Stray voltage in tank (You there SCSINet?)

[louti]

Well, my return pump seems to be leaking voltage into my tank. It is a rio 1700. I had a couple questions:
1. How much will this affect my fish/inverts (i dont do corals)?
2. Will a grounding probe help the problem?
3. Can I fix the pump? I was thinking maybe siliconing around the power chord where it enters the pump.
Thanks for any help you guys can give me.

 

[louti]

Oh, btw, I found it weird that when I stick my hand in the water, I feel nothing, but when I touch the moist rim of the tank I get shocked. Does that make sense?

 

[scsinet]

A grounding probe will only make the situation worse. I wouldn't add one, at least not yet. If your fish are behaving normally, chances are the situation is not affecting them.
If it happens when you are touching the rim of the tank, either you have something resting on the rim of the tank that's grounded, such as a lighting system on metal legs, and there is a moist or salt covered path from there to where you touch, or you have something grounded submerged in the DT.
First and foremost, I would never try to repair a piece of equipment that is leaking current. Replacing is the safest option.
Does the Rio pump you have use a grounded power cord? What other steps have you done to confirm that it is the pump that is at fault? What other equipment is submerged in the water?

 

[louti]

Well, the fish don't appear to be affected. I know it's the pump, because I tested with a voltmeter. I was measuring 1 amp or volt (whatever it measures) in the water with it plugged in and 0 with it unplugged. Also, I no longer get shocked with it unplugged. The pump is grounded, but I haven't really taken apart the outlet to make sure it is grounded properly. The only thing submerged in the DT is a powerhead. The heater and rio pump are submerged in the sump.
How much would it affect my fish if I just left it?

 

[scsinet]

Unplugging the pump makes the symptom go away (notice I said symptom, not problem). The most likely cause is the pump, don't get me wrong.
Consider this scenario as an alternative to your diagnosis.
The pump is grounded. What if there is something else in the water that is actually leaking current, such as that powerhead in your display tank. That is causing the tank to become electrified. The pump is pulling the water in the sump towards ground. In this scenario, although it seems like the pump is the problem, it may actually be something else, and the pump being grounded makes it appear as the problem, because when you unplug it, the problem goes away, but what you are actually doing is disconnecting the ground when you unplug the pump, not the energy source.
Don't get me wrong, in all likelihood the pump is the problem, but with it being grounded, it's possible that it's not. If it were me, I'd just replace the pump and see what happens, but I'm saying that it's possible that it's not the pump.
I am not doing a very good job of explaining this, but I can't think of another way to put it. Am I making any sense?
Unfortunately, testing with a multimeter can often yield false results. One way to know is to unplug the pump, touch the rim of the tank, and touch something grounded and see if the "shock" persists, but I wouldn't want anyone to actually do this because it's incredibly dangerous to use your body as a test instrument.
Another way to test this is to isolate the pump. Remove the pump and place it in a bucket of seawater, plug it in, and repeat your test with the meter. If you get similar readings, then this should certainly confirm it for you.
I guess my point is that although unplugging the pump makes the problem go away, there are situations where this may not yield conclusive results. Again, I'd just replace the pump, but be prepared for the possibility that this turns out to not be the issue.

 

[mrdc]

SCSInet,
I have a question for you since we are on the stary voltage topic. If I put my arm in my tank and my elbow hits my compacts, I feel a little electricity. I only feel it when I am touching the lights while my arm is in the water. Is this happening because my lights aren't grounded? It shouldn't be an issue now since I have my lights back in my canopy. I had my lights sitting on my tank for a couple of days while my canopy paint dried and this is when it happened. Thanks.

 

[louti]

Originally Posted by SCSInet
http:///forum/post/3229303
Unplugging the pump makes the symptom go away (notice I said symptom, not problem). The most likely cause is the pump, don't get me wrong.
Consider this scenario as an alternative to your diagnosis.
The pump is grounded. What if there is something else in the water that is actually leaking current, such as that powerhead in your display tank. That is causing the tank to become electrified. The pump is pulling the water in the sump towards ground. In this scenario, although it seems like the pump is the problem, it may actually be something else, and the pump being grounded makes it appear as the problem, because when you unplug it, the problem goes away, but what you are actually doing is disconnecting the ground when you unplug the pump, not the energy source.
Don't get me wrong, in all likelihood the pump is the problem, but with it being grounded, it's possible that it's not. If it were me, I'd just replace the pump and see what happens, but I'm saying that it's possible that it's not the pump.
I am not doing a very good job of explaining this, but I can't think of another way to put it. Am I making any sense?
Unfortunately, testing with a multimeter can often yield false results. One way to know is to unplug the pump, touch the rim of the tank, and touch something grounded and see if the "shock" persists, but I wouldn't want anyone to actually do this because it's incredibly dangerous to use your body as a test instrument.
Another way to test this is to isolate the pump. Remove the pump and place it in a bucket of seawater, plug it in, and repeat your test with the meter. If you get similar readings, then this should certainly confirm it for you.
I guess my point is that although unplugging the pump makes the problem go away, there are situations where this may not yield conclusive results. Again, I'd just replace the pump, but be prepared for the possibility that this turns out to not be the issue.
Okay, well, I think I'll try the pump in the bucket and see what happens. I would like to be sure it is the pump before I replace it.

 

[louti]

Well, after further investigation I determined I don't know what I'm doing. I put the pump in a bucket and tested with the multimeter and got nothing. Then I hooked the pump back up and tested the tank and got nothing. Then I gave it the "close my eyes and touch it" test and I can't get it to shock me now. I guess I'm just gonna leave it be until I get shocked again or notice any problems with my fish. Right now, everyone looks great.

 

[scsinet]

Originally Posted by mrdc
http:///forum/post/3229310
SCSInet,
I have a question for you since we are on the stary voltage topic. If I put my arm in my tank and my elbow hits my compacts, I feel a little electricity. I only feel it when I am touching the lights while my arm is in the water. Is this happening because my lights aren't grounded? It shouldn't be an issue now since I have my lights back in my canopy. I had my lights sitting on my tank for a couple of days while my canopy paint dried and this is when it happened. Thanks.
Are you sure the lighting system isn't grounded? I've never seen a commercial lighting system that isn't.
If the lighting system has a grounded plug, it should have it's metal enclosure bonded to ground. Are you using 3 prong adapters to plug the lighting system into 2 prong timers?

 

[mrdc]

No it's three prong so I thought it would be grounded and it is plugged into a 3 plug receptor. The moon lights go on and off so I don't know if they are going bad or are shorted out. Anyway, I don't know why I feel a surge when I touch the lights and the water. I will monitor the situation more now that my halides are off the tank and I shouldn't be touching it anymore while I am working in the tank. Unless you have some more ideas that I need to check out. I have no grounding probe and all my power heads are practically brand new.

 

[dean1956]

I have a rio 1700 that had the same problem and I am one to FIX not throw away since I dont have a money tree, I took the back cover off so I could see where the cord went in to the motor and used JB Weld around the cord at the motor block and now no more shock- 15 minute fix. The cord got like that from spinning around in mixing barrel for saltwater.