Should I give up???

michelle13

michelle13

Member
I'm not usually one to give up on things, but after battling cyano for about 4 months I am thinking of selling out. I have always had constant readings in my tank. It is a 29 gal with a 7 gal sump and has been set up for 1 1/2 years. My readings are amm. and trites = 0, trates = 5, alk 8 dKh, sal 1.025, temp 78-80, ph 8.2, calcium 410, and phosphate 0. I have a DSB, 20 or so pounds of LR, a Kent Nautilus skimmer, and am turning my tank over about 11 times an hour. I have added another powerhead, ran a phosphate sponge just to be sure, and ran carbon. I have 175 w MH (10K) and two 17 w NO's on about 10 hours a day. I have a clown, bi-color blenny, firefish, royal gramma, cleaner shrimp, 2 peppermint shrimp, 4 blue leg hermits, 3 scarlet hermits, 5 red tip carribean hermits, 4 turbo snails, 2 nass snails, 2 other snails that I can't remember the name of, and several different types of coral. I use RO/DI, feed half a cube of mysis, brine, OR marine cusine once a day, I add DT's twice a week and I drip Kalk. The cyano showed up about the time my MH needed changed so I figured once I changed the bulb the cyano would go away, but no luck. This is what I have already done that has not helped:
Changed the MH bulb
Changed the NO bulbs
Changed filters on RO/DI unit
Changed from IO to Oceanic Natural Sea Salt
Stopped adding supplements
Started doing water changes once a week (10%)
Bought new skimmer (had a skilter)
Reduced light time to 6 hours
Increased flow
Reduced feeding to every other day (started feeding daily when this didn't work)
Changed MH bulb again (thought the 10K was bad, put in a new 12K)
Added to clean-up crew
Manually removed as much as possible
Tried to blow dust off of rocks
The lights have now been off for two days and it's not working either. I don't know what else to do. Am I missing something? I have no room for a fuge so that is out of the question, plus I ran the tank for a year with no problem. I have thought about using some of the chemicals out there but I really hate to resort to that. If I cannot get it fixed soon, I'm going to have to tear the tank down because it is stressing me out and I don't think that is what hobbies are supposed to do! I know this is long, but I wanted to include all the information and hopefully get some help. Thank you
 
fishking

fishking

Active Member
try using ultralife redslime remover, it work really well, but u got to remember to take out ur carbon, poly filters, and turn ur skimmer off
 
beachbumtx

beachbumtx

Member
HIya!,
There is a product called Chemi Clean and it targets cyanobacteria specifically. Have you tried that? Also, try feeding only a quarter of a cube of the foods you mentioned. Your fish aren't that big so they don't need much. There has to be a nutrient problem feeding the cyanos.
Try Chemi Clean and let us know how that works for you. We have had some good results from our customers that use it.
 
beaslbob

beaslbob

Well-Known Member
two days may not be enough to kill off the red slime.
Like you I do not like adding chemicals.
do you have a refugium or other source of other plant life?
Obviously the red slime is feeding off the nutrients probably phosphates in your system. And they seem to be keeping those phosphates at 0.0. So maybe the lights off will kill the red slime but then you will notice a bump up in phosphates.
The nutrients are obviously comming from the bioload.
So my analysis is that other plant life is needed to consume whatever the nutrients feeding the red slime. the change in lighting may tipped the balance in favor of the red slime at the expense of other plant life. You just need to get that back in balance.
 
michelle13

michelle13

Member
I would love to have a fuge, but I really don't think I can fit one in. I have sooo much stuff crammed in the cabinet and I have spent so much money trying to fix the problem already. How big would it need to be? Would it need to return into the main tank or the sump? I know most people use a gravity return type of system, right? Maybe my husband can figure out a way to fit one in, if it isn't too big. I would really like to stay away from chemicals, so I think I might try Bob's option first. Just out of curiosity, where would the phosphate come from if I'm not putting any in the system? My makeup water always tests 0 and I took some to the LFS to verify this. I know two days may not be enought o kill the slime, I'm just afraid that if I leave it off too long my corals and anemones will suffer.
 
