Aquascaping with PVC!!

hey all i have been interested in this for quite some time, has anyone ever done this, need advice, methods? what adhesive did you use, pictures please!!! this is for my new 260 reef. still ned more rock, but just making a plan!
thanx
~Dex
 
well i wish i wouldnt have had to, but it seems to be the only way to get a response around here. And im just trying to get a responce, and i am only looking for helpful advice, not criticism.
thanx
~Dex
 

life~reefer

Member
Originally Posted by Fish Freak2012
http:///forum/post/3249722
well i wish i wouldnt have had to, but it seems to be the only way to get a response around here. And im just trying to get a responce, and i am only looking for helpful advice, not criticism.
Not trying to hurt your feelings it is just annoying for the rest of us. Five threads is a little ridiculous. Patience is a virtue..
 

teresaq

Active Member
I have only read one post with someone using pvc structure for rock and I'm pretty sure he tore it down because it didnt work.
T
 

kylev

Member
as i said in one of your many other posts I am thinking about using PVC with a wide base and drilling through my rock and stacking around it to make a couple tall towers with alternating flat spots. I have seen some people make shevles out of it to stack rock against but I highly reconmend if you do use it to make sure all ends are capped and sealed very well or you might find a lot of critters growing and hidding in there
 

novahobbies

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by jchase1970
http:///forum/post/3249893
check out what can hide in pvc
http://www.oregonreef.com/sub_worm.htm
Yes, but that's definitely the exception, not the rule. On the other hand....... Eeewwwww!!!!!

Fishfreak, it just so happens I DO have some advice I can give you. Actually, I have a lot. Probably two posts worth. Got some coffee? Good.
I have used PVC in all of my tanks for the past few years. Back when I was upgrading from a 55 to a 110g tank, I ran across a technique called "live framing" in a magazine. This guy used 3 and 4 inch pvc pipes as uprights stands, with rock fastened to the uprights by the use of dry rock that had smaller pvc "plugs" drilled and epoxied into the rock. These plugs served as hangers and were inserted into small holes cut in to the larger PVC stands. I copied his method to the best my budget allowed when I built my 110 gallon. Here's the general idea of this technique:
It all starts with a plan. Here's a drawing of the frontal view of my new tank, with PVC stands built and placed roughly the way I want them.

The beauty of this kind of framing is that you can easily do it with all dry rock, and let it mature to live rock over time with a seeder rock or two. Also, you can use caves cut in to the pvc to hide powerheads and other tank equipment. After building the PVC frames, I did a leak test on the tank and tossed the frames in just to see how they would fit.

OK, so the bare PVC fits. You can see here how the base of the PVC stands are supported...either by a couple smaller tubes attached to the main tube, or by having stringers connecting a trio of PVC risers. Make sense?
Now it's time to start cutting holes, drilling rock, and fitting it all together. This is like a great big 3-D jigsaw puzzle....if you do it the right way (which you will see I did NOT) you can get all the rock so tight together that you hardly see the PVC except for whatever caves you drill out of the stands. My frames didn't come out as well as I originally wanted, but I was still happy with them. Here's a rock with the pvc hanger plug installed:

And here's the first few rocks fitted and tested in the tank.

Coming along with the same frame. Now it has been scuffed up and weathered with a dremel tool, the tops made to look jagged and more natural, and painted with reef-safe krylon fusion to cover the stark white.
>
Here's the next frame with a cave cut into it:

And here's the tank after all three frames were done and added to the tank. I'm skipping a lot of the build here; obviously just focusing on the frames. They look good but pretty bare for now.....

