2 different speakers...........

[bionicarm]

Quote:
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/20#post_3494492
Keep in mind we, under international law, had the legal right to resume military action against Iraq because it had violated the terms of the cease fire. Those other countries with bad actors we have no such right. As far as oil goes if there were no oil in the middle east there would be no reason for us to have ever been there in the first place BUT. Because we were there you have the radical elements doing things like fly jets into buildings so while oil might be at the root cause of all of this it had nothing to do with why we invaded Iraq. Had Hussein been open and admitted he destroyed most of his stockpiles after 1991 I have no doubt he'd still be in power.
Let's talk about racism a moments. I voted against 0bama because (and this is from memory so I'll miss some) He supported an all out ban on handguns and Semiauto weapons of any kind AND THEN GOT CAUGHT LYING ABOUT IT. In the state legislature he voted against a bill that would have prohibited good time being awarded to convicted child molesters. He voted against a bill that would have allowed prosecution of kid as young as 16 as adults if they were charged with a violent crime in association with gang activity. In the US Senate he voted against a law that would make it a federal crime for an unrelated adult to take a minor girl across state lines for an abortion if it was to avoid a state's parental notification laws.
Most people I know who voted against him could name specific reasons for voting against him as well. What I would like to know is what in this radical's past did you on the left decide made him a reasonably qualified candidate for president? My personal opinion is that for every person who voted against him just because he's black 10 voted for him for the very same reason.
More Fox News talking points. He NEVER supported an all out ban on handguns and semiauto weapons. That's just an outright lie. If anything, he's supported more 2nd Amendement rights since he's been in office (try allowing firearms in national parks). The other little tidbits? How many other Congressmen voted against those bills? If they were so important, why couldn't they get passed?
I voted for the guy because the Republicans didn't provide a viable alternative. I voted for him because the President that was holding the office was the major catalyst for putting this country into the deepest recession since the Great Depression, and the Republican's platform pretty much mirrored his (Bush) philosophies. The Republican candidate selected the most inept, radical VP choice this country has ever seen, and 7 out of 10 Americans were scared Sh%$$*less that she could possibly become POTUS if an aged McCain were to kick off during his four year term.
Your last response just validates Clemson's theory on the mindset of those that despise Obama. They claim that they aren't racist, but when they sit around with their buddies drinking beer, they talk trash about those N%%%(gers that have kept this country in the doldrums. I could give a rats a^&% what color the skin is of any candidate running for office. I can just imagine the criticisms that would occur if a Hispanic ever tries running for the top office. "Show me your papers!" "This is America, either speak English or go home."

 

[reefraff]

Quote:
Originally Posted by bionicarm http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/40#post_3494549
More Fox News talking points. He NEVER supported an all out ban on handguns and semiauto weapons. That's just an outright lie. If anything, he's supported more 2nd Amendement rights since he's been in office (try allowing firearms in national parks). The other little tidbits? How many other Congressmen voted against those bills? If they were so important, why couldn't they get passed?
Is this a "Fox news talking point?
Late last year, in response to a Politico story about Obama's answer to the original questionnaire his aides said he “never saw or approved” the questionnaire.
They asserted the responses were filled out by a campaign aide who mischaracterize[d] his position.”
But a Politico examination determined that Obama was actually interviewed about the issues on the questionnaire by the liberal Chicago nonprofit group that issued it. And it found that Obama — the day after sitting for the interview — filed an amended version of the questionnaire, which appears to contain Obama’s own handwritten notes added to one answer. Oopsi. Barry O caught in a blatant lie
The two questionnaires, provided to Politico with assistance from political sources opposed to Obama’s presidential campaign, were later supplied directly by the group, Independent Voters of Illinois — Independent Precinct Organization. Obama and his then-campaign manager, who Obama’s campaign asserts filled out the questionnaires, were familiar with the group, its members and its positions, since both were active in it before Obama's 1996 state Senate run.
Through an aide, Obama, who won the group’s endorsement as well as the statehouse seat, did not dispute that the handwriting was his. But he contended it doesn’t prove he completed, approved — or even read — the latter questionnaire.
So 0bama says he never saw the questionnaire and an aid filled it out yet a second one was issued with HIS HANDWRITTEN RESPONSE TO ONE OF THE QUESTIONS. Furthermore when he was interviewed in person by the group he never disputed the answers he provided on the questionnaire.

