Nitrates still insane!!! Any other help???

[jester805]

A couple weeks ago I posted on here asking for help getting my nitrates down. Here's a summary of what I have:
75 gallon FOWLR tank
50 pounds LR
80 pounds LS
2 Nemo's
2 Damsels
1 Foxface
1 Pearlscale Butterfly
1 Pincushion urchin
1 Watchman goby
1 Cleaner shrimp
Misc. Mexican Red Leg crabs
Misc. snails (turbo & astria)
Sand-sifting star
Blue star
I've been doing 12 -15 gallon water changes every Saturday for the past 2 months. I slowed my feeding down to 1 cube of Frozen Mysis every other day. I have an Emperor 400 & Emperor 180 filter. SeaClone 100 protein skimmer. Three of the 1140 power-heads.
I just checked my levels again tonight and here's what I have:

• NitrItes: 0
• pH: 8.4
• NitrAtes: 200 ppm
  Salt: 1.022
  Temp: 82 - 84

How in the world can I bring these nitrAtes down??? The fish are all doing great, but I don't want to add anything else to the tank until I can bring that down. I only used distilled water from Walmart. I have tested it before adding to the tank and the nitrAtes in it are at 0.

Thanks!
P.S. Here's the link to the original post I started a couple weeks ago.

 

[75bownut]

well fist Id make sure you have an accurate test kit, second I would add a refugium , also you shold do once a week changes 10% Imo. If your nitrates are really 200ppm then you need to do alot more water changes to get it down. my test kit wont even test that high. mine reads in meq/L and mine is usually between 5 and 10. The solution to pollution is dillution. do a 20% water change , then wait 2 days do another 20% water change, wait 3 days do 10% wait 4 days do 10% wait 5 days do a 20% wait 6 days do a 10% then test after 1 week and see where your at. you see nitrates buildup and the best way to get ride of them and keep them low is a refugium system. Plants love the stuff and in return they keep the numbers low. hope I helped

 

[jester805]

Originally Posted by 75bownut
well fist Id make sure you have an accurate test kit, second I would add a refugium , also you shold do once a week changes 10% Imo. If your nitrates are really 200ppm then you need to do alot more water changes to get it down. my test kit wont even test that high. mine reads in meq/L and mine is usually between 5 and 10. The solution to pollution is dillution. do a 20% water change , then wait 2 days do another 20% water change, wait 3 days do 10% wait 4 days do 10% wait 5 days do a 20% wait 6 days do a 10% then test after 1 week and see where your at. you see nitrates buildup and the best way to get ride of them and keep them low is a refugium system. Plants love the stuff and in return they keep the numbers low. hope I helped

Thanks for the good info. Just for me to be clear on a refugium....is that another tank that usually sits underneath the display tank? Is that where you keep your filters & other equipment?? I wondered about doing live plants. Are there specific plants that I should look for?? Anything else to a fuge that I'm over-looking?

 

[promisetbg]

Is there media..sponges or something in these filters that you are not changing? Is the tank set up with a sump and overflow. and return pump or just the hang-on type filters? Is the skimmer performing and removing skimmate?
Some more LR would help,but would have to be cycled rock and added slowly over a period of weeks to months.Your SG. is pretty low for keeping inverts,I would also recommend that you slowly raise this by adding SW instead of fresh for your daily top-off,at 1.025 SG. until you reach 1.024-1.025.
The sandsifting star is a grave mistake{I just noticed him on your list} get him out ASAP..he will eat all the necessary infauna in your sandbed,leaving it devoid of the life that it needs to work properly.

 

[jester805]

Originally Posted by promisetbg
Is there media..sponges or something in these filters that you are not changing? Is the tank set up with a sump and overflow. and return pump or just the hang-on type filters? Is the skimmer performing and removing skimmate?
Some more LR would help,but would have to be cycled rock and added slowly over a period of weeks to months.Your SG. is pretty low for keeping inverts,I would also recommend that you slowly raise this by adding SW instead of fresh for your daily top-off,at 1.025 SG. until you reach 1.024-1.025.
The sandsifting star is a grave mistake{I just noticed him on your list} get him out ASAP..he will eat all the necessary infauna in your sandbed,leaving it devoid of the life that it needs to work properly.
I just have the hang-on filters...no sump. I change the filters in the Emperor every other week. The skimmer works OK (not the best). I struggle with the salt level every time I do a water change. It always seems to come back a little low even when I think I'm adding plenty of salt. I JUST added the sand-sifter a week ago. I know their reputation for eating themselves to death, but was hoping it would move some sand around to get any crap out of there.

 

[mikeyjer]

Instead of adding fresh top off water when your tank precipitates, add premixed saltwater to it. It should bring your salinity up. Mine loses around half a gallon per day. :happyfish

 

[promisetbg]

If you want the tank to really do well..consider the addition of a sump w/ overflow,return pump,and a better skimmer.
The sandsifter is just as I said..he will eat the necessary stuff..not the stuff that you don't want.Good circluation will keep detritus and proteins in suspension so that your skimmer can remove them.A good clean-up crew is important..good sand SHIFTERS are nassarius snails,cerith snails,and atlantic spotted cucumbers.Stay away from sand sifting stars and gobies.Using a turkey baster to blow off your rocks also helps to get things into the water column for removal.
What is your method of doing water changes that you are having a problem with?Are you using a refractometer or hydrometer? If you measure out the salt ..as long as you are'nt letting it get wet,it should always be approximately the same..you should be topping off with fresh RO/DI water every day.

