3 gallon pico long term anyone?

[mason]

i promise im not cheating ya man, do these look at least 2 years old to you? If so, how come they can't be four...I can't really prove it byt I can show you systems that have more coralline than you could chip w a hammer, and sponge/benthic growth that is not for sale but can only be had with very aged, very well treated live rock. To think someone would throw all this together, including a vid, just to cheat peeps in a chat forum would mean that person has waaaay too much time on their hands lol
it's okay you are a skeptic this is good. but there's always something new to be found by keeping one's mind open!! b
I haven't found a way to keep coralline off the walls and as clean as normal setups...that's why they call it new science, ideas have to be generated, not just rounded up in order for something that breaks all the rules you know to work...so far bent coat hangers is all I can figure out to reach down in between the rocks and the glass wall. I didn't have to stock so densely, but it's my thing so...
in the very least, growing coralline madly without a host of water tests, chems and dosers is not something an unbalanced tank does and the vid shows how all the rock is glued into the bowl for years by coral and coralline growth. I didn't even use cleanup snails until this 4th year, and man they are hard workers!

 

[new2salt1]

Originally Posted by mason
http:///forum/post/3177094
even the small ones don't have to be taken down. these are not stocked with fish, therefore the feed input is less, therefore the nutrient sinking is less and these can live a very long time if set up carefully. I recommend something larger for starters, these are just prime examples of what aged pico reefs can do as stand alone systems. most people get bored of fishless systems so the three gallon+ ones are usually preferable. This amount of coralline cannot be had in a tank less than two years old...

These pics prove my point. The owner of the vases may be happy with the way they look - I would not be.
As far as HEALTH OF THE TANK, YES, you can probably go without breaking the tank down.
But as far as APPEARANCE OF THE TANK, those vases should have been broken down a while ago. I don't want to look at brown sand. If it doesn't bother you, great. You can probably keep a tank with brown sand for a long freaking time. And I dont want to have 25% visibility through the glass either. To me, you defeat the purpose of a DISPLAY TANK if the corals being kept are not fully DISPLAYED.
Go back and read my original response PLEASE. You will see that I am dealing with the APPEARANCE of pico tanks. If this hobby was only concerned with the survival of the species in the tank then there would be no such things as algae scrubs, phosban, magnets, actinic lights, and everything else created to improve the way the tanks look.
To me, those vases could survive for another 50 years and if they look like crap, it's not much of an accomplishment. THATS the real challenge of a pico - stuffing it with coral and still making it look nice.

 

[mason]

no, the first challenge is keeping corals -alive- in a pico for any considerable length of time, the looks come second lol
ok so its aesthetics...ones mans trash thing, I'll buy that but I disagree coralline looks like crap. I consider green algae the time you consider something crashed or in need of a startover, and any tank that can grow sps without skimming and not reek of algae is onto something.
I like the blotted out coralline look but yea that's just my way and because I can't really reach it all! I see your point.
As far as the sand bed deposits, that's normal and I have yet to see any size tank keep a dsb for 4 years and not have interworkings of coralline, browns and darks and even some reds and greens as lithotropic alga...that is unless they tear it down frequently
so to recap Im thinking that all forms of growth, other than hair algae, prove a tank is viable and considered working. whether or not it is cleaned well enough is subjective, but if you like coralline and especially if you need it to prove your tanks aren't throw-togethers you also don't have to tear down your tanks frequently to remove what is considered excellent reef growth...me personally i don't like to see reefs that have only a few spots of coralline, I like to see where they had to carve out a notch to see through. now -that's- ion support, jmo
And, FYI, see this bowl in the vid the dark spots are gone it's just coralline. I found that feeding pelleted feeds in a pico caused this phenomena, now that it's been on frozen only for a couple years I was able to get less sand bed sinking. Funny how the input managed to alter the bed visuals in that way...

 

[new2salt1]

I never had even a slight problem keeping my pico corals alive(???) I had too much growth so I cut back on the light cycles. And this wasn't just softies; my duncan and hammer grew new heads rapidly. My efforts all went towards making the tank look perfect. Since I kept my pico at my office I strived to have a tank that people could marvel at. And yes, if you have brown sand you are going to have a smelly tank and that doesn't fly in an office setting.
I think what I'm learning in this post is some people are ok with things that I find ugly. Actually last summer I met a guy from this forum that had frags for sale and when I got to his house I almost turned down his frags because they had a maroonish cyano-looking algae on them. He didn't even seem to notice!
I wont let my 14 gallon go past 6 weeks without a decent wc, so maybe my view of picos is different. Nonetheless, the sweet pico that started this discussion is DEFINATELY a tedious project for the owner. Read his maintenance logs! That tank is a part-time job for him!

