Am i unprepared for this HOBBY?

anthony17

Member
I've just got my FOWLR tank started im passed my beginning cycle and i used 3 damsels to help with that then i got a blue tang to get started but after about a week of having this fish ive started to notice white dots on him that would come and go daily so i didnt think to much of it. I have about 35lbs of LR i have live sand but no skimmer at this point my LFS said thats no big problem but get one soon so i went ahead and got a some crabbs and after about a week 2 out of about 14 died both were sally lightfoots and again didnt think much about it and went on ahead and got a yellow tang and it was doing great but my blue tank kept getting these frequent white spots so i got a QT and put him in there and later that night saw that my yellow tang had some white spots so i put him in the QT and the next day (today) he was dead and my blue tang looked like he was about to die so i took the blue tang out and he seems to be doing fine. i was just wanting some help and advice to getting better and more acknowledgable about this hobby oh and my fish seemed to be acting and eating well and all my levels were just fine but they were getting white spots so i assumed they had ich so if anyone can help me i would appreciate it.
Anthony :help:
 

jhebi

Member
Welcome aboard
First we need to know some info..
What size is the tank? what are your readings? And if you can take all your fish back to your LFS until you fix this problem, or soon or later they will die.
I believe you didnt even cycle your tank and than u added some fish in it, hopefully you didnt cycle with them because that's a funeral to the damsels.
And blue hippo got ich because is stress and also I dont think you have a right size of a tank to put him in.
You need a skimmer, Ph's for flow, and do you have LS and LR????
Well give us some info and let us know so we can help you....
 

anthony17

Member
ok sorry about not enough info my tank is cycled the LFS says and they said to cycle it with damsels and the damsels were fine with the tangs I THINK yes i have LS and LR ph is about 8.0, 8.2 nitrites 0 nitrate 10 salinity is about 1.021 and i dont know what to do i have no clue what could possibly be wrong with my tank im just gunna do whatever you guys think i should do i would really appreciate it if i could get a step by step process, and i also am using tap water i know thats not could but is that really crucial if i dont have any coral?
just tell me if u need more info
thanks so far
ANTHONY
 

harndog

Member
The Tangs in a 55 with damsels is the biggest problem. The Tangs are nervous fish and need a lot of swimming room if they get harrassed from fish such as damsels and then also are ina small tank they will get ich( little white spots) This will kill them. They need at least a 75 and many will say that is still not big enough. also you are right about the tap water as long as your declhorinate it however you will most likley have alge probs in the future do to phosphates. Don't take this wrong but it sounds to me like the LFS is supporting your decsions to purchse things you should not be. A good LFS would discourage you from putting tangs with Damsels. I also think you Yello may have been sick when you got him. they are the most hardy of all Tangs
 

anthony17

Member
thanks harndog for the info so do you think i should just get ride of the damsels and see how things start going for the blue tang???
 

harndog

Member
yes if you can catch them thats a good plan the blue will be ok as long as he is small. you don't have much rock so he has some swiming room. Just don't add anything else for awhile. Also I have always been told to start with the peacful fish and go to the aggressive fish you want. good luck.
I want a blue so bad but have held off because of the ich problems they can have. I am setting up a 175 now and bought a uv sterlizer to kill the ich so I may take a chance on one now. they are such pretty fish
 

anthony17

Member
so are u saying that blue tangs get ich real easy??? what would you do just completly start over by getting rid of all my fish keep the crabs then just get a new fish because i got that blue tang out and put him in the QT and he almost died just from being in the QT?
 

ruaround

Active Member
blue tangs are more seseptable to many skin diseaese and parasites than most fish. if the damsels are harassing the tang, i would get them out...good luck catchin em :jumping: ... do a search on ich there is plenty of info on treatment, hospital tanks, etc... good luck!!!
 

harndog

Member
I would try and keep him unless your LFS will give you a full refund. That is only if you can get the damsels out of there. He will be fine with shrimp and such. You can buy a uv sterlizer and solve your ich probs or you can try and qt him again and get some ich medicine. DO NOT PUT THE MEDICINE IN YOUR MAIN TANK. You will be fine if you can do this. Make sure the blue is back healthy and add the fish you like. Keep in mind the blue will get big so you will have to upgrade or trade him back later on. good luck.
 

mikeyjer

Active Member
Originally Posted by ANTHONY17
ok sorry about not enough info my tank is cycled the LFS says and they said to cycle it with damsels and the damsels were fine with the tangs I THINK yes i have LS and LR ph is about 8.0, 8.2 nitrites 0 nitrate 10 salinity is about 1.021 and i dont know what to do i have no clue what could possibly be wrong with my tank im just gunna do whatever you guys think i should do i would really appreciate it if i could get a step by step process, and i also am using tap water i know thats not could but is that really crucial if i dont have any coral?
just tell me if u need more info
thanks so far
ANTHONY
One of your problem is your keeping the salinity too low for inverts!!! You need to bring that up to around 1.025-1.027 It's better if your using RO water instead of tap. Is your tank even cycled yet? IF it's not, that might be one of your major problem with your tangs getting sick. Was there water movement in your QT tank? Either get a air-stone or a powerhead(which would be better) for water movement to agitate the surface for air exchange. I've lost some that way a long time ago that way that's why I mentioned it. What are you feeding your fish? You should look into getting a protein skimmer sometime soon. The best thing for you to do is probably either get rid of the tang or put it in a QT tank and do hypo on it to rid the ich. Another thing is by feeding high quality foods that's enhanced with garlic like formula 2. By getting rid of those damsels now will save you trouble from down the road...Good Luck! :happyfish
 

