A bit frustrated

[ant]

Hello,
I'm a bit new here and I have a few questions as I'm sure they've been answered a million times from others but here it goes. I read a post earlier that someone was frustrated for conflicting info. I feel the same and when I ask a continuing question at the fish store I get different answers and just look at them with a dumb face
When I started inquiring about changing my fresh water tank to a salt water tank I was in another state and the guy there assured me that my tank was good enough to hold a small salt water family. I didn't need another filter, I didn't need new lights, etc. Now that I'm settled in our new state the people here tell me that I need a bigger filter system, better light, some say I NEED live rock, others say DON'T use it, some say I can use my fresh water toys(fake plant, treasure chest etc.), others say don't use it at all.
Here's what I have and where I'm at:
20 gal (tiny I know), filter and light that came with it (Aquafin package deal), I started my salt water on Saturday, added live sand Sunday morning. This morning the hydrometer read 1.022. I thought maybe I was ready for live rock but the store I went to said I needed a protein skimmer($80+):notsure: Someone else I spoke to weeks before said I didn't need one. Then he said his rock isn't completly cured. So I said I'd wait and I'm going to another store this week.
All I want is a one or two clown fish and a blue tang at this point. But, I want them to be happy. If that works, I'd like to add an anenomy, shrimp and or crab. Very small tank but enjoyable for the two years we're going to be here. Then hopefully move bigger when we retire.
Thanks for any info. Hopefully will be painless to hear. Ant. :help:

 

[joker_ca]

ok everyone give you different advice because there are different ways to setup a SW tank
first off DONT get a tang they need a really big tank and your 20g isnt going to cut it for a tang, your filter should be fine but if you can get a better filter that would be a whole lot better, your light should be fine too if your just doing fish and LR but if your going to do a reef or get a anmonie then you have to upgrade your lights to vho or pc's
now when your cycling your tank you can just add the LR this will help your tank cycle even if its not cured, also a protein skimmer is a good investment it helps to keep your tank cleaner especially in a small tank like yours where water parameters can fluctuate

 

[ant]

Well, what are good tank mates for clowns? Funny abou the tang because all of the fish store people agreed on that one thing, a clown and tang in my tank would be fine. See what I mean about different info. Also, what about the previous plant and toys I had, can I still use them?
Thanks for the info. Ant.

 

[mudplayerx]

In a 20 gallon tank, you will be able to get about 5 inches of fish total if you don't want to run into bioload problems.

 

[jacknjill]

definately ditch the plants and toys. they look bad and out of place in a saltwater tank.
i would continue using the filter you have but invest in a protein skimmer in the near future. you can have liverock without a protein skimmer. i would add some liverock now and a frozen cocktail shrimp to help kick off the cycle.
DO NOT GET A BLUE HIPPO TANG! your tank is a fraction of the size that a blue hippo needs. at the VERY least they need a 100 gallon tank.
another piece of advice, from what i have heard, your lfs is full of crap. dont listen to them as all they want is your money. they probably have no idea what they are doing and are just going to help crash your tank.
the clownfish and maybe another small fish would be ok in your 20.
but if you want to have corals, you will have to get new lights. pc, vho, or metal halide.

 

[jacknjill]

what are your water levels right now? and i would raise your salinity to about 1.025

 

[bseth90]

I agree that the tang should be out. The tank is just not big enough. Your lfs will make more $$ selling the tang to you than some smaller fish damsels, clowns, etc. I also agree that your filter is fine same with the lights...they can be used. I went without a skimmer for years in my 60 and everything was fine...just a little better now that I have one in a 90. We all try to say what we feel is the best not what you can just get by with and opinions do very in this hobby. What works for me not always works for someone else...that's what makes this tough and fun at the same time. Same with your decorations.....as long as they can handle the salt (some can not) you will be fine. The anemone is out unless you upgrade your lights, but even then they are very hard. Good luck.

