30-45 Gallon SaltWater Tank

[einnaws]

I'm looking to start up either a 30 or 45 gallon saltwater tank. I am realatively new to maintaining salt water fish and i have questions about many things mostly about filtration. I was thinking about putting two clownfish in the tank to establish, then later adding those fun sand eating fish. What would be my best bet for filtration systems, also should i put live sand or just regular sand so many questions just looking for a little guidence so i don't dive headfirst into a 2000$ box of salty water and dead fish. .

 

[agent 14]

the best thing i can tell lu to do is start off with a smaller tank and
hardy fish.....the clownfish is perfect to cycle your tank with and they are also very very very hardy.....so its best if u start out with a 20 gallon then work your way up as you get more familiar.....the 20 gallon will run you bout $200 with sand and salt..... loseing $200
dollars is better than loseing $2000:happy:

 

[einnaws]

Hi,
My main thing is the filtration, i read you should have more than one system running in your tank. I hear things about sumps and bio balls and feel completely overwhelmed. i'm not planning on reef only fish, so my question i guess would be the economical combo of systems that will effectivly filter my tank..

 

[leheath]

I am a newbie to SW also, but I have done a ton of research, and I disagree with Agent14. As I understand it, smaller tanks are harder to successfully maintain as it is less tolerant of beginner's mistakes and water quality can deteriorate very quickly (causing fish deaths very quickly). Most recommendations I have seen suggest something in the 40-65g region for a first tank.
As for filtration, the best system as far as I can tell is live rock (LR), possibly with live sand (LS), and a protein skimmer. However, I think a wet/dry trickle system with bioballs can work in a fish only tank. In addition, although clownfish are hardy, it is not necessary (nor pleasant for the fish!) to use live fish to cycle your tank. If you are using LR, you can cycle the tank with that, and if you are not using LR for filtration (and are using the bioballs instead) and raw dead shrimp (from the grocery store) is recommended to cycle your tank.
HTH, and I am sure other, more experienced people will jump in soon....

 

[einnaws]

I watch the "Forensic Files" all the time is that what you do?
anyway back to the fish
thats the same info i have read. i was plannin on goin with the live rock and live sand but i'm not sure on the amount needed and what type of live rock, i assume the live rock to be expensive. As of right now i'm thinkin about using an emperor bio-filter, and that protein skimmer seemed like something i would need.
All help is greatly appreciated thank you...

 

[viper_930]

IMHO it is very inhumane to cycle a tank with a live fish, even just a cheap damsel. The water may seem clean to you but it is sewer water to the fish. You can get a dead shrimp from the grocery stor and dump it in to let it decompose and cycle the tank.
You should put about 1-2 times the size of the tank (of gallons). Fiji rock is good, very porous, light weight and somewhat cheap. You may be able to find some as low as $4/lb.

 

[coxy101]

Hmmm... before you make any decisions on tank size, filtration, etc - you need to first make decisions on what you want as a tank. Do you want a fish only tank? Are you eventually going to want corals, etc? This will impact your decision of tank size and filtration because they require different things. The larger the tank the easier it is to maintain. I completely disagree that you should start with a 20 gallon tank - it's very hard to maintain. Water evaporates quickly and the system doesn't remain balanced very well. A good tank size in my opinion is a 40 - 60 gallon to start out with. Get a shallower, longer tank because it will be better for lighting of corals and fish will appreciate the longer distance to swim. For filtration - again you have to decide what you're planning on keeping. I have a protein skimmer, live rock and refugium (a DIY project) and it's great. Currently I'm fish only, but when my tank gets more established, I'm moving into a reef.

 

[einnaws]

yea, i guess that is a pretty horrible thing to do. So let me get this straight. Toss a delicious shrimp that i would enjoy while watching the superbowl into my tank and just let it sit there till its gone?
Also, when you say 1-2 times my tank for the LR, 45 gallons would equal 45-85lbs of LR?
I'm not planning on making a reef tank unless LR would qualify as a Reef tank, in that case then i guess i am, pretty much all i want is a fish only tank because Disney made me.

 

[coxy101]

Yep - throw in a cocktail shrimp and watch it rot. Look up threads on the tank cycle and it will explain to you what you're doing and when you can finally add some live inhabitants.
You can slowly add LR. Start off with a couple pieces and add as you get the money. If you're not planning on keeping corals, you don't need that much LR unless you're not planning on have a filter. Personally, I just like the looks of LR.

