PLEASE HELP - Fish keep dying

[khanhtactm]

Hello all. I am in desperation, that is why I hope I can receive help asap. I have a 125 gallon fowlr tank, with a 140 lbs of liverock that is about 4 months old. I have a yellow tang, yellow eye kole tang, 3 blue green chromis, 2 ocellaris clowns, and a lawnmower blenny. Recently I ordered a shipment of fish from a site online and they have a great deal that if you buy over $225 worth of fish, you receive free shipping. I ordered 6 cleaner shrimp, dwarf flame angel, sailfin tang, green mandarin, blue carribean tang, foxface lo, 2 firefish, and a royal gramma. I acclimated all of the fish at the same time. The 2 firefish and royal gramma were nowhere to be seen. The other fish acclimated fine and were swimming around the tank and eating. After a day passed by my flame angel died out of nowhere and I figured that it was probably due to stress. I started noticing that my cleaner shrimp were extremely weak and started to die off as well. I immediately tested the water and surprisingly found the water parameters to be perfect. I even brought a sample out to my lfs and they said that there was absolutely nothing wrong with my water. As each day passes, another one of my fish die out of nowhere or due to ich. It seems as if my tank is slowly getting wiped out. The majority of my fish have ich on them and the 2 cleaner shrimp that I have left do not even clean. Now I have heard that the rate of introducing fish to a tank is one fish per 2 weeks. I definitely did not follow this and I regret it so much. My question is, if introducing such a huge bioload at the same time, is bad...wouldn't that at least throw off my water quality so I can know exactly what is wrong with my tank? I am so frustrated that I did what I did but if any of you out there could PLEASE give me some input as to why my water quality is perfect and my fish keep dying then I would greatly appreciate it. I have put in over $3,000 within 3 months and I just feel like giving up each and every morning I wake up, to see another dead fish. Please share your input with me because I really want to stick with this hobby and do things the right way. Thank you very much and hope to hear from many of you soon.
Here is a link to a video of my tank before my fish started dying....
Please allow a few minutes for it to download by pressing pause right away then play after the grey bar has loaded up a ways.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQP8gcDMMn0

 

[hottie79]

I am really sorry your fish are dying. I can't tell you anything really because I am too new. I think the mandarin would need to be in a tank that has been established for quite a bit longer, but I could be wrong. Again, i am really sorry, and I hope someone can help.

 

[ctgretzky9]

You should post your parameters...and what exactly was tested for. Alkalinity, pH, calcium...trates, trites and ammonia...your sg or salinity etc...
You added WAY too many fish at once, like beyond even what I thought was too many fish. It is a shock to the tanks water chemistry, oxygen and co2 levels...
Ich will wipe out a tank if not treated, especially so many fish at once, all stressed out. You should treat your tank now with kick ich or other non copper based medication. Kick ich, imo works the best for whole tank treatments.
I would skip a sailfin unless you get a bigger tank, or plan on keeping only that and maybe a couple more fish.

 

[mr_bill]

Originally Posted by ctgretzky9
You added WAY too many fish at once, like beyond even what I thought was too many fish. It is a shock to the tanks water chemistry, oxygen and co2 levels...

Exactly

 

[ssweet1]

Are you sure they checked every level? Ammonia is the first suspect, what about nitrates? Most LFS only check Ph, alk. and salinity. I would do a big water change using RODI water salted and airated ASAP and then check all your levels to make sure you arent going through a cycle. Sorry about your loss, Carrie

 

[alyssia]

That was way to many fish to add at once. And mandarins need a much more established tank.

 

[nyfisherman]

Slow down, you can throw all your money into this hobby and LFS will sell you every new gadget, filter and medication they can but fish will still die. Then when that doesn't work they will sell you new fish. Four months is not long in this hobby for a tank to be set up. My opion any tank under a year is new. Stay away from tangs and angels if you don't have a UV sterilizer. They are both notorious for getting ICH. Also once your fish get ICH be very careful what you Medicate with. BEWARE of all the snake oils they through off tank parameters, you might kill ICH but something else might die with it. Find a good LFS and pick some healthy Damsels to cycle the tank with. Most good LFS will give you credit when you trade up to the more expensive stuff.

 

[tropicalreefs]

Ich is most of your problem...chances are that if any of the new fish had ich they gave it to the whole tank. Ich is terrible that way...it can wipe out an entire tank. It sounds like most of the new fish had it because usually if 1 fish has it it dies off before the rest of it's tankmates can get it. I'm also guessing that your water parameters aren't perfect or at least not now. Take it slow because what seems like a good deal ends up costing more in the long run. Sorry that your tank isn't doing well.

