suzy
Member
Missed it by.....a hundred years!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w67Bk9xAAT8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w67Bk9xAAT8
6 days?
- Thread starter suzy
- Start date
sigmachris
Active Member
We have been in Japan and Germany since 1945 and things are working out well there.
1journeyman
Active Member
Again, you seem to be playing both sides of the fence.
Are we fighting Saddam and the Iraqi army in Iraq today? Otoh you argue Iraq is an internal struggle, yet on the other hand you're arguing we're still fighting the same enemy.
Are we fighting Saddam and the Iraqi army in Iraq today? Otoh you argue Iraq is an internal struggle, yet on the other hand you're arguing we're still fighting the same enemy.
suzy
Member
Just another lie we were told to be sold this war. 6 days, maybe 6 weeks, not 6 months though.
This lie is classic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKFL-Mz4rto
This lie is classic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKFL-Mz4rto
crashbandicoot
Active Member
Originally Posted by Suzy
http:///forum/post/2529139
Just another lie we were told to be sold this war. 6 days, maybe 6 weeks, not 6 months though.
This lie is classic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKFL-Mz4rto
It didnt take 6 months it took longer than that .
As far as being liberators ? Who says we are not greated that way . oh yeah thats right the MEDIA says so and god knows the MEDIA never lies
http:///forum/post/2529139
Just another lie we were told to be sold this war. 6 days, maybe 6 weeks, not 6 months though.
This lie is classic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKFL-Mz4rto
It didnt take 6 months it took longer than that .
scsinet
Active Member
Originally Posted by Suzy
http:///forum/post/2528458
Missed it by.....a hundred years!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w67Bk9xAAT8
What exactly is your point?
They/we were wrong about many estimations made about the Iraq conflict. So what? If there was a "pointing out the obvious" contest, don't worry, you'd win.
http:///forum/post/2528458
Missed it by.....a hundred years!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w67Bk9xAAT8
What exactly is your point?
They/we were wrong about many estimations made about the Iraq conflict. So what? If there was a "pointing out the obvious" contest, don't worry, you'd win.
suzy
Member
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by Suzy
http:///forum/post/2529273
Thanks, Guys! Winning is cool!
Here are a few more lies:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFVatXy8Bhc
Umm, could that have been more cut and spliced together?
Look, I'm not a McCain fan, by any means. Do some digging from just a few months ago and you can see that. That said, to post a video with one of the most biased media reporters on the air, along with a hatchet job of an edited video does nothing for your position.
McCain has said, very publically, that he has heard from "the people" of the USA and will not push amnesty.
McCain has said his stance on the Bush tax cuts was wrong (but according to critics there were no tax cuts for most people anyway so this shouldn't be a big deal, right?...)
And, for possibly a third time today, I'll simply point out the War in Iraq has changed. We're not fighting the same enemy we were fighting when we first went in.
http:///forum/post/2529273
Thanks, Guys! Winning is cool!
Here are a few more lies:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFVatXy8Bhc
Umm, could that have been more cut and spliced together?
Look, I'm not a McCain fan, by any means. Do some digging from just a few months ago and you can see that. That said, to post a video with one of the most biased media reporters on the air, along with a hatchet job of an edited video does nothing for your position.
McCain has said, very publically, that he has heard from "the people" of the USA and will not push amnesty.
McCain has said his stance on the Bush tax cuts was wrong (but according to critics there were no tax cuts for most people anyway so this shouldn't be a big deal, right?...)
And, for possibly a third time today, I'll simply point out the War in Iraq has changed. We're not fighting the same enemy we were fighting when we first went in.
acrylics
Member
My take FWIW.
Despite what anybody thinks were the reasons for going there and despite what anybody thinks the timeframe *should have* been; the simple fact is that we are there and what do we do about it?
