MY DT HAS ICH MY BLUE FACE ANGEL HAS ONE CLOUDY EYE

[Steve Blum]

I RECENTLY PURCHASED TWO 6 INCH ANGELS, A BLUE FACE AND AN ANNULARIS, MY QT WAS TOO SMALL SO I PUT THEM IN THE DT. THE FISHB STRESSED AND HAVE ICH, MY ASFUR ANGEL HAS SOME WHITE BLOTCHES ON ITS PECTORAL FINS, MY QUEEN ANGEL, ASFUR, AND TUSK ARE SCRATCHING A LITTLE BUT NOT REAL BAD, OF CONCERN IS MY BLUE FACE, IT HAS BEEN FINE, AND SINCE MORNING FEEDING HAS DEVELOPED ONE CLOUDY EYE. I KNOW ALL THIS IS ICH RELATED. I HAVE BEEN TREATING WITH COPPERSAFE, I BROUGHT THE LEVELN UP SLOWLYBAS I KNEW ANGELS AND WRASSES ARE SUSCEPTIBLE TO COPPER.

ANY ADVICE, WILL THE CLOUDY EYE RESOLVE ITSELF, HOW LONG BEFORE SCRATCHING DISAPPEARS, NANYTHING ELSE I SHOULDBDO

 

[lmforbis]

Are you testing the copper level in your tank? With copper safe the API test is best
Is there sand, crushed coral and or rocks in your tank? Sand and rock absorb copper and will effectively lower the copper concentration making it sub therapeutic. In the display tank you are better off using hypo salinity. It won’t be affected by the sand or rocks. It won’t affect the sand or rocks (once you use copper on rocks it will be absorbed into the rocks and slowly leach out for a very long time). You just need to lower the salinity slowly to 1.009 and keep it there. It can’t go above that at all during the treatment process. it is important you use a calibrated refractometer.

Neither copper or hypo salinity will kill anything but the free swimming parasites. You will probably need to treat for a longer time frame to prevent reinfection. Since they are still in the display which will have all stages of the ich parasites

Normally you would never treat with copper in a display. It will kill inverts at very low levels now your tank is contaminated long term with copper. I’d suggest investing in a much larger QT and removing all the fish for proper treatment. Bare bottom tank. with a heater, sponge filter and pvc joints. This way after the requisite 72 days fish less the display will be ich free.

The cloudy eye may improve with treatment on its own but it could also be a secondary bacterial infection. The fish will hopefully stop flashing in a few days but it could be longer.

 

[Steve Blum]

Are you testing the copper level in your tank? With copper safe the API test is best
Is there sand, crushed coral and or rocks in your tank? Sand and rock absorb copper and will effectively lower the copper concentration making it sub therapeutic. In the display tank you are better off using hypo salinity. It won’t be affected by the sand or rocks. It won’t affect the sand or rocks (once you use copper on rocks it will be absorbed into the rocks and slowly leach out for a very long time). You just need to lower the salinity slowly to 1.009 and keep it there. It can’t go above that at all during the treatment process. it is important you use a calibrated refractometer.

Neither copper or hypo salinity will kill anything but the free swimming parasites. You will probably need to treat for a longer time frame to prevent reinfection. Since they are still in the display which will have all stages of the ich parasites

Normally you would never treat with copper in a display. It will kill inverts at very low levels now your tank is contaminated long term with copper. I’d suggest investing in a much larger QT and removing all the fish for proper treatment. Bare bottom tank. with a heater, sponge filter and pvc joints. This way after the requisite 72 days fish less the display will be ich free.

