New Tank Problems

[derwood]

I am new to marine set ups, but considered myself pretty savvy to fresh water with years of experience so I thought I'd give it a try. So far I am disappointed. Lots of questions....
My system (35 hex) has been set up more than 3 weeks with ~30 lbs live rock and some sea shells (direct from ocean). Been having problems that I can't explain nor have I found any material to explain it.
I cured the tank to set up for ~10 days. ~ a week after introducing some fish 3 perc clowns, flame angel, & a couple of small hermits, they began dying off. I have testing water daily and all indications were well within limits (1.022-1.024 SG, trace of NH3 and NO2) but with a lower PH than I would have liked ~7.8-7.9. Strangely, when I test for NH3, I get good color reading, but, the test precipitates out into a milky film that settles in the test tube any ideas on this? Could this substance be the killer? If so, how do I find out what it is? Lost the hermits first, then the flame, then a couple of damsels added after the fact.
On top of this, my remaining clowns now have ick so I am considering tearing down and starting again. Any advice?
Also, what is a good safe way to get the PH up in the 8.0+ range?
Looks like my tank is currently cycling (its been 3.5 weeks) as I have lots of brown algae growth on the live rock and in the coral substrate. Assume this is normal and will reduce over time (or if I am ever able to add an algae eater...)
Any advice would be great. Thanks.

 

[a&m aggie 04']

first of all, you should not introduce fish until your tank is finished cycling. This usually takes a month or so. To start a cycle you have to produce ammonia, alot of people put dead shrimp (from a grocery store) into the tank. This causes a spike in ammonia and starts your cycle. Your ammonia will go up, then down, then you'll have a spike in trites. When all your levels, Ammonia-0, Nitrite-0 then your cycle is complete. Near the end of the cycly you will see brown algae (diatoms) on your glass and floor, ect. This is what you are experiencing, so your cycle is proabably over. After this you can start to add a cleanup crew, snails, hermits ect. You can then start to add fish but very slowly. Adding fish too fast will cause a spike in ammonia (exactly what happened in your case) and they will die, or get stressed. The reason your clowns didnt die is b/c they are much hardier than angels and your cleanup crew. You need to add 1 fish every 2 weeks or so, to avoid ammonia spikes. With a 44 gallon tank you should only be able to house about 3 or 4 fish. (general rule 1" of fish per 5 gallons, this is full grown)
A young tank will not have a stable PH, you can add PH buffers to get it up though.
What type of filtration do you have??
What kind of substate?? (sand or crushed coral)
Id recommend starting completely over, do not treat the clowns for ich in that tank. The ich treatments contain copper and will leach into everything and you'll never be able to have inverts.
Get yourself a sand bed, 3-4" and go slow.
The first thing you need to do is take care of those clowns, go get a 10 gallon tank and set up a quarantine tank so you can treat them.
Search the board on treatments for ich, but in no way add medications to your 44 gallon.
I probably forgot something, but dont feel free to ask questions.
Mark

 

[acez28]

too many fish too fast. When you setup ur tank it has to cycle. Everything will go up then back down to 0. Ammonia first then Nitrites then Nitrates. Plus your tank was overstocked and the fish were prolly stressed which is why they have ICK now. You have to wait till ur tank completely cycles b4 you add any fish. After the cycle the clean up crew should be added first then fish. Start out with some hardy fish and after your tank has been stable at least 6 months you can go with other fish. I am sure more people will respond to this and some may make you mad but the biggest thing you will need in this hobby is patience and it didnt look like you had any.

 

[randy 12]

Where do I start? Not sure what you mean by you let the tank cure for 10 days. The tank hasn't completed its cycle yet. It takes anywhere from 4 weeks to 2 months or maybe more... just depends. You can't just throw a bunch of fish in a saltwater tank before it has cycled like you can a freshwater. There are many different ways of cycling a tank. Do a search on it.
If you want to put shells or coral skeleton from the ocean, you need to boil then bleach it then rinse really well then set it in the sun for a while to make sure all the bleach is out. Never put things like shells or similar directly from the ocean into your tank.
The percs need to be added after you have completed your cycle and I wouldn't put all 3 in at once shortly after cycling. IMO that's just too many at once in such a small tank. The angel needs to wait a long time. Your tank needs to be cycled and mroe mature before adding an angel. THey require excellent water parameters.
What test kit are you using? Did you shake it really well?
There are products you can buy to raise your PH. Kent makes a good one. Can't remember the exact name at the moment. I wouldn't worry about PH until you are done cycling.
Brown algae is part of the process. You can reduce this in the future by using RO/DI water.
Saltwater requires a lot of patience. You add fish very, very slowly. Your biological filter needs time to catch up everytime you add fish. Add too many at one time and your biological filter can't keep up and you start losing fish.
Your problem right now is that you haven't finished the cycle yet and you shouldn't add fish until it's cycled and not so many at one time.
Like I said, do a search on cycling. Some use dead shrimp, uncured live rock, damsels, and so on. There are lots of options.
As far as the perculas that are left, do you have a friend with a quarantine tank that can treat them? They are stressed from the cycle process and added to that the death of the other fish.
Hope this helps.

 

[fishkiller]

I went through everything you are going through right now. The best advice I could give is more LR, and less fish... You most likely have many ich adults in there right now. I'm just now finishing the 4th week of NO fish in my tank, because the fish that were in there all died from ich. They got ich most likely because of the stress of too many fish too soon in a tank that is not done cycling. I would wait on getting ANY fish for a few weeks. But inverts are ok, cuz they do not get ich. Good luck!!

 

[derwood]

To answer Mark's question:
Substrate: Crushed coral ~2-3 inches deep
Filtration: Undergravel with power head plus a Milineum 1000 filter.
Thanks for the feedback. I am agree with most of the assesments but its good to get confirmation. Got some very bad information from another hobbyist.

 

[drakken]

Oh boy, doesn't this sound familiar!!
You and I must have talked to the same LFS! I also have a 35 gal hex with a similar set up. I also added too many fish too early and almost killed them all. My LFS is holding my lionfish and yellow tang while my tank cycles.
You can read more under my thread "Is this overstocked?"
Drakken's "overstocked" post