 

[mason]

yep if I had to do any more work then what I am used to Id quit the hobby but some people start with a regimen they get used to and it's only bad for someone used to doing less... Id love to have larger tanks with fish but since I can't commit the time I just stay with the really small easy stuff corals and inverts only
b

 

[fishtaco]

Originally Posted by New2Salt1
http:///forum/post/3177147
I never had even a slight problem keeping my pico corals alive(???) I had too much growth so I cut back on the light cycles. And this wasn't just softies; my duncan and hammer grew new heads rapidly. My efforts all went towards making the tank look perfect. Since I kept my pico at my office I strived to have a tank that people could marvel at. And yes, if you have brown sand you are going to have a smelly tank and that doesn't fly in an office setting.
I think what I'm learning in this post is some people are ok with things that I find ugly. Actually last summer I met a guy from this forum that had frags for sale and when I got to his house I almost turned down his frags because they had a maroonish cyano-looking algae on them. He didn't even seem to notice!
I wont let my 14 gallon go past 6 weeks without a decent wc, so maybe my view of picos is different. Nonetheless, the sweet pico that started this discussion is DEFINATELY a tedious project for the owner. Read his maintenance logs! That tank is a part-time job for him!
Wow, you go 6 weeks between water changes and you are questioning my ability as a "noob" to keep a pico tank? Seriously seemed like you just dismissed me here and tried to shut down my purchase of a pico because it is too hard, I guess for anyone but you? Thanks to everyone else who has made positive comments, I think I will wait till after Christmas and start up a three gallon and frag out a few of my nicer zoa's for it and maybe buy a few more frags. I would like to end up with a very colorful little tank with vividly colored zoas that I don't purchase now because they would just be lost in my nano's among the other coral.
Fishtaco

 

[new2salt1]

Originally Posted by Fishtaco
http:///forum/post/3177165
Wow, you go 6 weeks between water changes and you are questioning my ability as a "noob" to keep a pico tank? Seriously seemed like you just dismissed me here and tried to shut down my purchase of a pico because it is too hard, I guess for anyone but you? Thanks to everyone else who has made positive comments, I think I will wait till after Christmas and start up a three gallon and frag out a few of my nicer zoa's for it and maybe buy a few more frags. I would like to end up with a very colorful little tank with vividly colored zoas that I don't purchase now because they would just be lost in my nano's among the other coral.
Fishtaco

What is this person talking about?
Im a newb because my 14 GALLON TANK goes 6 weeks between wc's?

Take a look at the attached pics of my 14 gallon and explain what you would change. I keep an elegance coral - quite possibly the most difficult coral in the hobby to keep - and I've documented it on here for 2 1/2 - 3 years. It's 4 years old now. Most people can't keep them alive for 2 months under mh's and doing wc's every 3-4 weeks. I've found they like the stock pc's and more nutrient build-up in the water, so I change my water when I see fit. SO even though I don't do what you think is "right," I've had just a little success...
And btw, doesn't the very fact that you needed to post this question speak to you being new to picos?
Finally, I never tried to "shut down your purchase of a pico because it is too hard." After explaining the difficulty associated with picos, I ended my original post by saying, "But sure, you could keep a tank that small for a very long time. I would STRONGLY recommend against it if it's your first experience with saltwater. I kept my 3 gallon for a year and then upgraded to this 5 gallon. The 5 gallon was much more user friendly."
Oh well, I tried to contribute, but I guess Im just as newb who doesn't know what he's talking about...

 

[socalnano24]

ok, you two stop bickering, this is an interesting pico tank thread, lets keep the information and tips rolling, without BIAS!
All the informative posts on pico tanks are awesome, keep em rolling.
I'm very curious

 

[mason]

agreed I promise to be nice. I wouldn't consider a 14 gallon in the same weight class as a 1 or a 3 for comparative purposes, thats like bj penn fighting rampage there are weight classes for a reason I put the pico class at 3 and below with very different husbandry approaches.
That being said, nice cataphyllia dude those are rare for nanos and the fact it likes that clown hosting in it is very neat. I could be wrong but that looks like a cat. jar. if Im not wrong nice coral and tank

 

[new2salt1]

Ok I will stop bickering too.

Can the owner of the vase comment on how it is setup? Im assuming there is a source of flow but I don't see it. Also, what kind of lighting? Feeding?
Regardless of what I said about the vases (bashing the brown sand and low visibility), I do think they are way cool. I've experimented for a decade or so with live-plant betta vases so I am definately a fan of your vase pico. Attached is my bettas that WERE in 2 different vases but I found a way for them to coexist in the same live plant enclosure.

 

[mason]

looks good I once attempted to breed bettas but was unsuccessful. im interested in nice betta setups using live plants they do especially well in bog systems thats a great idea for a fish upgrade