Sump ? for Squid or other GURU - See .BMP
- Thread starter tronicsdr
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tronicsdr
Member
Quarantine Tank... I am going to be consolidating down to one tank (240) and shutting down everything else. I thought I would buy myself some cheap real estate for aclimating new fish etc...
I built the "inner walls" of the QT high so when the pump shuts off to feed the tank it won't allow any inhabitants to jump over to the fuge or the MP area....
I thought about this pretty hard but still wanted to bounce it off some peers before building it and realizing....
I built the "inner walls" of the QT high so when the pump shuts off to feed the tank it won't allow any inhabitants to jump over to the fuge or the MP area....
I thought about this pretty hard but still wanted to bounce it off some peers before building it and realizing....
annanymous
Member
IMO definitely no QT in a sump/fuge. that kills all the purpose of a QT. you cant dose copper in your sump, but you sure as he;l will have to if any of your fish will get ich.
better use the QT space for a bigger fuge. fuge should be anywhere from 1/3 to 1/2 of the MT volume for a successfull nutrient removal. this is based on what Squidd told me some time ago.
baffles by the return pump should be 3 in order to eliminate any micro bubbles, and the second baffle should be higher then on a pic. the proportions will look different onvce you calculate the backwash area and determine the ratio of overflow area : fuge : return pump. also make sure that your fuge will not be getting too much flow. oh forgot to ask, where will your skimmer be. is it in-sump or external skimmer. if external then you need to incorporate it in your design. if in-sump, then use the space for QT for the skimmer, though i suggest that water from the fuge should not be skimmed, but should be pumped back to the MT, and the water from the MT should go into the skimmer and then into the fuge for extra malnutrient removal.
ill attach a design that i was originaly planning to use, but desided to have the fuge separate from the sump, which gave me volume ratio. if you want good info read hreads 101 and 102 on design, calculations, and plumbing.
good luck
better use the QT space for a bigger fuge. fuge should be anywhere from 1/3 to 1/2 of the MT volume for a successfull nutrient removal. this is based on what Squidd told me some time ago.
baffles by the return pump should be 3 in order to eliminate any micro bubbles, and the second baffle should be higher then on a pic. the proportions will look different onvce you calculate the backwash area and determine the ratio of overflow area : fuge : return pump. also make sure that your fuge will not be getting too much flow. oh forgot to ask, where will your skimmer be. is it in-sump or external skimmer. if external then you need to incorporate it in your design. if in-sump, then use the space for QT for the skimmer, though i suggest that water from the fuge should not be skimmed, but should be pumped back to the MT, and the water from the MT should go into the skimmer and then into the fuge for extra malnutrient removal.
ill attach a design that i was originaly planning to use, but desided to have the fuge separate from the sump, which gave me volume ratio. if you want good info read hreads 101 and 102 on design, calculations, and plumbing.
good luck
tronicsdr
Member
Yeah, That makes sense. NO QT in sump... I kinda figured I would hear that... I was really trying to shut down other tanks... Any Ideas??
I wasn't planning on using a skimmer, I have been successfully running a 125 with Rock and and a fuge for some time I was planning on keeping w/ the tradition... I have used skimmers in the past (when I had no fuge) and they work well but I have had just as much success w/o.
I have been using grape caulp.. any other recomendations?
I will redraw and repost later today..
Thanks!!
I wasn't planning on using a skimmer, I have been successfully running a 125 with Rock and and a fuge for some time I was planning on keeping w/ the tradition... I have used skimmers in the past (when I had no fuge) and they work well but I have had just as much success w/o.
I have been using grape caulp.. any other recomendations?
I will redraw and repost later today..
Thanks!!
tronicsdr
Member
Dogstar,
I know what you are saying... I thought about it, and maybe the benefits won't outweigh the rewards but I thought if I brought the water in at the bottom it would force most of the water through the vegetation and by bringing it in at the top the water flow would just run accross the top the macro. I definately see what you are saying...
Does anyone know if most of the nutrients in the water will "fall" over the macro as it passes over the top of it or would it be better to let the dust fall where it may...