 

[reefraff]

Quote:
Originally Posted by bionicarm http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/40#post_3494549
I voted for the guy because the Republicans didn't provide a viable alternative. I voted for him because the President that was holding the office was the major catalyst for putting this country into the deepest recession since the Great Depression, and the Republican's platform pretty much mirrored his (Bush) philosophies. The Republican candidate selected the most inept, radical VP choice this country has ever seen, and 7 out of 10 Americans were scared Sh%$$*less that she could possibly become POTUS if an aged McCain were to kick off during his four year term.
LOL! Sarah Palin had better qualifications to be president than 0bama. What had he ever ran? His nose LOL! But I digress. You had several choices of non Republicans to choose from in the Democrat primary. Why this tool? Oh, lets not forget the Democrats Controlled 2 of the three branches of the government in January 2007 when unemployment was 4.6 percent and doing fine. If you leftists claim the Republicans are chillin 0bama's cool vibe with just control of congress then you have to accept the blame for Democrats crashing the economy the end of 07 LOL!

 

[reefraff]

Quote:
Originally Posted by bionicarm http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/40#post_3494549
Your last response just validates Clemson's theory on the mindset of those that despise Obama. They claim that they aren't racist, but when they sit around with their buddies drinking beer, they talk trash about those N%%%(gers that have kept this country in the doldrums. I could give a rats a^&% what color the skin is of any candidate running for office. I can just imagine the criticisms that would occur if a Hispanic ever tries running for the top office. "Show me your papers!" "This is America, either speak English or go home."
How does my response validate Clemson's criticism? I can point to numerous reasons for voting against 0bama, all based on solid facts and reasonable positions. A lot of those bills I mention 0bama opposed were passed with bipartisan support. You supposedly voted for him because he wasn't Bush. That's a pretty stupid reason to trust an inexperienced. unknown candidate with the presidency.

 

[bionicarm]

Quote:
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/40#post_3494553
How does my response validate Clemson's criticism? I can point to numerous reasons for voting against 0bama, all based on solid facts and reasonable positions. A lot of those bills I mention 0bama opposed were passed with bipartisan support. You supposedly voted for him because he wasn't Bush. That's a pretty stupid reason to trust an inexperienced. unknown candidate with the presidency.
Uh, we trusted Reagan, movie star turned Governor of the worst managed state in the country. We're supposed to trust these Tea Baggers that come from absolutely nowhere with no political experience. Now you want to trust Romney whose record in Massachusetts was more Liberal than what Obama has done the last four years. The guy started out as a Democrat. I have the same solid facts and reasons for not voting for McCain. You had Ron Paul running as an Independent, but there's about as much of a chance of any candidate other than a Democrat or Republican winning a POTUS nomination than there is the US colonizing Mars.

 

[bionicarm]

Quote:
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/40#post_3494552
LOL! Sarah Palin had better qualifications to be president than 0bama. What had he ever ran? His nose LOL! But I digress. You had several choices of non Republicans to choose from in the Democrat primary. Why this tool? Oh, lets not forget the Democrats Controlled 2 of the three branches of the government in January 2007 when unemployment was 4.6 percent and doing fine. If you leftists claim the Republicans are chillin 0bama's cool vibe with just control of congress then you have to accept the blame for Democrats crashing the economy the end of 07 LOL!
Better qualifications? Mickey Mouse could run the state of Alaska. There's more people living in San Antonio than that entire state. The only thing she needed to legislate was how big the stipend checks would be that every resident received each year from the oil glut.

