shawnts106

[aidos]

BTW please dont delete this thread or stop it....its in the aquarium forum and u only need to add to it if u want.
Thank you
If u read the Decembers 2004 issue of National Geographic, with the main article "Was Dariwn Wrong?" then u will see that evolution in bacteria has been documanted.
this is not wat ur understanding.....evolution or adaptation as u call it does not happen in a single generation it takes hundereds to thousands of year for a new species to arise. not a single mutations.
But for instance....Black people are fare more resistant to sun burn and there for cancer and this allows them to be able to inhabit regions of Africa that white people were unable to(untill recent history) this mutation was of benift and this helped them survive. but one day there was not just a white or black baby born it may have taken hundereds of years the the skin tone to change completelty
Very simular, and sometimes people mistake them for one another!... but they are still angelfish, and are still FISH, they are not a jellyfish, or a snake, or dog, still fish, once again its a variation! not an evolution of the angelfish species.
yes it is an evolution....an evolution of one anglefish species into two different species...yes it is still an angel fish but it is a different NEW species.
uh, *hun* they adapted, thats not evolution... they adapted to the lifestyle of using cactus thorns to get insect larva... crows do the same thing, that is use tools to get stuff.. so do apes... that doesnt meen their common ancestor was a finch!
it is adaptation, but adaptation through "survival of the fittest" as darwin put it, these birds have establised different species populations on different island....wat was once one species has change over hunderds of year.....one island the finshes have a beak design to feed of seeds....on another their beaks are design to feed on fruit and insect. the actually size of the differnet species also varies. this is evolution....they evolved from one species in to twelve (i think from memory) new species. they look very similar in body structure but are actually different at the same time.
What type of evolution? Organic? Cosmic? Atomic? Micro-Evolution is the ONLY evolution that exsists... and even then its NOT a true evolution... because they are tiny minute changes in the dna of this bacteria. They are Variations... not something completly different.

Micro-Evolution is the ONLY evolution that exsists
there it is u said it.....it is true evolution....these variation over time have an effect long lasting or not on a population...and if usefull enough that a species becomes reliant on it then it many become a main feature. such as fins....arms....flippers...wings. if a new born is not born with these helpful feature then it perishes as it can not survive in it habitat
evolution does not happen over nite.....i not in anyway saying god does not exist..i believe that something, someone created this earth....but to dismiss evolution when there is so much data and information to back it up is close minded.
im not saying throw away ur religion but isnt it possible that god created the earth and has also let evolution take is own path??
but there is plenty of information out there and if u feel stongly about it which i think u do then maybe to should read more about evolutionif only to "TRY" and prove me wrong.
(please read proper sources aswell....not just website designed to disprove evolution, also read scientific articles that are peer assessed and very reliable)
i hope this does not sound pushy or rude...im not trying to be, I just believe strong that god and evolution, together have shaped this earth.

 

[molamola]

I would also like to note (this coming from the English Major in me) that if you read the first Chapter of Genesis literally, then you must read all the other Chapters literally as well. If you do this, than even the book of Genesis cannot be used as an argument for or against evolution and creation because the first chapter tells a completely different story of creation than the second. Genesis may be the inspired word of God, but prior to the actual composition of the book of Genesis, those stories were part of an oral history that spanned centuries and came from like seven different groups of people.
These are the definitions of the words being argued:
Evolution: 1. a process of change in a certain direction, a process of continuous change from a lower, simpler, or worse to a higher, more complex, or better state. 2. the historical development of a biological group (as a race or species), a theory that the various types of animals and plants have their origin in other preexisting types and that the distinguishable differences are due to modifications in successive generations.
Natural Selection: a natural process that tends to cause the survival of individuals or groups best adjusted to the conditions under which they live and that is equally important for the perpetuation of desirable genetic qualities and for the elimination of undesirable ones as these are produced by genic recombination or mutation.
Survival of the Fittest: natural selection
Spontaneous Generation: Abiogenesis
Abiogenesis: the origination of living from lifeless matter
These are the words from Genesis Chapter 2, which should, according to some, be read literally. I know that religion has no place in this forum, but (being the English Major) I can’t sit here and have someone turn literature (although the inspired word of God) into scientific proof, without commenting.
Genesis 2:7 The Lord God formed man out of the clay of the ground and blew into his nostrils the breath of life, and so man became a living being.
Genesis 2:19 So the Lord God formed out of the ground various wild animals and various birds of the air, and he brought them to the man to see…
Genesis 2:22 The Lord God then built up into a woman the rib that he had taken from the man. When he brought her to the man, the man said, “This one, at last, is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh…”
After reading that, I would think that it is safe to come to the following conclusions:
We all came from the same origin, which is dirt or clay, which is non-living, so we are all related, vertebrates, invertebrates, etc. I can’t wait for the family reunion.
God loves spontaneous generation, or abioGenesis.
The fact that a woman grew out of a rib, would support the idea of Evolution, “a process of continuous change from a lower, simpler, or worse, to a higher, more complex, or better state.” I will not get into the argument about whether or not women are better than men, but there’s your evidence. That would also further the argument that microevolution isn't the only kind.
Additionally, the fact that perfect, flawless, sinless creatures can instantly transform into humans with a sin nature is also a good argument towards non-micro evolution. That’s pretty instant and that’s quite a significant change in my mind.
As for the natural selection and survival of the fittest argument, God used that all the way through the Old Testament. You have Noah taking seven pairs of the clean animals and only one pair of the unclean, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Tower of Babel, the plagues in Egypt, etc. Sure this is the “Wrath of God,” at work here, but it’s still a natural disaster, where only the strongest survived, wiping out entire cultures and races of people.
As for dogs creating non-dogs, I see it all the time in my backyard. It’s called poop. Poop is in no way similar to a dog, but the dog created it and it stinks. If you would like physical evidence, I would be happy to provide it to you.
I’m not here to preach my views on religion, only to make a point that it’s difficult to use the literal interpretation of the Bible, especially the book of Genesis to argue against Evolution. Evolution proves itself everyday as our society and our world change around us. Furthermore, it is totally out of line to attack and attempt to discredit a scientist who has spent most of his/her life observing and recognizing the minute characteristics in everything that make life unique, or similar. There is nothing criminal about pointing out a similarity, or making a comparison. Any religious person should be grateful for those observations, which test our faith and lead us to new and remarkable conclusions. I’m glad to finally have met my great great….great Auntie last night. I would have expected her to be wearing knee-high socks, like many of my other Aunties, but whatever works.
Now I will go back to being an uninformed aquarist with not enough wattage on my anemone and not enough flow. But my great Uncle Algae sends his regards.

 

[ophiura]

Wow. You guys are way beyond me!