IMO we practically destroyed their infrastructure in order to get Saddam. We owe it to the people of Iraq to put it back together. To leave now without doing so would be a mistake of epic proportions IMO. No one really knows if some other country would go in there and try to take over but that would be no different than what they had before. If no one else goes in there, we leave it to someone else to clean up our mess. Either way, we will have made yet another enemy. Again, IMO we owe to the Iraqi people and to ourselves to not allow that to happen.
I personally think we will be there indefinitely and rightly so. We owe that much to the people that live there until their new government asks us to leave. And even then we will most likely build permanent bases there to keep them safe from an attack from others and to protect our own interests as I doubt they will be able to build an army in short order and will require, if nothing else, a defensive force supplied by us.
We can leave Iraq and make yet another enemy (and rightly so) or we can stay and make a trade partner if not a long lasting alliance. More importantly, we are responsible for much of the mess in Iraq and it's our responsibility to help clean it up.
So point fingers all you want, it's utterly useless and does absolutely nothing to resolve the situation at hand, the fact is that it makes the situation worse as it is divisive in nature. Sit here and complain about whose fault it is or have a constructive discussion on how to make things better and focus energy in a more positive direction. The choice is yours.
Despite what anybody thinks were the reasons for going there and despite what anybody thinks the timeframe *should have* been; the simple fact is that we are there and what do we do about it?
IMO we practically destroyed their infrastructure in order to get Saddam. We owe it to the people of Iraq to put it back together. To leave now without doing so would be a mistake of epic proportions IMO. No one really knows if some other country would go in there and try to take over but that would be no different than what they had before. If no one else goes in there, we leave it to someone else to clean up our mess. Either way, we will have made yet another enemy. Again, IMO we owe to the Iraqi people and to ourselves to not allow that to happen.
I personally think we will be there indefinitely and rightly so. We owe that much to the people that live there until their new government asks us to leave. And even then we will most likely build permanent bases there to keep them safe from an attack from others and to protect our own interests as I doubt they will be able to build an army in short order and will require, if nothing else, a defensive force supplied by us.
We can leave Iraq and make yet another enemy (and rightly so) or we can stay and make a trade partner if not a long lasting alliance. More importantly, we are responsible for much of the mess in Iraq and it's our responsibility to help clean it up.
So point fingers all you want, it's utterly useless and does absolutely nothing to resolve the situation at hand, the fact is that it makes the situation worse as it is divisive in nature. Sit here and complain about whose fault it is or have a constructive discussion on how to make things better and focus energy in a more positive direction. The choice is yours.
scsinet
Active Member
Originally Posted by acrylics
http:///forum/post/2529352
So point fingers all you want, it's utterly useless and does absolutely nothing to resolve the situation at hand, the fact is that it makes the situation worse as it is divisive in nature. Sit here and complain about whose fault it is or have a constructive discussion on how to make things better and focus energy in a more positive direction. The choice is yours.
I applaud your enitre post, but I quoted the above because IMO it's the most apt point you made.
There are some who for some reason feel it's necessary to grind into the dirt theories, ideas, whatever that lies were told, that conspiracies were concocted, whatever.
It's unfortunate that some can be so focused on running a smear campaign against an administration that for all intents and purposes is out of the picture. Nothing will be solved at this point during the Bush administration, so to me continuing to grind their axe on it only serves as a distration. Us being there is a problem. I say that because any war is a problem, a problem which we all want to resolve properly first and quickly second.
Notice that above, I asked the question "So what" and "What is your point" and no comments were made. Could that be because those who choose to perpetuate this hate have no real answers?
Continuing to harp on and on about lies and whatever solves nothing... it solves even less than cutting and running. People who do this are basically hate mongers who create conflict for whatever reason, but the real issue is that they create this conflict at a time when unity is what is most important.
http:///forum/post/2529352
So point fingers all you want, it's utterly useless and does absolutely nothing to resolve the situation at hand, the fact is that it makes the situation worse as it is divisive in nature. Sit here and complain about whose fault it is or have a constructive discussion on how to make things better and focus energy in a more positive direction. The choice is yours.