 

[bionicarm]

Quote:
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/40#post_3494551
Is this a "Fox news talking point?
Late last year, in response to a Politico story about Obama's answer to the original questionnaire his aides said he “never saw or approved” the questionnaire.
They asserted the responses were filled out by a campaign aide who mischaracterize[d] his position.”
But a Politico examination determined that Obama was actually interviewed about the issues on the questionnaire by the liberal Chicago nonprofit group that issued it. And it found that Obama — the day after sitting for the interview — filed an amended version of the questionnaire, which appears to contain Obama’s own handwritten notes added to one answer. Oopsi. Barry O caught in a blatant lie
The two questionnaires, provided to Politico with assistance from political sources opposed to Obama’s presidential campaign, were later supplied directly by the group, Independent Voters of Illinois — Independent Precinct Organization. Obama and his then-campaign manager, who Obama’s campaign asserts filled out the questionnaires, were familiar with the group, its members and its positions, since both were active in it before Obama's 1996 state Senate run.
Through an aide, Obama, who won the group’s endorsement as well as the statehouse seat, did not dispute that the handwriting was his. But he contended it doesn’t prove he completed, approved — or even read — the latter questionnaire.
So 0bama says he never saw the questionnaire and an aid filled it out yet a second one was issued with HIS HANDWRITTEN RESPONSE TO ONE OF THE QUESTIONS. Furthermore when he was interviewed in person by the group he never disputed the answers he provided on the questionnaire.
What questionaire? Bottom line - what legislation has occurred in the last four years that has limited anyone's ability to own handguns or semi-automatic weapons? What direct attempts has the Obama Administartion tried to circumvent the 2nd Amendment? Can you own or purchase any gun you choose today?
You can go look at voting histories all day when it comes to politicians. Some votes are influenced by the "riders" and "pork barrel" crap that gets added to a bill at the last minute. Obama could very well have voted no on those bills you described simply because of some other provision contained in the bill he was adamately against.

 

[reefraff]

Quote:
Originally Posted by bionicarm http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/40#post_3494575
What questionaire? Bottom line - what legislation has occurred in the last four years that has limited anyone's ability to own handguns or semi-automatic weapons? What direct attempts has the Obama Administartion tried to circumvent the 2nd Amendment? Can you own or purchase any gun you choose today?
You can go look at voting histories all day when it comes to politicians. Some votes are influenced by the "riders" and "pork barrel" crap that gets added to a bill at the last minute. Obama could very well have voted no on those bills you described simply because of some other provision contained in the bill he was adamately against.
What Questionnaire? http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0308/9269.html
So far 0bama has taken baby steps, He ended the practice of selling spent military brass to commercial reloaders which caused ammo prices to go up. He also blocked the reimportation of M1 garands from Korea. Both cases would have made the government money and you aren't going to see gang bangers sporting the garands. They are sold through the Department of civilian marksmanship after the purchaser has attended two events that include gun safety training and the purchaser has to go through a more extensive background check than normal gun purchasers including background checks and you are limited to a single gun purchase. In short there is no reasonable excuse not to allow it other than being anti gun. Also ask yourself this. In 2007 the ATF ended their gun running scheme which included electronic tracking of the weapons and active participation of the Mexican government because they couldn't track the guns. Why on earth would the 0bama administration bring back the program without the participation of the Mexicans or the electronic tracking? They were going to use it as a propaganda point to bring back an assault weapons ban as soon as "He doesn't have another election to worry about.
Had none of the bills 0bama voted against passed you might have a point but all were passed with bipartisan majorities. In the case of abortion he did it to maintain his 100% NARAL rating. He was the only vote against the child molester law. Mr. second amendment supporter LOL! also voted against a bill that would have shielded a homeowner who used a gun in self defense from being prosecuted for violating a city gun ban.

 

[reefraff]

Quote:
Originally Posted by bionicarm http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/40#post_3494574
Better qualifications? Mickey Mouse could run the state of Alaska. There's more people living in San Antonio than that entire state. The only thing she needed to legislate was how big the stipend checks would be that every resident received each year from the oil glut.
What did 0bama ever run? Nothing, and it shows.