 

[birdy]

My first question is what test kit are you using and if you have gotten a second opinion with a different test.
Second, I would do bigger water changes, like 20 gallons every week, until the levels drop, and reduce feedings even more, like feed 1/2 cube 3 times a week, until levels go down.
I always like a refugium with macro algae to reduce nitrates, to do that with your tank you would need a HOB overflow a tank to set up the fuge a light to go over the fuge to grow the algae and a return pump to pump water back up to the display tank. To remove the nitrates and excess nutrients from your system you need to periodically remove some of the macro from your system to allow more to grow and absorb more of your nutrients.

 

[jester805]

Originally Posted by Birdy
My first question is what test kit are you using and if you have gotten a second opinion with a different test.
I always like a refugium with macro algae to reduce nitrates, to do that with your tank you would need a HOB overflow a tank to set up the fuge a light to go over the fuge to grow the algae and a return pump to pump water back up to the display tank. To remove the nitrates and excess nutrients from your system you need to periodically remove some of the macro from your system to allow more to grow and absorb more of your nutrients.
I have 2 different test kits. One is the dip strip kind, and the other is the Saltwater Master Liquid Test Kit. Both read nitrAtes insanely high.
What's the difference between a fuge & a sump? You said I would need a light for the fuge. Any special kind??

 

[hagfish]

Get a different test kit. Get a salifert kit. Those dips are no good. I've never heard of that other kit, but might as well go get a Salifert since it's probably the best and you are apparently having major problems with nitrates.

 

[bawood]

If you verified with other test kits that are you are that high I recommend a big water change.
It's a bandage to get the levels down now. A big water change (50% in less than a weeks time, I did 20 a day for three consecutive days) will get your nitrates down for now.
Then you need to figure out whey they got so high in the first place.
Substrate?
Dead/decaying animal?
Cleaning?
Water source contamination?
Did you add a fish recently?
Change Feeding cycle?
You need to figure it out soon or your levels will creep back up, but at least the big water change will get the levels down for now.
Personally I'd run higher salinity too.
Adding a refuge won't help your problem it sounds like to me. While it will lower trates a little, it sounds like there is a problem in your system that allows them to get to that high of levels in the first place. I'd find that source first, then look into adding a fuge for increased safety. I don't think adding a fuge should be a repair to a damaged ecosystem but rather an upgrade. just my opinion though.
B

 

[jester805]

Originally Posted by hagfish
Get a different test kit. Get a salifert kit. Those dips are no good. I've never heard of that other kit, but might as well go get a Salifert since it's probably the best and you are apparently having major problems with nitrates.
Here's the exact test kit that I have now:
Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Saltwater Liquid Master Test Kit

 

[promisetbg]

Get some salifert kits as stated...those master kits are'nt real accurate.

 

[hagfish]

I was using the aquarium pharmecuticals nitrate kit until Christmas when I got a new salifert nitrate kit. The AP kit had pretty much always read zero nitrates and it was never particularly high except during cycles. I get the salifert kit and it read 50 ppm! That's in a reef tank too. That would explain a few deaths at least. And it would definitely explain why I've had no luck with SPS. So needless to say, I don't care much for the AP test kits.

 

[jester805]

I just found the Salifert kit on another website and it's pretty expensive. $22 for ONLY the nitrate test kit??

I guess it's worth it to get an accurate reading. My current testers MUST be way off because all of my fish are doing fine.
Would adding more filtration help me at all? I was thinking about getting the Fluval 404.

 

[birdy]

The only type of filtration that is going to help with nitrates is a algae scrubber (refugium with macro algae).
If it were my tank I would probably add some more LR, LR does have nitrate reducing abililties.

 

[hagfish]

Originally Posted by jester805
I just found the Salifert kit on another website and it's pretty expensive. $22 for ONLY the nitrate test kit??

I guess it's worth it to get an accurate reading. My current testers MUST be way off because all of my fish are doing fine.
Would adding more filtration help me at all? I was thinking about getting the Fluval 404.

It's not really that costly when you consider that you may have a disasterous level of nitrates in your tank and you NEED to know for sure what the correct measurement is. If you really have 200 ppm, I'd say you are at risk of losing ALL of your livestock and that is probably going to cost a lot more than $22.
It's amazing the way many of us put limits on the value of things like this (this includes me). You have probably spent at least a grand on your aquarium unless you've found the best deals known to man. Is it really that big of a deal to spend $5-10 more dollars on a kit that actually works as opposed to something that is really relatively useless in the cheaper kits? You should be more annoyed at the cost of the crap kit you've got already since it's nearly worthless IMO.
Oh, and adding the fluval is probably more likely to raise nitrates than lower them. Unless you keep up with maintaining it very well. The best filtration you could add is biological in the form of LR, or a fuge. If you have sufficient lighting you could just add some macro algae to the main tank too.