The cloudy eye may improve with treatment on its own but it could also be a secondary bacterial infection. The fish will hopefully stop flashing in a few days but it could be longer.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR RESPONSE. I DID NOT TEST FOR COPPER LEVEL I HAVE A SALIFERT TEST KIT, HOWEVER THEY ALL DERPEND ON SEEING A FAINT COLOR, MY EYES ARE NOT SO GOOD ANYMORE AND I CASN NOT SEE THE COLOR CHANGE, I HAVE A CRUSHED CORAL SUBSTRATE, I HAVE NO INVERTS OR CORAL. HAVE ONLY FISH. I REALIZE THE ROCKS ABSORB THE COPPER AS WELL AS THE SUBSTRATE, I TREATED WITH COPPERSAFE I AND TOOK IT TO CLOSE TO THE 2 LEVEL SO IT SHOULD BE THERAPUTIC, I ADD A LITTLE EVERY FEW DAYS TO MAKE SURE IT IS COVERED FROM DEGRADATION, I AM AFFRAID TO USE HYPOSALINITY BECAUSE IT MAY STRESS THE FISH MORE AND I DONT WANT TO DILUTE THE TANK AS IT WILL HAVE TO BE DONE TO GET THE SALINITY TO 1.09 AND THEN MY COPPER WILL NOT BE EFFECTIVE AND I WON'T KNOW HOW MUCH COPPER TO PUT BACK. I KNOW THE CLOUDY EYE IS PROBABLY DUE TO ICH AND I DON'T THINK IT IS BACTERIAL, HOWEVER, THE COPPER MAY HAVE CONTRIBUTED TO POOR WATER QUALITY, I USE COPPERSAFE BECAUSE IT IS CHELATED AND NOT SO HARD ON MY ANGELS AND THE TUSK, I HATE THE SCRATCHING AND I AM GLAD YOU TELL ME IT MAY TAKE A LITTLE LONGER. I AM ALSO THINKING MAYBE I GOT THE COPPER LEVEL TO HIGH AND IT CAUSED THE CLOUDY EYE, I ADDED SOME MORE COPPER BEFORE THE MORNING FEEDING, THIS AFTERNOON WHEN I FED I SAW THE CLOUDY EYE WHICH MAKES ME SUSCPISOUS OF THE COPPER LEVEL BEING A LITTLE HIGH. THE COPPERSAFE IS GOOD FOR A MONTH SO I HOPE IN THAT TIME ALL HAVE DROPPED OFF AND BECAME FREE SWIMMING.

I REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR INFORMATION, IT WAS VERY GOOD AND YOU COVERED ALL THE ASPECTS, I THANK YOU FOR SPENDING TIME WITH ME.


STEVE

STEVE

 

[lmforbis]

You need the API for copper safe the others won’t work. Treatment won’t work if level is too low. Fish will be poisoned if level is too high.

hypo is much, much less stressful. Copper is a poison and since you aren’t testing with the recommended test kit you don’t know your level. Copper safe (chelates copper) does not degrade So every little bit more you add increases the concentration. Over the next 48 hours start removing water and replacing it with RO DI until your salinity is 1.009 I like to go to 1.008. Say take out 10% at a time then slowly add the same amount of pure water over a couple hours. Measure salinity and repeat until the salinity is good. you can take salinity down pretty fast. No need to add copper back as you lower the salinity. After 6-8 weeks when you bring it back up go very slow over 10-14 days. hypo is much safer than copper for the fish and your DT.

It isn’t the parasites on the fish that are the issue, they fall off in a couple days, it is the parasites that are not on the fish and not freeswimming attached to the rock and anything else in the tank that will make the ich stick around. The recommended time to make sure they have all emerged and died is 72 days.

 

[Steve Blum]

THANK YOU FOR YOUR INFORMATION, I WILL PROBABLY DO IT TOMORROR I DO HAVE A REFRACTOMETER, I WILL FOLOW YOUR DIRECTIONS IN THE MEANTIME I WILL READ ABOUT THIS METHOD
I ALSO THINK EVEN WAITING 72 DAYS YOU PROBABLY WILL NOT KILL ALL THE PARASITES

MANY THANKS

STEVE

 

[lmforbis]

72 days is enough to ensure all parasites have become free swimming and have died. You need to be diligent about the salinity and never let it exceed 1.009 During the duration.

 

[Steve Blum]

CAN SOMEONE TELL ME WHY? I HAVE 5 ANGELS FOUR OF THEM NOW HAVE ONE CLOUDY EYE

WHY ARE BOTHBEYES NOT CLOUDY?

 

[lmforbis]

they may eventually both cloud up.

 

[Steve Blum]

they may eventually both cloud up.

I THINK I AM KIND OF LUCKY, THE OTHER ON ALL THE FISH LOOK GOOD. THE FISH ARE EATING LIKE CRAZY. SINCE I ADDED PRAZIQUANTEL THE FSH HAVE STOPPED SCRATCHING AND THE EYE THAT ARE CLOUDY HAVE MADE A REMARKABLE RECOVERY. I CAN NOW SEE THE PUPIL IN THE EYES, REALLY LOOKS LIKE IT WAS THE COVERING OFTHE EYE THAT WAS AFFECTED AND THIS IS GETTING MUCH SMALLER.

OF FURTHER NOTE I HAD ORDERED FROM ***********, I CANCELLED THE ORDER, THEY MADE A MISTAKE AND SHIPPED ME A SIX BAR ANGEL THAT HAD BEEN CANCELLED, SO THEY TOLD ME TO KEEP IT OR DONATE IT. I REALLY DID NOT WANT IT, I HAVE A BANDIT ANGEL COMING NEXT WEEK, I GUESS I WILL KEEP IT.

STEVE