But a year later it looked like this:

It filled in pretty nicely. Overall I'm very happy with the result. I still call it a learning experience, however, and there are a number of things I would do differently in future builds. Stay tuned...Post no.2 is on the way......
 

novahobbies

Well-Known Member
OK, so that was "Live Framing." Hindsight is 20/20, they say, and as I mentioned previously there are a few things I would have done differently if I had known. Live Framing is VERY time-intensive, with a lot of planning out needing to be done to make sure everything fits. Not to mention the time involved in cutting all those little holes for the rock hangers, and drilling the rock itself. It works, but just be aware that it took a good week's full of evenings to do this.
A few months later I gave myself the project of revamping my kid cousin's 28g tank. He loved the rock columns in my tank, but I was hesitant to start THAT project again. Around this point in time people were starting to talk about using Great Stuff foam sealer to foam up the backs of their tanks. Some folks were starting to add rock in to the foam, since the sticky goo acted as an effective glue once it had expanded and set. One of my LFS's had an excellent display tank with a huge foam and rock piece front-and-center in the tank, and I loved the way the foam could be carved and made to take on any shape. A little light bulb went off in my head, and I thought, "if it looks good like this, what if I used it on a PVC column.....?"
I'd never heard of anyone doing this. I searched and I couldn't find a single thing on the web about it. Magazine articles yielded no results either. "Fine," I thought. "My idea. I'll name it
."
Foam-Framing was born.
Foam framing takes the premise of the live frame and simplifies it. You still cut holes for caves in the PVC, and you still have to make sure to stabilize the main riser. But instead of drilling the rock, cutting a hundred holes, and giving yourself an inhalation seizure from the PVC dust when you weather the riser..........you just lay rock against the side of the clean, white PVC, and squirt foam between the pvc and the rock. Let that set up, turn the pvc pipe a little,then add more rock. Rock, foam, and repeat until the column is done. Like so:
Foamed up, but no cave cut yet:

Same column, cave cut:

The back is all foam, so it fits in the back corner of a tank. You can also take this and carve the foam into rock-like shapes:

Just as an experiment, I tested some of that Krylon fusion paint on the rock and foam. It's sort of a "pre-shading" until coralline algae takes hold. Good news: Krylon fusion is pretty nonreactive against the fully cured foam:

And my cousin's tank, after two columns installed:

Not bad. I kept at this, building more columns for my aunt's tank, a friend's tank, and even selling a pair. The foam framing is great...it keeps the rock from becoming the dreaded "wall o' rubble" and frees up a lot of swimming space. The only drawback is that you are pretty much forced to use dry rock for this technique as well. When I was building these, it occurred to me that the foam was a great material to press coral frags and plugs into. You could even use faux coral. Here's the latest foam frame, a three-tiered beastie for my seahorse tank. This is complete with faux corals in the foam that are slowly being replaced by live corals:

I don't really feel like reposting an entire buildup, but when SWF ever gets the bulletin board fixed, you will be able to search my screen name for posts started in the seahorse section of the forum.....I have (had??) a tank buildup in that section that covers the foam frame for a 37g seahorse tank.
Whew! OK, I'm typed out for a little bit. I hope that helps. If you have any questions, feel free to post 'em!
 

novahobbies

Well-Known Member
Oh yeah, if you google "pvc live rock frame" you'll get a lot of hits for different ways to do this. PVC frames, foam walls, using eggcrate to build neat structures...you name it. Google is your friend!!
 

noah's nemo

Member
I used 1/4 inch pipe pex from lowes.It is flexible and you can make almost any crazy shapes you want.I just made a couple arches for mine.Just drill the rock and slide the pex thru.
 

jchase1970

Member
"Yes, but that's definitely the exception, not the rule. On the other hand....... Eeewwwww!!!!! "
yes but what an exception, lol. other then it's expensive taste in corals I'ld hate to remove something so unique,lol.
 

kylev

Member
Originally Posted by Noah's Nemo
http:///forum/post/3249967
I used 1/4 inch pipe pex from lowes.It is flexible and you can make almost any crazy shapes you want.I just made a couple arches for mine.Just drill the rock and slide the pex thru.
I really like this idea Noah, I am definetely gonna have to use it to make some arches
thanks
 

novahobbies

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by baloo6969
http:///forum/post/3251322
Foam? Krylon? In tank water???
Yep. Both cure chemically inert and will be fine in saltwater. Just let them cure completely first. And I read about the krylon by another member on these boards.....so that's the brand I use. I don't think I'd try any old brand in there - just the krylon fusion.
 
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