Calling all experts

[hserock]

okay I know that this topic is a hot button issue,but here it goes.
I am having water quality issues.
All my readings are good, but following water changes or top offs
I am riddled with diatoms, is this from tap water???
What are diatoms in relation to silica????
How do you get rid of them
I know you should use R.O (like this hobby isn't expensive enough!!!)
but everyone I know personally w/marine aquariam uses tap water and thinks I am crazy they are not having this problem.
Recently I have been using bottled drinking water from the store in gallons for top off, this has been helping to keep the brown diatoms in check.
Any suggestions greatly appreciated. :notsure:

 

[cannonman]

I'm not an expert but: here's a recipe
RO water
More water flow to affected areas
add sand stirring creatures/snails

 

[hot883]

NEVER use tap water. Only use RO/DI water. if you do not have one, spend another $150 and get one. Diatoms are usually a new tank syndrom. If the tank is new it is to be expected.

 

[phishface]

I started out with tap water, til I saved up. Only been 3 water changes, and top offs and the brown alge that "blows away" with current has really dropped off. RO/DI the way to go. Good luck. :happyfish

 

[sepulatian]

ah, I use my well water. I live at the base of a mountain and have tested it many times. It is basically spring water, but it runs through pipes. They are plastic pipes in the house, but metal pipes outside. When I mix my water I add declorinater. Not that there is any chlorine, but it takes care of heavy metals as well. Diatoms are normal for any new system. If you used complete RO water you would still get diatoms (that is the brown mess)If your water is AT ALL questionable. Buy an RO unit. It will save you BIG TIME in the long run. But diatoms happen in EVERYONES tank regardless of the water you use!

 

[huskychasrs]

Not trying to start a cyber-war, but why does alot of people push the use of ro water?
Is your local tap that bad?
Not trying to flame just want to know.
I've seen some of the other threads with the FDA allowable limits and such.
The gal that is helping me owns a 215G and uses nothing but tap and has for 15+years in the same area.
Thread hi-jack over.

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by huskychasrs
Not trying to start a cyber-war, but why does alot of people push the use of ro water?
Is your local tap that bad?
Not trying to flame just want to know.
I've seen some of the other threads with the FDA allowable limits and such.
The gal that is helping me owns a 215G and uses nothing but tap and has for 15+years in the same area.
Thread hi-jack over.
It competely depends on the water. If the water is AT ALL questionable (meaning nitrates, copper pipes, chlorine, god knows what else) I use well water. "TAP" in most places means community water in which all kinds of chemicals and crap are in the water. I have people right down the road that will not drink their tap (let alone offer it to their pets). RO water is COMPLETELY purified of anything and everything. Including trace elements which are some times a plus. I have hard water. It runs down granite rock. I would recomend RO water for everyone. I happen to be lucky with my location. Most people are not so lucky.

 

[hserock]

okay, our local tap water is bad enough that we have a water service for drinking water.
Everything is healthy,fish,inverts,my rock looks great.
ph good
ammonia
nitrate
nitrite
It's just the darn ugly diatoms. I guess my question was answered that even ro water can have diatom issues.
Here are a few more questions:
Are there diatom loving creatures????
Are ro systems a pain?
Oh, I should mention this tank has been up and running for 1.5 years w/original stock. So I know it's the water and not new tank syn.
Is spring water a better option for topping off between water changes than tap with chlor-out?

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by Hserock
okay, our local tap water is bad enough that we have a water service for drinking water.
Everything is healthy,fish,inverts,my rock looks great.
ph good
ammonia
nitrate
nitrite
It's just the darn ugly diatoms. I guess my question was answered that even ro water can have diatom issues.
Here are a few more questions:
Are there diatom loving creatures????
Are ro systems a pain?
Oh, I should mention this tank has been up and running for 1.5 years w/original stock. So I know it's the water and not new tank syn.
Is spring water a better option for topping off between water changes than tap with chlor-out?
AGH, Your system has been running for a year and a half?????That changes everything!!!! Diatoms are normal for a new tank no matter what the source water is. You need an RO unit. You won't drink it but you give it to your fish?????? Ugh!

 

[marine fanatic]

Originally Posted by huskychasrs
Not trying to start a cyber-war, but why does alot of people push the use of ro water?
Is your local tap that bad?
Not trying to flame just want to know.
I've seen some of the other threads with the FDA allowable limits and such.
The gal that is helping me owns a 215G and uses nothing but tap and has for 15+years in the same area.
Thread hi-jack over.
The general rule of thumb is to NOT use tap water. There ARE some ares in the country that tap water is not so bad. The FDA and EPA may stipulate what the water quality must be for human consumption but they allow minerals to a point since they are not as harmful to us as to marine life. A lot of tap water contains mineral elements that can be devestating to an aquarium....especially copper!
My local Walgreens has a RO dispenser right outside of it and for $1.00, I get 5 gallons......a measly dollar is beyond worth risking adding copper or anything bad to my tanks. Even using Prime or AmQuel won't remove minerals from tap water, they only neutralize ammonia and remove chloramines.

