Yet another newbie new tank question...

[tang_man_montreal]

Ok guys...
I'm starting to understand how marine tanks work.
So far, I'm thinking of starting with a 29gal FOWLR tank (unless I find a used larger tank with LS and LR). I know I should start bigger, but budget is a concern with the wife.
Here's what I'm thinking about...
29g long tank
50lbs LR
25lbs LS
RedSea Prizm Skimmer
Ebo-Jagger(sp?) heater
50 Blue leg hermit crabs
13 Turbo Snails
2 Tiger tail cucumbers
1 Serpent Star
1 Pistol Shrimp
1 Cleaner Shrimp
2 False Perc Clowns
2 Bangai Cardinals
-OR-
1 False Perc Clown
1 Bangai Cardinal
1 small (baby) Blue tang
-OR-
2 False Perc Clown
1 Bangai Cardinal
1 Royal Gramma
First of all, I know that the fish would be SLOWLY introduced. I wouldn't just "dump" them all in at once. and I also know that I have to wait till the cycle is over before the first fish.
What I'm not sure about is:
1- Bioload... Do I want too much for this size aquarium?
2- Is 25lbs of LS enough for a DSB for this tank size? Keeping in mind that there is 50lbs of LR, is this enough for filtration? Do I need to think of mechanical filtration?
3- I have no idea what kind of lighting to go with here.. NEED HELP.
4- How am I equipment wise? I know I forgot to mention water movement, because I don't know what to go with.
5- When do I start the skimmer? After the first fish is introduced? After the cycle? During the cycle?
6- What do I need in terms of salt, test kits (which ones?) to start me off with?
Wow.. I know there's more questions. But I'll start with this...

 

[bluemarlin]

Wow thats alot of questions. All good ones too. Lets see if this helps you at all.
Set up and cycle the tank. Use RO water if possible and use a good synthetic sea salt such as (I can't think of the brand name??). Many use a small damsel fish to cycle the tank. The tank will take a couple of weeks to cycle. You'll need a good test kit. Start testing the water for ammonia and nitrites. The tank will go through a phase where ammonia will build until the bacteria develop and convert it to nitrites. (Still very toxic to fish) Next the nitrites will build and then get converted to nitrates. (not great in high numbers but much less toxic.) You are ready to add more fish once your ammonia is 0ppm, you nitrites are 0ppm and your nitrates are around 20 ppm. It is at this time that I would add a protein skimmer. You should also think about a sump but for 29 gallons it may not be necessary, again, depending upon biolode.
You will not need to add snails or hermits in such a great number at first. They need algae to feed on or they will starve and die. Add a couple of hermits and a few turbo snails and more as needed later.
Temp should be around 78 degrees, salt should be about 1.023-1.024. As for lights, you can use whatever looks good for the tank until you change over to a reef system. Then you'll need stronger lights and lights with more color specifics.
I hope this helps.

 

[jeo]

ok, 25 lbs of sand will probably only give you a sand bed or 1"-2" which isn't bad, but doesn't really qualify as a "deep sand bed" which is 4"+
with that amount of live rock you should be just fine for biological filtration though, so I wouldn't worry about it.
as far as your fish choices go, the tang is definitly a no go, but the other choices (percs, cardinals, and gramma) are good. 3 of those small fish would be great, 4 might be pushing it, but if you get that amount of lr, ls, and skimmer, I think you will be fine if you go slowly.
Start the skimmer after your tank cycles
get a powerhead or 2 for some water flow, Maxi-Jets are the best kind of powerhead. I think 2 Maxi-Jet 900 (230 gph) or Maxi-Jet 600 (160 gph)would be good
as far as lights, if you are doing a FOWLR then a NO flo. light will be fine, extra light will just grow algae
good luck

 

[bradburycf]

Tang-man,
If $ is a concern, you could always add 50lbs of aquarium sand and 50 lbs of live rock. The live rock will seed the sand and then you'd have a dsb for a lot less. You could also buy base rock and less live rock. The base rock will also be seeded by the lr. Of course, this will add more time to getting your tank set up, but will cost much less. My wife really likes the much less part. This hobby gets expensive anyway, it might be easier on your love life to break her in slowly The 'breaking her in easy' hasn't actually worked for me though. I am always in the doghouse after returning from the lfs

 

[cap'n pete]

Everyone made good points. No tang, 50 lbs of LR and 50 lbs of LS, add inverts slowly (I seriously doubt that you will need 50 hermits, maybe twenty). I have a 29G (check out the homepage in my signature), and feel 3 small fish is all you should add in a tank that size. feel free to contact me via email if you have any questions. I will gladly give you some advise on setting up. HTH

 

[broomer5]

Tang_man_Montreal
All good advise.
I'll just say this ...
If you're planning to just go with a FOWLR and do not have interest in reef/corals, then the lighting will not kill your wallet.
In this case, I would encourage you to consider a larger tank.
When you add up all that you will spend on all of the hardware and livestock ... the aditional intitial cost of the tank and stand is not such a big deal.
A 55 or 75 ( or larger ) size tank would allow you a lot more choices for the types and number of fish and inverts.
I can say without a doubt, unless someone is setting up a small nano reef tank ... that "most" people that initially set up their tanks - wish they had a bigger one. Almost always
Price up a 75 or 55 vs. the 29 ( tank & stand ) and see if it may be possible to work your budget around a bigger tank.
You said it yourself that you know you should go with a bigger tank. Don't regret doing so now, if you can swing it.

 

[tang_man_montreal]

Thank you everyone for all your advice.
I will look into a larger tank. Although it's not the price of the tank, it's the price of the LR and LS that has to go in it that makes the bg difference. In a 29g, you can get away with 50lbs of LR, but in a 75g or 90g, you need atleast 100lbs.
That's a lot of LR at $7.50/lb cdn! $750 just in LR!
Now, I was at the local home depot yesterday. I found some playsand (not southdown, some local brand), but I was surprised to find that it said "safe for terrarium/aquarium use" right on the package of sand. I took a handful, and it seemed right. Small granules, nice white color..
So say I went with just playsand (4" DSB), 100lbs of LR, and a detrivore kit. Would I be ok? Would the playsand get seeded? How much sand would I need for a 4" dsb in a 90g?
I'm finally getting the wifey around to letting me probably spend some money on this!