I applaud your enitre post, but I quoted the above because IMO it's the most apt point you made.
There are some who for some reason feel it's necessary to grind into the dirt theories, ideas, whatever that lies were told, that conspiracies were concocted, whatever.
It's unfortunate that some can be so focused on running a smear campaign against an administration that for all intents and purposes is out of the picture. Nothing will be solved at this point during the Bush administration, so to me continuing to grind their axe on it only serves as a distration. Us being there is a problem. I say that because any war is a problem, a problem which we all want to resolve properly first and quickly second.
Notice that above, I asked the question "So what" and "What is your point" and no comments were made. Could that be because those who choose to perpetuate this hate have no real answers?
Continuing to harp on and on about lies and whatever solves nothing... it solves even less than cutting and running. People who do this are basically hate mongers who create conflict for whatever reason, but the real issue is that they create this conflict at a time when unity is what is most important.
crashbandicoot
Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2529288
Umm, could that have been more cut and spliced together?
Look, I'm not a McCain fan, by any means. Do some digging from just a few months ago and you can see that. That said, to post a video with one of the most biased media reporters on the air, along with a hatchet job of an edited video does nothing for your position.
McCain has said, very publically, that he has heard from "the people" of the USA and will not push amnesty.
McCain has said his stance on the Bush tax cuts was wrong (but according to critics there were no tax cuts for most people anyway so this shouldn't be a big deal, right?...)
And, for possibly a third time today, I'll simply point out the War in Iraq has changed. We're not fighting the same enemy we were fighting when we first went in.
I couldnt agree more .
Suzy every link you have is from you tube . Are you board and have nothing better to do ? Do you need to find something more constructive to do with your time ? Seriously if you have an opinion feel free to share it but also have some kind of honest idea of a fisable means to the end . just blatant smearing of Mc Cain makes you look foolish . Your thoughts are about as incomplete as could posibly be . Its a sad thing that even I think your coming off half loaded . Take some time and put some thought in to it . Because right now your arguement is almost as lame as "I know you are but what am I" .
http:///forum/post/2529288
Umm, could that have been more cut and spliced together?
Look, I'm not a McCain fan, by any means. Do some digging from just a few months ago and you can see that. That said, to post a video with one of the most biased media reporters on the air, along with a hatchet job of an edited video does nothing for your position.
McCain has said, very publically, that he has heard from "the people" of the USA and will not push amnesty.
McCain has said his stance on the Bush tax cuts was wrong (but according to critics there were no tax cuts for most people anyway so this shouldn't be a big deal, right?...)
And, for possibly a third time today, I'll simply point out the War in Iraq has changed. We're not fighting the same enemy we were fighting when we first went in.
I couldnt agree more .
Suzy every link you have is from you tube . Are you board and have nothing better to do ? Do you need to find something more constructive to do with your time ? Seriously if you have an opinion feel free to share it but also have some kind of honest idea of a fisable means to the end . just blatant smearing of Mc Cain makes you look foolish . Your thoughts are about as incomplete as could posibly be . Its a sad thing that even I think your coming off half loaded . Take some time and put some thought in to it . Because right now your arguement is almost as lame as "I know you are but what am I" .
wattsupdoc
Active Member
You know, you definitely have some distaste for the war. I wonder do you have any family over there? Have you lost someone related to you there? Do you even know anyone who is serving? Most people that stand against the war don't have a good concept of what the troops feel about it. I have had my nephew injured in Iraq. He wants to go back. But they wont let him. My niece wants to join. My other nephews best friend should be hittin' the sand any day now if not already there. Do you have ANY idea why? They weren't drafted. The war was already under way when they signed up. Because they love America and want to help spread it to a country that wants it. Sure there a some troops that don't believe in the war. I cant say necessarily that I blame them. But everyone of them are your heroes. All the reports I've gotten back from these guys is that we ARE wanted there. They DO need us, and they ARE making progress, We will have a permanent base there, it's what we do. You said elsewhere that we are less safe now than we were before. This is absurd, you cant say that. How do you know it to be true. Seems like before the war, the world trade center collapsed. Since the war, nothing like that has happened. So where is it you get your FACTS from? You tube. Good lord!