 

[marine fanatic]

If your tank is that old and you have a diatom problem and you are using tap water, I would think your tap water is adding phosphates to your tank and the result is your gorgeous brown decor ;p
RO units have really come down in price over the last couple of years, so much that I think I will get one myself. This hobby DOES have a tendancy to drain your bank account and to risk losing so much over the use of poor quality water is just not good sense.
Ok, rant over....it's all sepulation's fault

 

[farslayer]

I never had a diatom outbreak on my tank. Diatoms create their skeletal structure with silicates; if there are no silicates in your water (or very small amounts), you shouldn't get them. I run phos gard in several filters including a canister filter, which removes silicates, and I never had an outbreak. But typically, most people get them. Phosphates have nothing to do with diatoms, but will cause nuisance algae.
Tap water may be treated by your local water company to contain minerals and other goodies which are good for people but bad for your fish. RO unites remove a lot of these impurities to help you keep your water chemistry in check.

 

[sepulatian]

Ok, rant over....it's all sepulation's fault
Hey now!!!!!!! I am an innocent helper who happens to have great well water!!!!

This person knows their water is crap and won't drink it, but offers it to the fish. I HAD sympathy. Not if the person won't drink it themselves. My water is yummy. :joy:

 

[marine fanatic]

Originally Posted by Farslayer
I never had a diatom outbreak on my tank. Diatoms create their skeletal structure with silicates; if there are no silicates in your water (or very small amounts), you shouldn't get them. I run phos gard in several filters including a canister filter, which removes silicates, and I never had an outbreak. But typically, most people get them. Phosphates have nothing to do with diatoms, but will cause nuisance algae.
Tap water may be treated by your local water company to contain minerals and other goodies which are good for people but bad for your fish. RO unites remove a lot of these impurities to help you keep your water chemistry in check.

What then is the relationship, if any, between silicates and phosphates? I have had friends who had diatom outbreaks and tested high on phosphates, after removing it the diatoms faded away. I know I have heard of people using play sand that contained silicates that caused problems but I thought phosphates had a role in diatom problems????

 

[marine fanatic]

Originally Posted by sepulatian
Hey now!!!!!!! I am an innocent helper who happens to have great well water!!!!

This person knows their water is crap and won't drink it, but offers it to the fish. I HAD sympathy. Not if the person won't drink it themselves. My water is yummy. :joy:

Question about well water, do you ever run into issues with residual elements? My brother was using well water and we tested it by boiling 2 gallons on the stove to see what leftovers were there...the whole pot was covered in a white powder substance afterwards.

 

[farslayer]

There's no relationship between phosphates and silicates, but the deal is that the stuff that removes phosphates takes out silicates as well. I believe they are about the same shape and size, which is why they can be taken out by the same stuff. My wife has a BS in organic chemistry and a Masters in biology, she's really the one to explain it Check out the phos gard product (which I use), it says it takes out phosphates and silicates.

 

[sepulatian]

Diatoms are in lets say "ALMOST" every new set up. I have had them. The Mods have had them. People using ALL kinds of different water from different parts of the world. Almost everyone gets them.

 

[marine fanatic]

Did some reading to make sure I understood it correctly. From what I gather, silicates cause diatoms and diatoms consume nitrates and phosphates from the water. So am I to assume that if silicates cause the diatom outbreak and phosphates are present in the water, then the diatoms will feed off it and continue to grow????

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by Marine Fanatic
Question about well water, do you ever run into issues with residual elements? My brother was using well water and we tested it by boiling 2 gallons on the stove to see what leftovers were there...the whole pot was covered in a white powder substance afterwards.
Yeah, that is the residue of hard water. Boil some of your tank water. Besides salt you will get the same residue. The elements in my water are the same ones that you put back into your water from the RO unit. Do you use the liquid stuff to put the essential elements back into your RO water? I don't recall the name because I don't use it. I have some iron, magnesium, calcium etc. Not alot, but some. That is what makes water "hard"

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by Marine Fanatic
Did some reading to make sure I understood it correctly. From what I gather, silicates cause diatoms and diatoms consume nitrates and phosphates from the water. So am I to assume that if silicates cause the diatom outbreak and phosphates are present in the water, then the diatoms will feed off it and continue to grow????
No, unless they have a renewed source they will diminish the supply then die off.