280g Fish List

[kylev]

I'm planning a ~280g L tank that will get started short like and am just pondering my possible stocking list
The tank is going to be 2'tall and 2'wide, with the outside dimensions of 5'x6' so the dimensions against the wall would be 3'x4'. The tank wont be made for a couple weeks so I can tweak these dimensions still if other options would be more efficient, but i do plan on staying with the L because i want to be able to see the tank from two rooms. I'm going to have a ~150g sump in a closet next to the tank with a 55g Qt above it
My very wish full fish list would be
-Large angels probably two outta a emperor, blueface, or queen (all would be amazing)
-tangs; hippo, blonde naso, sohal (too aggressive if last fish??)
-harlequin tusk
-dragon moray eel
-would there be anyway a pair of clowns would be safe from the eel if I gave him some chromis to look at?
Any suggestions are appreciated for list removals or additions of new fish

 

[kylev]

any opinions???? I would like this tank to be as much of a success as possbile so as much input as possible would be great

 

[kjr_trig]

Love L shaped tanks

By Dragon, I assume you mean either Hawaiian or Japanese? Very very risky in a community set up, many eels are crustacean eaters, the Hawaiian Dragon is a fish eater, not only are the clowns possible not safe, but all fish are in potential danger.
gotta run, will discuss more later...kid responsibilities

 

[kjr_trig]

As to the rest of your list, I like it. It's always "buyer beware" when doing a Sohal, but if added last and having no other Acanthurus genus Tangs, I think it will be ok. I may be off base, but my experience says 3 large angels works better than 2, when I just had my Asfur and Emperor, there was a lot more squabbling than now that I have Emperor, Asfur and Passer.
If you do the Harlequin Tusk (and you should for sure), don't be tempted by the less expensive Indo version, spend the extra $$$ and get an Aussie for sure, they are much more colorful, develop nicer "blue fangs", and have a better survival rate.
Back to the Eel, I have seen people get the Brazilian Dragon successfully in a community set-up, but I don't think a Hawaiian Dragon would be a good idea. There are a lot of interesting "community safe" eels, not as impressive as a Hawaiian Dragon, but still some cool eels.

 

[skate020]

jap drag will be fine with large angels and stuff. aslong as they are fairl big when you get them.
as for clowns, just a plain NO. clowns are slow swimmers most of the time, slower then chromis and damsels, and alot more distinctive, they will get choosen out of the group.
if you minus the clowns then that would be fine, providing the fish are fairly large. get a load of damsels and chromis aswell for the eel to play with

 

[kjr_trig]

Originally Posted by skate020
http:///forum/post/3230098
jap drag will be fine with large angels and stuff. aslong as they are fairl big when you get them.
as for clowns, just a plain NO. clowns are slow swimmers most of the time, slower then chromis and damsels, and alot more distinctive, they will get choosen out of the group.
if you minus the clowns then that would be fine, providing the fish are fairly large. get a load of damsels and chromis aswell for the eel to play with
With all due respect, your the guy asking for eel advice in another thread, now you are giving definitive answers to somebody else.

AGAIN, Japanese and Hawaiian Dragons are fish eaters, no fish is guaranteed safe, not by a longshot....Do some research on Wetwebmedia from Marco and Bob Fenner.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/morays.htm

 

[kylev]

thanks for the input
Kjr, I have been on and off with the japanese dragon moray eel for a while now and believe its going to stay removed from the list. The three angles seem to be a much better option and they would be an emperor, blueface, and queen. Thanks for the advice on the tusk because IMO the extra money for the fish is nothing compared to whole picture. The Sohal would definetely be the last fish and the only one from the Acanthurus family.
Do you feel most small fish would also be safe in here, such as a blenny, goby, dwarf angels, or bluespot jawfish?
The tank will also be acrylic so eels scare me for possible quakes and scratches

 

[skate020]

with all due respect, its because of my thread and people pming me that i know about the jap drag can be safe with other fish, PROVIDING they are large

 

[kjr_trig]

Originally Posted by Kylev
http:///forum/post/3230542
thanks for the input
Kjr, I have been on and off with the japanese dragon moray eel for a while now and believe its going to stay removed from the list. The three angles seem to be a much better option and they would be an emperor, blueface, and queen. Thanks for the advice on the tusk because IMO the extra money for the fish is nothing compared to whole picture. The Sohal would definetely be the last fish and the only one from the Acanthurus family.
Do you feel most small fish would also be safe in here, such as a blenny, goby, dwarf angels, or bluespot jawfish?
The tank will also be acrylic so eels scare me for possible quakes and scratches
I have 2 Dwarfs in my tank, Coral Beauty and Flame. They make wonderful additions, they add excellent color and activity, just make sure they are decent sized Dwarfs. Coral Beauty is borderline (mine looks smaller everyday compared to his tankmates