 

[einnaws]

indeed the LR looks great, and i was going to get purely for the look of it, now the LR is considered a means of filtration?
As of now here are my plans:
. Bio-wheel
. protein skimmer
. Live Rock
. Live Sand
.Fish only (clownfish)
. Eventually other compatible fish and a shrimp with a frech accent that cleans the other fish.

 

[coxy101]

Okay - I was out of the hobby for a year or two and my 45 just got up a running again (about 6 weeks ago).
I have:
40 lbs of base rock (my old live rock that I saved when I took my aquarium down)
25 lbs of live rock
40 lbs of live sand (about a 2 inch bed)
Prizm protein skimmer ( a so-so skimmer)
Had a fluval 304 canister filter running but nitrates run high with canister and bio-wheel filters so for a cheaper price than the filter, a just made a 10 gallon refugium (with southdown sand and macro algae) that should allow me to take off my canister filter.
This system works really well and I'm much happier with it than then I had my tank up previously.
So to answer your question - I wouldn't buy a biowheel and I would invest that money into LR (some people just use that as filtration) or a refugium (a fun, do-it-yourself project).

 

[einnaws]

i'll have to look into your refugianism thing because i have no idea what it is i don't want to waste your time with explaining everylittle thing is. Thank you.
But i will miss the fun little wheel that entertains me so
.......Ohhhhhhhh i see, i have a 10 gallon tank lying around excellent.

 

[coxy101]

Sorry! Got carried away - you're new and I shouldn't start spouting off confusing stuff. Do a search on "refugium". It'll show up a bunch of interesting things.
Basically your plans on 45 gallon tank, LS, LR, filter and eventually clowns sounds like a good idea. The filter in the long run will probably cause problems, but you can cross that bridge when you get to it. In the meantime, just keep the filter nice and clean and remember water changes.
What kind of clowns are you planning on getting? I have 2 Black and White ocellaris clowns.

 

[einnaws]

I looked it up and i like it, I like the DIY aspect makes me feel important and wise. and i do have a 10 gallon tank sitting in my room now...

I'm lookin at the same clowns "Ocellaris Clownfish" do they have to be the same color? i tried to explain to my girlfriend that clownfish are racist and even tho they are the same type differnent colors don't get along is there any truth to that?

 

[coxy101]

Clownfish are finicky about each other. You should be able to put a B&W ocellaris with a plain ocellaris together the same as 2 B&W or 2 plains. BUT as with all clowns, sometimes 2 just don't get along. It's best to get them at the same time and make sure one is larger than the other. The larger one will turn out to be the female (strange, huh, they change sexes based on dominance and size...) But just make sure they are the same type of clown (ocellaris, true percula, etc.) Ocellaris in my experience have tended to be the easiest and most docile. If you get into tomato or maroon, they can get evil and rip up your sandbed.

 

[coxy101]

I was pretty proud of myself with the DIY project, too. I'm also looking into making moonlights for my tank. They make the tank look pretty cool at night and it will help once I get my corals going. It's a pretty quick project. You should check it out: LED Moonlight Project
Anyway, let me know how it goes.:yes:

 

[meemo]

I just stated my first aquarium and would say definitely get the biggest size you can afford. It will be easier to keep the water in good shape. Plus you can have more fish that need space.
I got a 30 gallon and now wish I had gotten a 55.
I also agree that live rock is the way to go. I am doing a fish only with live rock, shrimp, and crabs. The live rock will help in biological filtration.
Main thing I've learned = Read first, buy later. Good luck!

 

[leheath]

I haven't actually watched 'Forensic Files' but I work in a crime lab as a biologist - I do the blood stuff and DNA profiling....
fish....
I pretty much agree with what the other people have said. One thing I would mentions is that you can get LR online from a variety of places, some at very good prices (less than $4/lb + shipping). In addition, there are many kinds other than Fiji and some are less dense so you don't have to buy as much. For instance, I have seen Kaelini rock recommended as only needing .75 to 1.25 lb/gallon. If you have trouble finding places to buy LR, let me know....I can email you some sites.

 

[einnaws]

Thank you,
everybody for you help, I'm so surprised at how nice everyone has been. I'm so glad that i signed up for this board, so far it has been a god send.
Thanks