beaslbob

beaslbob

Well-Known Member

Originally posted by michelle13
I would love to have a fuge, but I really don't think I can fit one in. I have sooo much stuff crammed in the cabinet and I have spent so much money trying to fix the problem already. How big would it need to be? Would it need to return into the main tank or the sump? I know most people use a gravity return type of system, right? Maybe my husband can figure out a way to fit one in, if it isn't too big. I would really like to stay away from chemicals, so I think I might try Bob's option first. Just out of curiosity, where would the phosphate come from if I'm not putting any in the system? My makeup water always tests 0 and I took some to the LFS to verify this. I know two days may not be enought o kill the slime, I'm just afraid that if I leave it off too long my corals and anemones will suffer.
Understand about the lights off. besides when you turn the lights on it may just come back.
Phosphates come from the food you add. And you do have a very small amount of nitrates that may be causing the red also.
You might want to check out the diy section for refugiums. I think you have the basic idea correct. Just add a valve to allow a small amount of the sump water to run over to the fuge. then have a drilled overflow from the fuge to return to the sump. With only 5 ppm nitrAtes even a small refuge would help. But if you could fit say a 10-15g plastic storage container in there that would be great. Get a lot of macros like brillo pad in there and the system would be a lot easier to maintain. And add redundancy to the system you already have in the display and sump.
 
kpk

kpk

Active Member
A HOB fuge would be nice, if not already mentioned. I battled for months on end with hair algae and thats the only thing that could keep up with it. My trusty fuge.
Kyle
 
cimpow137

cimpow137

Member
ok lol ive seen it alot and im like umm.... ok. lol but now i know and i will nt go ummm... ok. every time i see it lol:yes:
 
jauringer

jauringer

Member
one thing i see is your flow. turnover of 11x is not very much. I would recomend more like 20x. I have 26x in my tank and I still have one or two dead spots.
 
broomer5

broomer5

Active Member
michelle13
Don't give up ! If you're not one that gives up on things .. don't start now.
Where is the cyanobacteria mostly growing ?
Rocks, sandbed ?
Large sheets or in small patches, or both ?
What is the K rating on your NO bulbs ?
I've had the cyano before in my tanks - most of us had at one point or another. It can be very frustrating for sure - but there is a solution. The trick is to figure out what's causing it.
My opinion - NO bulbs and frozen foods may be contributing, along with the dosing of DT's.
The 175 MH over the tank is giving the corals plenty of intense lighting. There may not be a need for the supplemntal normal outputs ( except asthetics )
Where is the cyanobacteria mostly growing ?
Rocks, sandbed ?
 
kpk

kpk

Active Member
Don't give up michelle I have seen your tank on pics and it look great. Alot of growth in there. Don't give all that away because of a nuisance. I will eventually go with a little more time and work.
Here is a pic of the hob refugium. It's made by cpr.
 
kpk

kpk

Active Member
Oh I just read your post about the refugium. You could get a small rubbermade tub and do like j21kickster did with his refugium above the tank. Just get a decent cheap pump and a little plumbing and there ya go. Or you could turn your sump into a refugium. I had a sump and changed it over. Put some dividers sand and plants. Thats when I conquered the hairrrry monsters.
Here is j21's fuge...
 
taketz

taketz

New Member
What kind of plants could i put in a Refugium if you don't mind my asking. There are mangrove saplings that seem to wash ashore quite often in Fl and if planted with rocks, fertilizer, and salt water they grow. Anyone think this could work and if so, do you think the filtering job it would do would be enough to do anything for my tank?
~
 
kpk

kpk

Active Member
Actually I have 7 mangroves now. I can't really tell if they are helping much yet, because everything was ok when I got em. If I had the room and could get em for free I would get alot. You could also get cheatomorpha (sp.) not caulerpa though.
 
michelle13

michelle13

Member
The cyano is growing in sheets and patches on everything! Sand, rocks, spray bar, etc... I will try to up my flow more and I think i might try to leave my NO's off. I had a 10K for the past year, but a week ago I started using a 12K. The 12K looks alright without the NO, but the 10K looked too yellow. One of the NO's is actinic and the other is a 10K. Thanks to all of you!
 
new_noob

new_noob

Member
Mangroves are the best natural filterers! they are so well at taking out Organic wast they will soon make your skimmer obsolet, They also dont take out trace elements wow you can get them for free??? near me its $20 for a small 6" "twig" with no leafs, and $15 for a seed...... when i went to mexico a couple months ago i "snuck" back 43 Seeds... yeah i am set for a while, ever where in my house there is a mangrove in mud....
 
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