I could go either way...
Opinions Please!!
I know what you are saying... I thought about it, and maybe the benefits won't outweigh the rewards but I thought if I brought the water in at the bottom it would force most of the water through the vegetation and by bringing it in at the top the water flow would just run accross the top the macro. I definately see what you are saying...
Does anyone know if most of the nutrients in the water will "fall" over the macro as it passes over the top of it or would it be better to let the dust fall where it may...
I could go either way...
Opinions Please!!
tronicsdr
Member
I wasn't planning on using a skimmer, I have been successfully running a 125 with Rock and and a fuge for some time I was planning on keeping w/ the tradition... I have used skimmers in the past (when I had no fuge) and they work well but I have had just as much success w/o.
I have been using grape caulp.. any other recomendations?
Should I really consider going with a skimmer.. I still have a turbofloater 1000 (used) and one NIB
I have been using grape caulp.. any other recomendations?
Should I really consider going with a skimmer.. I still have a turbofloater 1000 (used) and one NIB
tronicsdr
Member
Farmboy,
I can sell you a skimmer or two if you are interested.
I have one NIB, and one that I have used...
The new one comes with a Ocean Runner 2700
I don't have a pump for the used one anymore.
150 bucks for the new one (including pump) or 60 for the used one - You pay shipping.
If you look at championlighting under aqumedic protein skimmers I have the turbofloater 1000 w/ Ocean Runner Pump it lists at 194.90 + shipping
I have a Paypal account. Let me Know
I can sell you a skimmer or two if you are interested.
I have one NIB, and one that I have used...
The new one comes with a Ocean Runner 2700
I don't have a pump for the used one anymore.
150 bucks for the new one (including pump) or 60 for the used one - You pay shipping.
If you look at championlighting under aqumedic protein skimmers I have the turbofloater 1000 w/ Ocean Runner Pump it lists at 194.90 + shipping
I have a Paypal account. Let me Know
tronicsdr
Member
Sqidd,
I used a HOB Excalibur on an old 55 and a Turbo Floater 1000 on my 125. I usually got a good amount of thick skimmate from both, I don't if they would be concidered "good" skimmers or not..
When I put in my fuge and took out the skimmer my water water has stayed pretty nice, I will admit I run an extremely low bio load - only 4 fish in the tank right now and a huge cleanup crew... Maybe I would notice if my bio load was higher??
I am guessing you definately are a believer in the miracles of protein skimming...
This is going to be a work in progress so I am wanting as many honest opinions as I can get from people that are much more experienced than me.. let me know what you think, I will at least take it under advisement...
Thanks!!
I used a HOB Excalibur on an old 55 and a Turbo Floater 1000 on my 125. I usually got a good amount of thick skimmate from both, I don't if they would be concidered "good" skimmers or not..
When I put in my fuge and took out the skimmer my water water has stayed pretty nice, I will admit I run an extremely low bio load - only 4 fish in the tank right now and a huge cleanup crew... Maybe I would notice if my bio load was higher??
I am guessing you definately are a believer in the miracles of protein skimming...
This is going to be a work in progress so I am wanting as many honest opinions as I can get from people that are much more experienced than me.. let me know what you think, I will at least take it under advisement...
Thanks!!
squidd
Active Member
Well, I don't know about "miracles"...
But I do know a decent skimmer can take out a lot of scuzzy sludge...on a regular basis...
And if your not running a skimmer...your not taking it out...
There's no miracle in that...
I'm a firm believer in a "three part" balanced filtration system...Biological, Mechanical and Chemical...
LR and sand for biological, Skimmer performs Mechanical and running carbon and/or Phosphate remoal media performs chemical...
Skimmer for mechanical removal of DOCs and organics thru foam fractionization...over say sponges, floss or "bags" which tend to "trap" organics and NOT get cleaned often enough and start to decompose and add to the nitrate problem...a skimmer cup fills and is cleaned much more reularly and as such is a much more effective way to remove unwanted organics...
Here's my thoughts on filtration...