I'm not a Bush supporter. But 20 years from now, when the region is stabilized and the Iraqi government shines. All the people are free from oppression. Bush will be seen as a hero himself. Like it or not.
I'm not a Bush supporter. But 20 years from now, when the region is stabilized and the Iraqi government shines. All the people are free from oppression. Bush will be seen as a hero himself. Like it or not.
crashbandicoot
Active Member
I make all my important political decisions based on youtube videos .
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by wattsupdoc
http:///forum/post/2529666
You know, you definitely have some distaste for the war. I wonder do you have any family over there? Have you lost someone related to you there? ...
In one of the original threads she got involved in she implied she lost her son in Iraq.
http:///forum/post/2529666
You know, you definitely have some distaste for the war. I wonder do you have any family over there? Have you lost someone related to you there? ...
In one of the original threads she got involved in she implied she lost her son in Iraq.
crashbandicoot
Active Member
So basicaly there is some missplaced anger and guilt topped off with a whole lot of loss and emptiness . I can indetify with that . I am very sorry for her loss and she should seek some help in dealing with it . Lashing out like she is will not help her in the long run it will only consume her completely .
I lost my first born some 11 years ago and its tough to deal with . You have to move on and find productive ways to deal with it . for a long time I couldnt deal with it . It consumed me completely , I felt like nothing could ever fill that void in my life . But here I am 11 years later and I am happy and living life . I have two wonderful little girls and a whole new life I never thought I could ever have enjoyed .
I lost my first born some 11 years ago and its tough to deal with . You have to move on and find productive ways to deal with it . for a long time I couldnt deal with it . It consumed me completely , I felt like nothing could ever fill that void in my life . But here I am 11 years later and I am happy and living life . I have two wonderful little girls and a whole new life I never thought I could ever have enjoyed .
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by Crashbandicoot
http:///forum/post/2529878
So basicaly there is some missplaced anger and guilt topped off with a whole lot of loss and emptiness . ...
Ya, like I said, it was implied. You'd have to ask her for the actual story.
http:///forum/post/2529878
So basicaly there is some missplaced anger and guilt topped off with a whole lot of loss and emptiness . ...
Ya, like I said, it was implied. You'd have to ask her for the actual story.
reefraff
Active Member
Originally Posted by acrylics
http:///forum/post/2529352
My take FWIW.
Despite what anybody thinks were the reasons for going there and despite what anybody thinks the timeframe *should have* been; the simple fact is that we are there and what do we do about it?
IMO we practically destroyed their infrastructure in order to get Saddam. We owe it to the people of Iraq to put it back together. To leave now without doing so would be a mistake of epic proportions IMO. No one really knows if some other country would go in there and try to take over but that would be no different than what they had before. If no one else goes in there, we leave it to someone else to clean up our mess. Either way, we will have made yet another enemy. Again, IMO we owe to the Iraqi people and to ourselves to not allow that to happen.
I personally think we will be there indefinitely and rightly so. We owe that much to the people that live there until their new government asks us to leave. And even then we will most likely build permanent bases there to keep them safe from an attack from others and to protect our own interests as I doubt they will be able to build an army in short order and will require, if nothing else, a defensive force supplied by us.
We can leave Iraq and make yet another enemy (and rightly so) or we can stay and make a trade partner if not a long lasting alliance. More importantly, we are responsible for much of the mess in Iraq and it's our responsibility to help clean it up.
So point fingers all you want, it's utterly useless and does absolutely nothing to resolve the situation at hand, the fact is that it makes the situation worse as it is divisive in nature. Sit here and complain about whose fault it is or have a constructive discussion on how to make things better and focus energy in a more positive direction. The choice is yours.