murph

Active Member
Ok this is going to buck the usual advice but what I would do is keep the damsels
and the clean up crew........but nothing else.
For the next few to several months concentrated on research and equipment. Buy some books or go to the library and read up. Visit this forum often to hear others opinions. Most definitely do a lot of research, read reviews and seek forum opinions before deciding on your tanks equipment.
If your like most, once you begin to gain some knowledge of the hobby you will want to start making some changes, i.e. add a sump or fuge, hard plumb and or rearrange your circulation, add different lighting, fill out your live rock compliment etc. All of these things mean disturbance to the tank and this leads to stress on the fish and the hobbiest for that matter if he has several high dollar fish already in the tank. I think at the vary least most of us have rearranged or LR several time before getting it just how we like it.
Hell; I have had my tank for five months and I am just now getting to the point where I am happy with how everything is set up equipment wise. The day you wake up and one of your first thoughts is not "well I would like to make this or that change to my tank today" then your ready to go out and start shopping around for your intended and most likely much more expensive live stock than just a few damsels and a clean up crew. During this length of time your tank will have a chance to fully "season" for lack of a better word and you will have much more luck with your intended live stock.
Last word of advice is to leave the final decision on rock placement for the end. You will have to move it all any way to remove the damsels before adding the intended live stock. Just when you thnink you have everything just right. Wait a few more weeks again after that. Your bound to think of somehting esle.
Be sure to post again this time next year when you start adding your fish................just kidding :joy:
 

rstiles

Member
you have ich read the thread by Beth on dealing with this. leave tang in qt get the other fish out asap let tank run with out any fish for 3/4 weeks to let ich die off.the ich needs a fish host. been their did that.
 

wax32

Active Member
Originally Posted by ANTHONY17
I've just got my FOWLR tank started im passed my beginning cycle and i used 3 damsels to help with that ...
How long did this take? Did you see a large amount of ammonia on your test, then it went away? Then your nitrites spiked and went away? Then your nitrates spiked and came down to below 20?
Did you see diatom algae on your sand and rocks. (Looks like a brown film/powder covering everything.)
Just wanting to be sure you really cycled the tank, because from your description I am dubious.
At anyrate, yes blue tangs are prone to ich. They get stressed easily, which is a causal factor in an ich outbreak. Do your damsels chase the tang? If so, that's stressful. An improperly cycled tank will also cause stress to your tang.
I'd actually go along with murph's idea of getting rid of the tang and keeping the damsels for awhile, til you get the hang of things. Keep asking questions and read a lot here.
Welcome to the hobby!
 

danedodger

Member
A good LFS would discourage you from putting tangs with Damsels.
Sorry but I don't agree with this at all. What fish will live happily together involves a lot of variables. I have a yellow tang with a neon damsel and they're best of friends being the only two fish in a 130 gallon tank so far and both being added somewhat close together. The problem with the damsel is more likely going to be in adding any new fish to my tank since the damsel has been in there long enough to be well established. If I added another type of tang right now I would be worried that the damsel would harrass him but that's no big deal as I'm preparing for this possibility. We're also setting up a 29 gallon as a QT tank so if the damsel does pick on any new fish I add we can just let him live in the 29 instead.
Yep, that's likely ich and yep, tangs are more prone to it than others. In your QT tank, not your main tank, there's several things you can do to get rid of it, hyposalinity and meds probably being the ones most folks recommend. Loads of threads right here on these boards about it for you!
Nope, your LFS shouldn't have advised that you use damsels for your cycle but most do just because they don't know better. A raw shrimp or ghost feeding are much better ways to cycle. Since the cycle is already started (maybe even done?) what's done is done though. Your cycle is complete when you see the ammonia go up then down as the nitrites go up then down as the nitrates go up. At that point you should see ammonia 0, nitrite 0, and whatever for nitrates. Do a partial water change to bring down the nitrates (as close to 0 as possible but anything up to 20 is generally considered acceptable) and only then is the tank really ready for the first fish.
I personally think you need more liverock and a skimmer would be a good investment for you. You didn't mention any kind of filtration (or else I just need to finish my coffee and missed it
). Surely you've got some kind of filtration on your tank???
Yep, raise your salinity and yep, you can use treated tap water without ill affects to the fish. The only harm in that will be you may get a terrible algae bloom. IMO, RO/DI water is worth the extra money.
Step by step? Ok, just my opinion but:
1. It might be wisest to see if you can get the damsels out of your main tank and either into another tank, give them away, sell them, give them back to the store, whatever. The longer they're in your tank the more aggressive they will probably get as they grow larger and establish that your tank is their territory making adding new fish in the future harder.
2. Move your blue to your QT tank and treat for the ich. Once you do that if you do get rid of the damsels it probably would be best to leave your main tank without fish at all for awhile to let the ich hopefully die off and help prevent outbreaks in the future.
3. Fix your water parameters such as raising your salinity.
4. If you're willing to upgrade to RO/DI water a good time to get that started is while your fish are in the QT tank. Do weekly small water changes with the RO/DI water. I started out with treated tap water, got a nasty algae bloom, and have been doing my routine water changes with RO/DI. It takes time to get back on top of it doing it this way instead of just starting all over with RO/DI then going through the cycle again but if you keep the inverts you can't afford to go through a cycle again. Just stay on top of it and eventually you'll get it.
 
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