 

[theclemsonkid]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/20#post_3494472
Sad to say,but your belief is most likely wrong based off the evidence. Like I stated, it was and always will be, about National Security, Oil supply is a larger national security threat than Iran's nuclear Program. We didn't recieve squat when it come to oil fields or oil revenue from Iraq, However, we did increase Iraq oil Production. As long as Hussien was in charge, Iraq would forever be under sanctions and the oil supply would be choked out of the region. This causing industrialized nations (ourselves being first and foremost) to make some tough monetary, economical, and environmental decisions.
One year before we started talking about invading Iraq, Iraq was pumping 1.9 million barrels of oil a day. Now they are pumping 2.5 million barrels of oil a day. How much higher would fuel be without that output? In five more years, Iraq will be pumping a monstrous 12 million barrels a day. 90% of which are done by non american companies. So it wasn't for US to get money. But in the long run, the citizens of this nation we live in will see the benefits of an Iraq not ruled by Hussien without ever knowing it. 12 million barrels a day will do a lot to keep cost down. It also keeps our politicians from actually choosing to drill or be "green" Because, you can bet your ass, even the most hippie politician will be saying drill baby drill if the middle east completely erupts and oil production is brought to a screeching halt.
I understand your point on national security, and how it is tied to oil. And I don't want to start the oil speculation debate, but I think whether we pump 3 million or 12 million barrels a day out of Iraq, it isn't going to be the "be all end all" reason gas fluctuates. I think that OPEC and big oil have finally just said "f**k it, we're gonna charge as much as we possibly can short of causing the global economy to collapse." Greed at it's absolute worst. Welcome to global capitalism boys and girls!

 

[reefraff]

Quote:
Originally Posted by bionicarm http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/40#post_3494573
Uh, we trusted Reagan, movie star turned Governor of the worst managed state in the country. We're supposed to trust these Tea Baggers that come from absolutely nowhere with no political experience. Now you want to trust Romney whose record in Massachusetts was more Liberal than what Obama has done the last four years. The guy started out as a Democrat. I have the same solid facts and reasons for not voting for McCain. You had Ron Paul running as an Independent, but there's about as much of a chance of any candidate other than a Democrat or Republican winning a POTUS nomination than there is the US colonizing Mars.
Under Reagan California went from a deficit to a balanced budget. It was good times there for most during his governor years. Remember I lived there. Tea Baggers aren't running for president. Romney's record in Mass was influenced by a heavily Democrat legislature yet he still accomplished a lot. When he entered office they were dead last in job creation. His fourth year in office they had moved up to 28th. Unemployment went down and he balanced the budget and created a surplus. I'd say that was a pretty good job. He was never a Democrat but was an independent. Considering all that and the lousy job 0bama is doing I am surprised you aren't voting for him LOL! But it backs up my feeling he comes from a place where I think he has a good chance of getting both sides to work together, at least better than they do now.

 

[reefraff]

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheClemsonKid http:///t/393084/2-different-speakers/40#post_3494585
I understand your point on national security, and how it is tied to oil. And I don't want to start the oil speculation debate, but I think whether we pump 3 million or 12 million barrels a day out of Iraq, it isn't going to be the "be all end all" reason gas fluctuates. I think that OPEC and big oil have finally just said "f**k it, we're gonna charge as much as we possibly can short of causing the global economy to collapse." Greed at it's absolute worst. Welcome to global capitalism boys and girls!
The more production we have the less the ability for speculation.
There is a game changer in the works. If you invest in the stock market get into natural gas. How big of an effect on gas prices do you think there would be if big rigs and heavy equipment ran on natural gas instead of diesel?

 

[darthtang aw]

The more production we have the less the ability for speculation.
Exactly. also it will shift power within opec some. Less influence from Saudi Arabia and More influence from a U.S. rebuilt Iraq. If drilling increases in other parts of the world that will also limit OPEC's (Saudi Arabia) influence on pricing.

 

[mantisman51]

Just gonna throw it out there for some levity: heard some Tejano today without the retarded tuba. It was actually kind of catchy.