Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheClemsonKid http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers#post_3494309
I'm curious why you think liberals (myself being one of them) are so extreme about defending or somehow accepting any of the things you mentioned above. I think at the core of most young liberals (I'm 31) is that we're tired of Christian conservative morals being injected into policy, and we don't bow down to whatever the military might says must be done in the name of America. I personally believe a lot of our foreign policy decisions since the end of WWII have been made more for financial stability and gain for a select few, who get to shape said policy. If you want to hire your own mercenaries and pay them accordingly, then I say have at it. What I personally don't care for is putting soldiers in harms way for financial gain, which is what I feel like has been done a lot lately. They aren't defending America anymore like when we stormed the beaches on D-Day. THAT was patriotic. Freeing Jews from Nazi death camps, THAT was patriotic. Being sent to Iraq to guard a Haliburton project, or making sure that the infrastructure heads of various multi billion dollar government contracts in foreign land is NOT.
When the s**t hits the fan and we are actually in danger, i'll be the first liberal to say send Hell and send it hard. Iran attacks Israel, wipe Tehran off the map. If some other state sponsored terrorist event takes place on our soil or where our national security is compromised, then wipe them off the map. I just don't think we need to be meddling in other countries business in the middle east when no matter what we do, democracy isn't going to stick. And I don't think our soldiers need to be dying for that cause.
Christian Conservative Morals have done pretty well by us. There are two contentious issues framed by religion, Abortion and Gay Marriage. Even if the supreme court were to overturn Roe which is extremely unlikely few states would outlaw the practice. Even Christian Conservatives are coming to accept Civil Unions for gays which is as far as our government should go anyway. Marriage is a religious institution our government violates the constitution every time it meddles in it anyway. The thing is the debate is framed by the extreme jackasses on both sides. If you listen to liberals abortion is a right of passage for every girl and conservative think someone is going to abort the second coming of Christ. Those of use who can think for ourselves don't put a lot of weight on these issues cause there's a whole lot bigger problems facing the country.
On Iraq you fell for the left wing propaganda against it hook line and sinker. Consider this about Iraq. From day one of the WMD inspections following Gulf War I Hussein was doing every thing he could to give the impression he was hiding something. After a few years of inspections we had no clue how close Iraq had been to a nuke until his son in law defected and spilled the beans.
In 1995, Just a few short years after getting their clock cleaned by the US (mostly) Iraq attempted to assassinate George the first during a trip to Saudi Arabia
Iraq continuously violated UN sanctions
Repeatedly fired on US and British warplanes patrolling no fly zones.
Openly supported Palestinian terrorist
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Agents of the Iraq government were known to have meetings with Al Qeada
Iraq had explored the possibility of making a terrorist style attack on the US. Vladmir Putin who was a staunch opponent of the Iraq war said his government also had intelligence about that and passed it along.
So, you have this crazy bass turd who everyone thinks still has WMD's (which he did in limited supply) who was bold enough to try to assassinate a former US president, who repeatedly violated UN sanctions, Fired on Coalition aircraft enforcing UN sanctions and openly supported terrorists. Elements of his government were known to have meetings with members of the terrorist group that attacked the USA and has made inquiries into ways of making a terrorist style attack on the USA. Given all that you don't think removing him from power was the right move?
Even in hindsight Iraq did still possess WMD's, just not in the amounts we expected. With full access to Iraq records the best we could conclude was that the meetings with Al Qeada "Didn't appear to result in any collaborative relationship". Given what we knew before we invaded I stand with people like the Clintons and a lot of other Democrats who saw the evidence and intelligence from both the Clinton and Bush administrations and decided it was the right thing to do.
