building a tank

[sharkboy97]

Alright Im building a big tank 7' 3' 3'
i need help on what filtrtion system to add to this how much it will cost and if any math genuis can find out how many gallons it is gonna be because i need to find out if i can put this on the second floor of my house and how long could this soupport a healthly Leopard Shark also where can i purchase a Leopard Shark

 

[thegrog]

I can help you with some of your questions.
First your tank will hold about 460 gallons. The water weight alone will be about 3800 pounds!!! Given your tank dimensions, that will put about 180 pounds of pressure per square foot. Now, the live rock and sand will add even more weight as will the tank itself and stand.
With a tank this size I would STRONGLY suggest that you find someone familiar with structural engineering to look over your house to see if you can support something of this weight.
For filtration, I would go with a large (100 gallon or so) sump/refugium with a very heavy duty protein skimmer. I would go with the AquaC EV-2000. This retails for around $800. In addition, I would go with a DSB in both your tank and refugium to aid with denitrification. You will need around 300-400 pounds of live rock as well, either in your main tank or your sump or both. Macroalgae in the sump will help with nutrient export as well.
I am not familiar with mechanical and chemical filtration for a tank this big, but I would recommend both. Mechanical may be as simple as a fine mesh sock on your sump intake.
Definately plan on several bulkheads drilled on your tank for overflow and lots of water movement.
Sharks are VERY messy and dirty creatures that make lots of waste. You will need lots of heavy duty filtration to keep the tank clean, not to mention weekly 10% (~60 gallon) water changes. Water quality is key. Simple wet-dry filtration, ammonia towers, fluidized beds... will NOT do... chemical and/or biological scrubbers, extensive live sumps (refugiums), deep sand beds (DSBs)... and the like... of SIZE, capacity are required (unless you have access to clean seawater...) to maintain these fishes. Circulation and aeration need to be brisk, the water kept in motion for exercise, filtration purposes, and dissolved oxygen near saturation (about or greater than 7 ppm).
Personally I feel that even this system is too small for most all species of Leopard shark. You will not be able to keep one for more than a year before it gets too small. All sharks need ROOM... to move, grow, dilute their wastes, allow for gaseous diffusion of gasses for respiration... Not hundreds, but several hundred to thousands of gallons in the case of Leopards... Tanks of less than ten feet in length, five in diameter are equivalent to you or I being confined (permanently) to a closet... behaviorally, physiologically and psychologically prohibitive.
Plus, these animals need the water to be cold (50's to mid 60's being ideal) so you will need some serious chillers installed (run into the thousands for a system of this size).
If you have your heart set on having a shark, research some of the smaller species like the banded cat shark or the marbled bamboo.
Hope this helps!

 

[acrylic51]