), Flame, Lemonpeel, Ebili, Half Black are all in the 4+ inch range and pretty fiesty. There are some bigger Jawfish that would be ok too (I would love to have a Tiger Jawfish!! Awesome fish that get 6+ inches), Lawnmower Blenny's (for example) are good, I'm no Goby expert by any means so I won't comment.
Acrylic can always be a little scary with certain fish, I've had no real issue yet, but I only have a Goldentail and have avoided Puffers and the more aggressive Triggers. I have heard of Harlequin Tusk being hard on acrylic, I will keep a good eye on mine, and my Niger Trigger as they age and their teeth get bigger.
Originally Posted by skate020
http:///forum/post/3230962
with all due respect, its because of my thread and people pming me that i know about the jap drag can be safe with other fish, PROVIDING they are large
I'm not trying to be mean, but people "pming you" doesn't really qualify you to make difinitive statements on a thousand dollar Eel you have never owned.
This guy isn't even full grown, and he could put a serious hurting on an 8 inch Emperor Angel (for example)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TnC1uiui8yw&feature=fvw

 

[skate020]

yeh i suppose its just another one of them try your luck things then.
do you deffinately want a eel? you could go for something like an zebra, there not aggresive really, and they wont eat your fish.
beautiful aswell, only problem is they are fairly reclusive

 

[kylev]

The only way i see myself getting an eel is if its the japanese dragon and i think i might just eventually setup a tank just to house one and some damsels
I have thought about going with both a flame and an ebili angel, I really like the flame for the bright red it brings into a tank. Those tiger jawfish are pretty sweet, do you not think a bluespot would work cause i've always been in love with them
Think I will definetely go with a lawn mower blenny or a starry
Not completely sure from your repsonse, but you have a harlequin tusk in an arcylic tank? If so any news of being hard on your tank would be awesome because as of now thats a for sure fish
thanks for the replies, waiting for some money to come into place then this tank will get moving along and will defienelely get pics rolling when its does for assistance and sharing

 

[kjr_trig]

Originally Posted by Kylev
http:///forum/post/3231104
The only way i see myself getting an eel is if its the japanese dragon and i think i might just eventually setup a tank just to house one and some damsels
I have thought about going with both a flame and an ebili angel, I really like the flame for the bright red it brings into a tank. Those tiger jawfish are pretty sweet, do you not think a bluespot would work cause i've always been in love with them
Think I will definetely go with a lawn mower blenny or a starry
Not completely sure from your repsonse, but you have a harlequin tusk in an arcylic tank? If so any news of being hard on your tank would be awesome because as of now thats a for sure fish
thanks for the replies, waiting for some money to come into place then this tank will get moving along and will defienelely get pics rolling when its does for assistance and sharing
I do have a Harlequin Tusk in my Acrylic, he never really crowds the sides, so I'm not really worried, I think Puffers are the worst with acrylic, they are always looking for their owner, and their next meal, so they drag their teeth/beak on the acrylic.
Tough to say on the Bluespot Jawfish, it's a smallish fish that doesn't move much. I will refrain from making a prediction, the Tiger is much bigger and equally entertaining personality, not as stunning in color though.
I am hoping to upgrade to 500 gallon or so in a few years for the main tank, when I do I plan to put a Hawaiian Dragon in the 240, complete with softies and Damsals....Just like Joe's in the video.

 

[kylev]

I've never really been a puffer fan so dont really have to worry there and will still plan on the harlequin tusk unless i hear of problems
If the bluespot wouldnt work i will definetely go with the tiger jawfish though, what do you figure would give the bluespot problems? IMO without any personal experience so doesnt mean a lot i'd figure with the size of the tank and how the blue spot would probably stay close to the sand bed i dont think he'd get much attention from other fish and kinda be that fish that i occassionally get to see.
On the note of the three angels, how do you suggest to introduce them? QT three at a time and put them all in together so no terrorities or introduce one first then the next two as the next addition?
Joe's video is what assisted my want for the dragon moray
Hows the cleaning maintenance on your tank without having a CUC? I'm not concerned with having to do a lot of house keeping myself i just like to have a real clean tank or it just bugs me and i obsess about it, does the tusk eat any invert in the tank or are they hit and miss?
thanks

 

[kylev]

how far fetched would it be to try an anemone with the angels in the tank?