It's too bad more people can't think beyond what is in their partisan interests and look at the big picture.
http:///forum/post/2529352
My take FWIW.
Despite what anybody thinks were the reasons for going there and despite what anybody thinks the timeframe *should have* been; the simple fact is that we are there and what do we do about it?
IMO we practically destroyed their infrastructure in order to get Saddam. We owe it to the people of Iraq to put it back together. To leave now without doing so would be a mistake of epic proportions IMO. No one really knows if some other country would go in there and try to take over but that would be no different than what they had before. If no one else goes in there, we leave it to someone else to clean up our mess. Either way, we will have made yet another enemy. Again, IMO we owe to the Iraqi people and to ourselves to not allow that to happen.
I personally think we will be there indefinitely and rightly so. We owe that much to the people that live there until their new government asks us to leave. And even then we will most likely build permanent bases there to keep them safe from an attack from others and to protect our own interests as I doubt they will be able to build an army in short order and will require, if nothing else, a defensive force supplied by us.
We can leave Iraq and make yet another enemy (and rightly so) or we can stay and make a trade partner if not a long lasting alliance. More importantly, we are responsible for much of the mess in Iraq and it's our responsibility to help clean it up.
So point fingers all you want, it's utterly useless and does absolutely nothing to resolve the situation at hand, the fact is that it makes the situation worse as it is divisive in nature. Sit here and complain about whose fault it is or have a constructive discussion on how to make things better and focus energy in a more positive direction. The choice is yours.
It's too bad more people can't think beyond what is in their partisan interests and look at the big picture.
reefraff
Active Member
Originally Posted by SCSInet
http:///forum/post/2529421
It's unfortunate that some can be so focused on running a smear campaign against an administration that for all intents and purposes is out of the picture. Nothing will be solved at this point during the Bush administration, so to me continuing to grind their axe on it only serves as a distration. Us being there is a problem. I say that because any war is a problem, a problem which we all want to resolve properly first and quickly second.
Notice that above, I asked the question "So what" and "What is your point" and no comments were made. Could that be because those who choose to perpetuate this hate have no real answers?
Continuing to harp on and on about lies and whatever solves nothing... it solves even less than cutting and running. People who do this are basically hate mongers who create conflict for whatever reason, but the real issue is that they create this conflict at a time when unity is what is most important.
God I dont want to be seen as defending the Democrat party tactics here BUT. It is in the out of power parties interest to to weaken a sitting president as much as possible. Even with his poll ratings down Bush is a powerful fundraising tool. Anything they can do to minimize that will be used. The Republicans did it with Clinton. Doesn't make it right, it's just a sad fact of political life.
What is amazing is the number of people who blindly believe what the puppet masters (bloggers) tell them.
http:///forum/post/2529421
It's unfortunate that some can be so focused on running a smear campaign against an administration that for all intents and purposes is out of the picture. Nothing will be solved at this point during the Bush administration, so to me continuing to grind their axe on it only serves as a distration. Us being there is a problem. I say that because any war is a problem, a problem which we all want to resolve properly first and quickly second.
Notice that above, I asked the question "So what" and "What is your point" and no comments were made. Could that be because those who choose to perpetuate this hate have no real answers?
Continuing to harp on and on about lies and whatever solves nothing... it solves even less than cutting and running. People who do this are basically hate mongers who create conflict for whatever reason, but the real issue is that they create this conflict at a time when unity is what is most important.
God I dont want to be seen as defending the Democrat party tactics here BUT. It is in the out of power parties interest to to weaken a sitting president as much as possible. Even with his poll ratings down Bush is a powerful fundraising tool. Anything they can do to minimize that will be used. The Republicans did it with Clinton. Doesn't make it right, it's just a sad fact of political life.
What is amazing is the number of people who blindly believe what the puppet masters (bloggers) tell them.