 

[unleashed]

yes you did jump the gun in stocking the fish.as for water testing fine that could very well be the case but your tank is very young and has not yet established enough beneeficial bactria and life to house the types of fish you have purchased.during cycling time the parimeters fluxuate drasticly and these fish cant tolerate this.most fish cannot but yours def not .one thing you need to do is boost that cycle by adding benaficial bacteria this will make the tank a little safer for the fish i use bacter vital for my tanks to help keep it up and use in newly established tanks.check your ph if its low it will cause more stress on them as well.your fish were already stressed due to transport now they are more stressed do to the tank being tooo new.the only other thing i can suggest is call your local fish store as them to do 1 of 2 things 1 keep the fish for you untill your tank is cycled or sell you some water from their existing tanks.if you can find hobbiest on the forums near you even that can donate water to you from healthy tanks this may help.but with all these fish there is now garentee on anything.feeding is going to be helpful too make sure you feed each fish properly the species you have purchased need differnt diets.you will need herbivore foods angel foods omnivore foods and some meaty foods also ad selcon directly to the tank water this may help th fish get stronger to fight all this. feed 2-3 times daily watch water quality.good luck

 

[nemo's mom]

You should QT any fish with visible Ich. If you don't have a qt tank, get a large rubbermaid tub, a cheap filter and a couple of powerheads. Use part of the water from the main tank and add a dose of RO water to both tanks. I would do hypo but you would need a refractometer if you don't own one already. Personally I'm not a fan of Kick Ich but I have had great success with hypo and I personally believe in treating without chemicals....every drug has some kind of side effect. You would need to do daily water changes for a few weeks and if none of the fish in your display tank show signs of ick at that time, you should SLOWLY introduce you fish back into the display tank. I would also recommend QT in the future, especially if you order on line. Most fish are stressed when they arrive. I would make sure you QT for a few weeks and observe for signs of illness so you don't chance it by introducing a sick fish and wiping out an entire tank. Good luck!

 

[dw62]

A couple of suggestions. Are the fish dying during the night? Do you test your PH at night after the lights have been out for awhile? Many times in the absence of the light PH can drop drastically, especially in well or overstocked tanks. With this size tank, I imagine you probably have a sump. If so, it would probably be beneficial if you put a bright light over your sump at night while the lights in the main tank are out. This would help your PH from drastic changes at night. Add some Caulerpa or Chaeto in sump if you don't have any.
Do you check for Phosphates? From the video, it looked like you may be feeding your fish flake food. This type of food is well known for adding/increasing phosphate levels, especially in newly established tanks.
Just a couple of thoughts. I am no expert by any means, just a couple of things I have had to go through. I also learned the hard way how beneficial a QT tank due to when I put a Flame Angel in my main tank and caused an outbreak of ICH.
Hope you find your problem.

 

[phoenixfla]

Although Ick may have killed some of your fish, you have another problem as well. Since you lost 4 shrimp, I am nearly positive that it is water quality. Have you ever used copper in the tank? As mentioned before - I am very curious to know your ammonia levels. How often are you doing water changes?
My money is on the water!

 

[seareef]

Your over stocking your tank to soon, it was 8 months before I had more than 3 fish in my 150. Becareful, more so I cant believe they sold you a mandrin, they have the highest death rate out of any fish, next to sea horses and some tangs : powder..etc ...I dont suggest mandrins for any newbie ...your tank must be HUGE (100gal) or above with a year establishment before you can have one.... I have 2 in my 150 ...and it took me a year to get everything set up right..aka refigum...etc ...
I think you need to slow down and take your time....Do some water changes...give the fish to friends for awhile....then as the tank matures add them....
Best of luck,
Also dont be fooled by those " buy 5 things and we give you a discount " ..if you dont have a massive tank thats been around for a long while...your just going to kill everything....your system isn't ready for it...

 

[khanhtactm]

Wow thanks for all the great input guys! When I tested the water parameters and brought a sample out to a specialty fish store, my numbers came in at...
Ammonia - close to 0
Nitrate - close to 0
Nitrite - .3
pH - 8.2
SG - 1.024
Temperature - 78 degrees
I do a 20% water change every two weeks. I do not have a UV sterilizer, QT tank, or a sump. I am getting a 30 gallon QT tank and a Coral life UV sterilizer asap. I really do not know much about the sterilizer besides the fact that it can reduce ich. My fish seem to die during the night and in the morning is when I find them sunken on the bottom.
I have never used any copper based medications so why the cleaner shrimp died is still a mystery to me. I acclimated them the same way I did with the fish. I floated them for 15 minutes with the lights off and put half a cup of water in every 5 minutes for 45 minutes scooping out the excess water in the bag.
I feed my fish Formula One frozen brine and mysis shrimp. I throw in some flakes every now and them just to mix it up.
I heard numerous amounts of information on bacteria. I've heard that adding bacteria from a bottle will speed up the process and I also heard that it does no good. Someone told me...
"After you add the initial batch of bacteria, all the other additions of bacteria are wasted. Bacteria can reproduce very quickly, if there is enough food, oxygen, etc for them. Over the course of a week, they will easily be many times what the initial batch was, so adding another batch is almost nothing compared to what is already in the tank."
So I am unsure whether to purchase a bottle of bacteria or not. Also, if I put fish store water into my tank, isn't that one of the worst things you can do? Thank you all.

