radion XR30 (coming for Christmas) Good. Just don't buy any corals until you have the proper lighting. This includes clams.
Vortech MP10 pump (by Christmas) You should seriously consider getting the MP40 instead for such a large tank. If you get an MP10, you will have to run it on 100% max all the time and it can get a good humm going with it at that speed. An MP40 will allow you greater flexibility and less noise.
Vortech battery backup (on that ever-growing wish list) Good deal - though, not entirely necessary if you have a generator, but great when your power cuts off and you aren't home.
Fluval 306 Canister Ditch the canister if you don't plan on doing maintenance on it every two weeks to one month. If your power does go out and your canister sits up for more than 24 hours, and then the power cuts back on - it can crash your tank. IF anything, I wouldn't run any mechanical filtration in it - and just fill it with chemipure or chemipure elite, extra carbon and / or a GFO pouch. You still have to do regular maintenance on it.
Reef Octopus HOB BH1000 I like octopus brand skimmers. Once you get it working right and you are confident in it - you will like it too.
200W heater

15lbs sand (just a column guys, not as big of a footprint here..)

45lbs Fiji live rock that came with bristle worms and aiptasia...unfortunately not all the fun things I have read others receiving. I am fighting my aiptasia. I'm down to just one I hope, but he keeps coming back after my treatments...)

I think that sums it up for now. Thanks in advance for any advice!

 

[schiller]

Thanks for the heads up! I was worried that there would be an inceased bioload from the corals, but it sounds like more of a real estate issue for both light and space. I have narrowed my list to ones I like with similar lighting/flow requirements and no funky feeding, just the usual calcium, mag, etc and an occasional treat. Now I just need to narrow them as far as placement...good thing I have months to look into it..
Yes, the canister was one of the mistakes I thought I could get away with in the beginning.

As far as mechanical, remove ALL the sponges? I do run carbon now. Would I add chemi-pure in a bag below that? I've also heard of people removing the biological filtration (It has these ceramic looking tubes, would I equivalate that to a bioball?). Would you suggest removing that as well? That would leave carbon filter on top, the chemipure below that, and then an empty compartment below that? Or double up carbon I guess.. Carbon, carbon+GFO, then Chemi-pure? This would be to keep nitrates low, correct? Shoud I wait until mine creep up since I've had 0 so far? The plan is for and approx 20gal sump later, but the hubby has restricted the equipment budget. However, I have to restrain him in the fish department. hehe He wants them all.
I already have the firefish...and gramma...and they do not care for eachother. lol So far they just posture at each other, but they both want to claim the front center of the tank.
I am glad you mentioned the swim space for the dwarf angelfish. I liked the idea of one large pop of color, and those two seemed to be the suggested item, but once the tank is grown and full, he very well might get crowded.
As far as the cardinal fish, do you have any suggestions for something more striking? All I have seen are the pajama and banggai. We fell in love with a teeny tiny baby fish, about 1/2" long that was solid polkadots at the fish store...turned out to be a clown trigger ROTFL So the pajama was as close as we could go in a MUCH more managable size

For the live rock, I got the epoxy in today with the skimmer, so that is next on the list to try. That, or add one more...Steady as she goes! hehe I have heard that the epoxy causes the skimmer to go nuts; should I raise the cup higher, or did they mean it just produces more skimmate? The pvp pipe is really sounding like a good route for me. Just thinking out loud, but would you build the pipe in a tripod for standing and then just epoxy the LR to the stick?
My skimmer seems to be less touchy when I went to take pictures, and I have a little bit of collection (though it is clear water) in the cup! I will have to elarn patience and give it time. I am putting a few pictures incase I should change a setup. Let me know if something doesn't look right.
I will most definately look into the MP40. I like the less noise, not 100%
My gramma didn't come out for the picture...he has a strick bed time. 8:00 and he goes in his hole in a rock and only comes back out when the lights come on in the morning. Everyone else came back out to smile for the camera

I am having trouble getting the pictures on. I will keep trying.

 

[schiller]

Above is an overall - I raised the intake as close as I could to the surface. I thought it might help, but that is the max up it goes. It is below the surface 1/4-1/2 inch. I can drop it 3 inches if I should.
The bubbles come out where the cup and sponge is. If I take the sponge off, there are bubbles everywhere. This also is not completely submerged, though that might not be the worst thing...helps with the bubbles... I have read about "micro" bubbles... I never had any, though I have this sponge on... but that cup makes major MACRO bubbles. That is why I thought something might be set up wrong. the bubbles are huge and very very numberous...
Here is a close up of the two:
The flash kinda hid the height of the intake, sorry... and do pardon my twin toddler handprints...I clean the glass at least 3 times a day

No touch! Atleast they tell them good morning...
I was late on turning the lights on today and I hear one "Mommy...fish sleepy? good morning fishies.. *point* good morning GOOD MORNING! FISHIES IN DARK!" and the other one is chanting and dancing "good morning fish..good morning fish...good morning fish" Never dull around here...never

This picture shows the output of the fluval really close to the input of the skimmer, but the fluvall flow does start past the skimmer... I guess I could move the skimmer to the other side. The fluval hosing is not long enough for me to cross them and switch the in/out directions... (unless I turn the canister backward under the stand... that might work better)
and the back to show my bubble production. It is in the far compartment where it is clear that if I mess with the collection cup (like for removal) the water travels all the way up and out! It didn't when I went to take the pictures.. maybe it was settling in?

 

[snakeblitz33]

I would run the canister filter purely for chemical filtration. You can use the ceramic rings on the bottom in the empty chamber to avoid doubling up on carbon, which is unnecessary. Make sure that the carbon you are using isn't Kents... there has been a recall on it. Your nitrates and phosphates will steadily climb if you are feeding right. A way to limit it is to use RO/DI water, chemical filtration, macroalgae, and proper water changes.

Southern orange lined cardinal

Bandfin Cardinal

Rose Atoll Cardinal

Ring Tail Cardinal

 

[snakeblitz33]

Looking good to me. You may want to take that background off and replace it with a black background. It makes the tank look at lot less distracting and a lot more clean. More of a suggestion than a must do. lol. Of course, we all have our preferences.
The skimmer looks like it is breaking in nicely. I wouldn't worry about it. In fact, go ahead and leave it on tonight and try to get some sleep.

 

[schiller]

Thanks, will do. I am sure on of the kiddos will be up soon anyways
And thanks for the pictures! I have not seem some of those yet. So very colorful!
I agree on the background. It looks a bit cheesy in the photo. lol
I forgot to add before on the clownfish. I had a pair, and lost one in 6 days. Tried to replace him and lost another in 2.5 days. Completely unexplained. Acclimated for 1hr, no trauma, no sign of disease, water was checked daily, and was stable as I posted before. So we (the LFS and I) gave it three weeks. I tested daily and had him double check 2-3 times each week. Everything is exactly as it was before, and everyone else has been happy as can be. (along with their own behaviors! It is amazing how much more personality and unique Saltfish are to fresh..) My buddy's buddy should be in tomorrow. I am excited and scared at the same time. I this guy doesn't make it, 'ole Nemo there will have to remain a bachelor (or prob bachlorette to be more accurate. lol Old maid. Ok, that is just getting mean. It must be time for bed). I've been adding 1-2 guys every coulple weeks. So tomorrow I am adding three fish *gulp*: 2 Pajamas and the clown. Hopefully it will go well!
Thanks again for the advice.