Sorry don't want to step on any toes, but doing my calculations at 84"x36"x36"/231 comes out to be 471.3 gallons!!!! That is a monster!!!!!
I would seriously seek professional building advice on this tank before going any futher. I would also think about having the tank euro braced instead of cross bracing across the tank. It gives it a much nicer cleaner appearance.
You might want to give Tom a call at Glass Cages... he might be able to give you some advice or pointers on your tank... He has been building tanks I think for almost 20 years and his work is good. His tanks are monsters..... My 240 I think he told me weighs about 450lbs.
Water movement you will seriously want to look at the Sequence line of pumps. They are super nice pumps, not bad as far as noise and bottom line can push alot of water with good head pressure if needed..
As far as filtration.... I would make as big of a sump fuge as possible. You can either have it custom built or if you like DIY projects this would be an easy one for you. I'm going to build my sump for my 240 to be 72"Lx24"Hx30"W. As far as running the micron socks that would be good, because they will catch large particulates in the water, but they must be serviced religiously or water quality will suffer!!!!!!!
As far as skimmers I would seriously consider a beckett style skimmer. These skimmers are designed to efficiently skim your water very well and they are designed to handle large water volumes like yours. There was an article done not long ago that broke the skimmers down into ther perspective classes. The needle wheels are very good skimmers and very efficient, but are not designed to handle high volumes of water like the beckett skimmer design. Another skimmer you might want to look at is the ETSS skimmers. They are rather innovative in design as well.
If you belong to other sites you might have seen a thread on a comparison of 12 different skimmers being put against each other??? You might want to check this thread out and see some of the results......
DSB or SSB or barebottom??? This is a very debateable subject and their have been many reports to write on this, but it is known that denitrification and nitrification does not take place deep in your sand bed.. The process can take place in as little as a 1/2" of sand and usually occurrs within the first 1 1/2" of sand so with that being said I think the theory of DSB being needed to filter the tanks are somewhat off base. Alot of people will dispute that, but can you honestly say that these people have done any scientific studies to prove otherwise when it has been noted by leading respectable individuals in the hobby???? I'm not saying I take their word 100%, but if you look at the trend happening alot or most of the DSB are either going to SSB or going bare bottom.... The bottom line is most people don't maintenance their sand beds as they should... What I'm saying is that periodically portions (not large) portions of your sand bed need to be turned over somewhat..... Alot of guys are going bare bottom or using Starboard (cutting board material) to minimize detriuos build up. That is a big key for your tank.........
Guys that are big into SPS are going Zeovite. Again no substrate and to minimize detrious buildup. Again the shift and thinking and knowledge that DSB aren't a requirment as once thought. HTH:notsure:

 

[psusocr]

i just wanna say that i was going to go from my 180 to another 400 gallon saltwater since the tank cost would have only been $250 dollars more for all that room,,, but after noticing it would cost me an extra $2000 or so in filters pump, etc. i decided to start out a bit smaller for now with the 180,, and keep my 400 gallon for my crocs ,,eventually ill start out slowly buying more filter,pumps, powerheads etc, then move up too the 400.....My general rule and saying is dont bite off a piece you cant chew( which i would have done)

 

[sharkboy97]

well contacted the builder he said it was to heavy anyone with experince in building a pond please e-mail e i kinda want to buy those black ones
that u can get a garden stores

 

[psusocr]

hey i have 3, 300 gallons ponds that you can get at homedepot or lowes in my crocs tank, i dont think they would be good for saltwater fish becasue you can barely see in those thigns since they are black, my water is crystal clear and i have skimmers and pumps in all them and evan when i put feeder fish in those ponds for my croc you can barely see them, in matter of fact when the crocs are at the bottom of them its hard to see them well cause they blend in, so i think that you wouldnt see all the amazing colors in slatwater fish if you went with one, but thats just my opinion, also i have submersible filters and such in my ponds and it takes up alot of room since you cant buy anything for them that you can "hang -on" the sides,,,,If you need anymore info or pictures just let me know

 

[sharkboy97]

yea, what type of crocs do u have and could i make a cut and install a glass window

 

[psusocr]

i have 2 dwarf caimen...one (Paleosuchus palpebrosus) and one smoothfront(Paleosuchus trigonatus) both full grown( about 4 feet).... and also the way those ponds are cut, there in layers that go from very wide to very small at the bottom, so putting a pice of glass there would be Extremely hard,, evan if you got a perfect square pond i still dont think you would be able to get glass or acrylic for the window since there would be no way to attach it,, silicone woudlnt stick to acrylic or plastic...and weldon for acrylic would melt the pond plastic to nothing since its soo thin...I really hate to be the bad guy and shoot your ideas down it sucks...ill try to help you as much as i can if you let me know what size you think you can handle i can try to design somehtign for you that would be cost efficent,,,im good with building tanks but as for filtration im a begginer myself,,,just let me know

 

[sharkboy97]

well im up for any ideas at this point so just tell me.
do u have snakes?
i keep and breed ball pythons, and keep red tail boas
getting out though. just thought i would ask

 

[psusocr]

no i never really got into snakes, just let me know what kind of dimensions you wanna work with ,,,gallongs, space you have, best of all what you want to keep in this tank so you can build for the animals and most important a budget