 

[nemo's mom]

I never put fish store water in my tank. I let the water mix in a bucket, then get the fish with a net and place in the tank

 

[nemo's mom]

Also, I'm curious on the mandarin part. I have a green mandarin goby. It was my 2nd fish purchase in my brand new tank. Are we talking about a mandarin goby? I have never had any problems with mine-he's doing great, all over the tank???

 

[unleashed]

as for my suggestion of store water was as a last resort to use established water .i do recomend using the water in a qt tank. not your main so as not to add anything you wouldnt want into your main tank.but more for the fishes benefit in more stable water supply that what they are in now.i would also if you can remember or inspect each fish that have died any noticable coloration loss or fading before death. and do some online research as to simular effects of a possible illness and how to prevent it from reaccuring. how i find info on certain illness and paresites is start in medications for marine fish find the name of an illness each med treats this gives you a broader range of topics and diseases.

 

[nyfisherman]

Store water isn't all that bad it depends what kind of store you have. I have a local place that frag all their own coral. Water is good, and I buy premade salt water from them for a buck a gallon and RO for 25 cents. Another place sells cheap fish and coral but they will not survive in their tanks past a week. That water doesn't touch my tank. Keep the fish you have, don't buy any more for a while. Bacteria will develop over time along with any bacteria in your filter. I recently added a coralife UV light to my tank and plumbed it inline on the output side of a fluval canister. it works very well. Get the biggest UV light coral life makes, 36watt I belive. Also just a note, brand new made up salt water will have all the parameters of good water but it will not be alive. It will be harsh sterile salt water and fish will die in it. That is why tanks must mature. Some things can speed this up, premade water from reliable fish stores. Live sand from stores or friends, not stuff premade in the bags, stuff out of the tanks, and cured live rock. Do not net fish unless you have to, scoop them with plastic cups or tupperware.

 

[toungetwster]

Did you buy your tank new or "used". I'm thinking copper or something else; since the shrimp died. I do agree that way too many fish too fast in too young of a tank.

 

[ctgretzky9]

Originally Posted by KhanhtactM
Wow thanks for all the great input guys! When I tested the water parameters and brought a sample out to a specialty fish store, my numbers came in at...
Ammonia - close to 0
Nitrate - close to 0
Nitrite - .3
pH - 8.2
SG - 1.024
Temperature - 78 degrees
I do a 20% water change every two weeks. I do not have a UV sterilizer, QT tank, or a sump. I am getting a 30 gallon QT tank and a Coral life UV sterilizer asap. I really do not know much about the sterilizer besides the fact that it can reduce ich. My fish seem to die during the night and in the morning is when I find them sunken on the bottom.
I have never used any copper based medications so why the cleaner shrimp died is still a mystery to me. I acclimated them the same way I did with the fish. I floated them for 15 minutes with the lights off and put half a cup of water in every 5 minutes for 45 minutes scooping out the excess water in the bag.
I feed my fish Formula One frozen brine and mysis shrimp. I throw in some flakes every now and them just to mix it up.
I heard numerous amounts of information on bacteria. I've heard that adding bacteria from a bottle will speed up the process and I also heard that it does no good. Someone told me...
"After you add the initial batch of bacteria, all the other additions of bacteria are wasted. Bacteria can reproduce very quickly, if there is enough food, oxygen, etc for them. Over the course of a week, they will easily be many times what the initial batch was, so adding another batch is almost nothing compared to what is already in the tank."
So I am unsure whether to purchase a bottle of bacteria or not. Also, if I put fish store water into my tank, isn't that one of the worst things you can do? Thank you all.
Your water tests....If that is all you are having tested, then you are missing quite a bit of information. I see no tests for alkalinity, calcium, phosphate, and to a lesser need, magnesium. Your ither tests look fine, but for long term care, if you really want to get into this hobby, look into getting those other tests.
Sterilizer...I would skip that. Sorry, but they have no use in Marine aquariums, and do more harm than good except for one single thing...ich. And this can be easily avoided on its own. Sterilizers first of, will never get all of the ich. In the 'swimming stage" they can easily hide among the substrate and live rock, and reproduce. i have seen tanks with a sterilizer still get ich. Secondly, it kills any needed bacteria that passes through. It is a catch all solution to just one problem.
You do not need the bottle of bacteria. This will grow on its own with the live rock additions. Better off doing this "naturally" by adding more live rock over time, and adding fish slowly.