****************************************************************
Large (adaquate) quantity of Live Rock and SSB for Biological filtration (suface area for Bacteria)...High Flow , distributed through out the tank to keep deitrus suspended and removed from MT,promote gaseous exchange and maintain oxygen levels...a Large sump and LARGER Fuge with Macros for malnutrient removal through export (denitrification) and a Killer Skimmer to remove Mass quantities of DOCs (organics) prior to decomposition...
With a well balanced system, no other "filtration devices" (bioballs/biomedia) are necessary...Other than the ability to run Chemical Media (carbon or phosphate removers) from time to time, best done in a Fluidized bed (or converted canister) type system...
*****************************************************************
But I do know a decent skimmer can take out a lot of scuzzy sludge...on a regular basis...
And if your not running a skimmer...your not taking it out...
There's no miracle in that...
I'm a firm believer in a "three part" balanced filtration system...Biological, Mechanical and Chemical...
LR and sand for biological, Skimmer performs Mechanical and running carbon and/or Phosphate remoal media performs chemical...
Skimmer for mechanical removal of DOCs and organics thru foam fractionization...over say sponges, floss or "bags" which tend to "trap" organics and NOT get cleaned often enough and start to decompose and add to the nitrate problem...a skimmer cup fills and is cleaned much more reularly and as such is a much more effective way to remove unwanted organics...
Here's my thoughts on filtration...
****************************************************************
Large (adaquate) quantity of Live Rock and SSB for Biological filtration (suface area for Bacteria)...High Flow , distributed through out the tank to keep deitrus suspended and removed from MT,promote gaseous exchange and maintain oxygen levels...a Large sump and LARGER Fuge with Macros for malnutrient removal through export (denitrification) and a Killer Skimmer to remove Mass quantities of DOCs (organics) prior to decomposition...
With a well balanced system, no other "filtration devices" (bioballs/biomedia) are necessary...Other than the ability to run Chemical Media (carbon or phosphate removers) from time to time, best done in a Fluidized bed (or converted canister) type system...
*****************************************************************
tronicsdr
Member
True.
I just never really saw a drop in my water quality... If I were going to use a skimmer and a fuge and only plumb in one supply from MT which should I feed first?
I am plannin on the MT (240) only having one 2" supply. I am going to set up the MT as a island tank where all sides will be viewable so I am only putting in one overflow in the center of the tank so I can cover it up with LR.
so should I feed a skimmer first or the fuge? or should I split the 2" maindrain once it is underneath? I don't want to make my plumbing too complicated. I am just planning on doing it myself with PVC...
I just never really saw a drop in my water quality... If I were going to use a skimmer and a fuge and only plumb in one supply from MT which should I feed first?
I am plannin on the MT (240) only having one 2" supply. I am going to set up the MT as a island tank where all sides will be viewable so I am only putting in one overflow in the center of the tank so I can cover it up with LR.
so should I feed a skimmer first or the fuge? or should I split the 2" maindrain once it is underneath? I don't want to make my plumbing too complicated. I am just planning on doing it myself with PVC...
squidd
Active Member
That's why I asked "wher" you were goingto place the skimmer..a couple posts up...
You pic shows a "flow thru" design and all water entering one side would also have to go past skimmer and "thru" fuge too get to return pump...
If your running a decent amount of flow from the MT to sump, it may be a bit much for effecient malnuitrient removal in the fuge...
I prefer the "pump in center" design that annonymous posted...with the drain from main tank "split under the tank and 3/4 or so going to skimmer and 1/4 or so flowing thru fuge ..then both dumping into return pump chamber for the trip back to the MT...
You pic shows a "flow thru" design and all water entering one side would also have to go past skimmer and "thru" fuge too get to return pump...
If your running a decent amount of flow from the MT to sump, it may be a bit much for effecient malnuitrient removal in the fuge...
I prefer the "pump in center" design that annonymous posted...with the drain from main tank "split under the tank and 3/4 or so going to skimmer and 1/4 or so flowing thru fuge ..then both dumping into return pump chamber for the trip back to the MT...