 

[skate020]

angels should leave anemones alone, its corals like zoas that'll large angels go for.
considering its a plenty big enough tank, you should get a couple large angels. maybe a emperror and queen? or something like that.
as for the dragon moray. they are awesome, but yeh you are limited to wat you can get.
after a few months to a year they tend to get less aggressive and leave the damsel alone, which helps bring the colour into the tank.
and all honesty, they are expensive. but the money you save from not getting all the other fish you probably only spend an extra $200 or so.
so yeh a couple of sotcklist i think could be quite cool for you:
stocklist 1:
1x dragon moray eel
10x damsels
2x sgt major
stocklist 2:
2x large angels, (blueface and emp is a nice combo)
1x niger triggerfish.
1x sohal tang
1x puffer? (i know you said they dont interest you too much so yehh)
1x zebra eel
1x foxface rabbitfish
they could be some cool fish there. nice and bright, and fish that grow fairly big so they look cool

 

[kjr_trig]

Originally Posted by Kylev
http:///forum/post/3231226
If the bluespot wouldnt work i will definetely go with the tiger jawfish though, what do you figure would give the bluespot problems? IMO without any personal experience so doesnt mean a lot i'd figure with the size of the tank and how the blue spot would probably stay close to the sand bed i dont think he'd get much attention from other fish and kinda be that fish that i occassionally get to see.
On the note of the three angels, how do you suggest to introduce them? QT three at a time and put them all in together so no terrorities or introduce one first then the next two as the next addition?
Hows the cleaning maintenance on your tank without having a CUC? I'm not concerned with having to do a lot of house keeping myself i just like to have a real clean tank or it just bugs me and i obsess about it, does the tusk eat any invert in the tank or are they hit and miss?
thanks
As for the Bluespot, I truly don't know. Angels are not full blown predators, so one may be just fine. Harlequin Tusk is a carnevore for sure...I just worry about smallish, slow moving fish in "aggressive set-ups".
For the angels, I would do one to start out. Let him get established and comfortable, then introduce the other 2 together, you would have to QT separate of course, but you can just do a divider if the qt is big enough.
The Tusk would be your big problem with a clean up crew, I have had good luck with larger snails (Zebra for example), but any small hermit would likely be a quick meal.
Originally Posted by Kylev
http:///forum/post/3231234
how far fetched would it be to try an anemone with the angels in the tank?
Angels and anemone don't mix. CCampbell (resident angel expert) had a huge Carpet Anemone that was great until the angels hit about 6 inches I think, then they ate it up.

I have had great luck with softies and mushrooms for well over a year....SO FAR anyway, my biggest angel is just over 5 inches. though

 

[kylev]

Kjr Not quite sure on the bluespot yet then, i really want it to work but its way to expensive to sacrfice as a meal.
Any reconmendation on which angel would be the best to introduce first? I plan on using a 55g QT, which should be big enough to house 2 of them, correct? I'm planning on getting them around ~3inches.
I would just be getting snails if any for CUC, so i will just make sure to buy them all big to help keep them alive, thanks for the tip
So definetely no anemone then cause the one I wanted was a blue carpet. But that makes me happy about your success with the mushrooms and softies cause that could help add a lot of color to the tank. Keep me updated if the angels decide misbehave with the corals please
Skate, thanks for the suggestion but i think my current list is
-Emperor angel
-Blueface angel
-Queen Angel
-Harlequin Tusk
-Blonde naso tang
-hippo tang
-sohal tang
-pair of clowns
-blue spot jawfish or tiger
-blenny
-and two dwarf angels
Is this close to my limit, or past when everyones full grown? Should have a total system of about 380gallons, (not sure if i want to fill the sump all the way so I can work in it without splashing water on the floor)

 

[kjr_trig]

You will be pretty will stocked there. You have 7 "large" fish in there. Provided good upkeep though I think its a great list.
I'm a believer (right or wrong I don't know), but that Pomacanthus and Holacanthus angels are all big and bossy, it's more important when they are introduced and their size more than the actual species. For example many people consider the Passer to be the most aggressive angel, my Emperor was in first and is 10% bigger than the Passer, the Emperor is still my "angel boss", not the Passer. I would do the Queen first, then bring in the 2 Pomacanthus angels together 3 or 4 months later.
I think the Softies I have are a nice addition, and I will keep you updated, I'm overdue to post a video of my 240...Maybe next week

I would certainly make the Sohal last in overall, I've had great luck with mine, but they can be a menace.

 

[kylev]

thanks for the additional advice
I was figuring i'd be pretty stocked there so as of now that will be my final stocking list unless something is to be replaced.
Sohal would definetely be last and is a fish im excited for, hopefully i will get a well behaved one.
A video would be awesome Whats all included in your softies cause i'd hate to get a great coral colony going just to have the angels chow down when they grew

 

[gtdarock]

Kylev, looks like a nice stocklist. KJR always gives good advice

Sohal tang,sweetttttttttt I would love one

Keep us posted man !