 

[ophiura]

Remember that the people giving you advice here will not get a dime of your money. And are not motivated by that. We are motivated to give you advice that will help you succeed and enjoy the hobby, without losing many animals in the process.
As mentioned already, the tang (all tangs) are unsuitable for your tank.
Also note that you are setting out with a small tank, and small tanks are MORE difficult, in general, than large tanks in saltwater. Parameters can change dramatically in a short amount of time.
I encourage you to invest in a good master test kit for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, pH and alkalinity to start. It is fine at the cycling stage to use uncured LR which will provide ammonia to cycle the tank properly.
I also agree that your decor is really not appropriate for saltwater and may not be good for the tank. There are some "saltwater themed" decorations, but, IMO...natural is better.
You have a LOOONG time to think about other fish. It may take 4-6 weeks to cycle this tank, followed by your clowns, and then the addition some weeks after that of a 3rd fish.

 

[ant]

Thanks for all of the advice. I really appreciate it. I will NOT buy a tang. Won't break my heart. I didn't know they got so big. Like I said before when I asked the fish stores they all said it would be fine and that was knowing what size my tank was.
I found a very nice store now and will go with them. I tested the specific gravity this morning at 1.022. I bought LR today and am tossing out my other decorations. I'm really pleased with how the live rock looks even without the fish so far. I am planning on buying a test kit but not to that point just yet. I'm planning on buying one or two damsels next week if the water tests well. That was the suggestion from the fish store to help cycle the tank. Is that right? I don't mind just having the clowns and damsels. Like I said before I want a small enjoyable tank without casualties.
I'm happy to know that my tank, filter and light is okay for now. Ant.

 

[mudplayerx]

Don't buy the damselfish. The live rock is sufficient to cycle your tank. Not only are the damselfish not going to help the cycle much more, they are extremely aggressive towards all fish (even their own kind).
I suggest you come to this forum anytime you have a question. It sounds like your local fish store doesn't have very knowledgable or scrupulous salespeople.
You will need to get your salinity to around 1.024. Make sure you test the water at the temperature that your hydrometer recommends or the reading will be wildly inaccurate. If you are using the cheap, swing-arm hydrometer, go to a local college's biology department and ask them if they would calibrate it for you.

 

[ant]

Yes, I have a cheap swing arm hydrometer. I will check the temp it needs to be tested at. Can I add the clowns after a four week cycle?

 

[taz_12777]

Remember that 4 weeks is a guide. Once you get a test kit that will tell you when it is ok to move foward. IMO waiting alittle pays off big in the end result. Once your tank has cycled you should get a clean up crew first before the clowns. Good luck.

 

[scotts]

Hey Ant

Told you to research eveything before you bought it.

Glad to see that you are listening to the people here, many people ask questions, but don't want to hear the answer. As far your lfs I have found that I use them only to buy stuff from. I stopped asking their opinions a long time ago. I think a good case in point is the damsels. I mean for the good od the fish you don't want to use them for a cycle, but also they get to be mean and it is pretty darn hard to get a fish out of your tank if it does not want to be caught.
One thing about your tank is not only the fish, but the rocks, corals and crabs that are fun to look at and watch. I think you should look at the nano tank section of this board to get some ideas for decorating.
If you want to stay with the Nemo theme for your tank I think my son said that the fishes name is Gurgle. It is the purple and yellow fish in the movie. It is called a Royal Gramma, you might want to check it out.
BTW what type of nursing do you do? If you don't mind me asking.
Scott

 

[ant]

Thanks for the response. I'm glad to hear about the damsels. I will stear clear of them, however, now do I have to wait four or six weeks to add the clowns? I really want to do the right thing for me and the fish.
I caught a glimpse of the nano site. Thanks for telling me about it. I was feeling rather silly with my little 20 gal. I was beginning to think I was the only one with a tiny tank. I will look for the Gurgle fish. Tell your son thanks for me.
I was a critical care nurse for 4 years then I went to labor and delivery the last two years. I haven't work for a year because my husband was in Iraq so I stayed home with my 1yo. We just moved so I'm in search for a job but not in a hurry. Are you in the medical field?

 

[vmarius1]

Ant,
No Tang and I would put LR to form caves and tunnels for your fish. Also, after it has been established for a while, I would consider adding some frags and make a nano reef tank. BUT you will need to get your salinity about 3-4 points higher and about 78-80 degrees. Its fun to watch those little suckers grow....