Chemi-Pure = No water changes?

[phixer]

Originally Posted by mystic7
{EDIT - language}All I know is that there are a few people on this board who also use chemi-pure and don't do water changes, and we spend our days enjoying our beautiful tanks, and I never see them posting here about their coral beauty not eating or the strange white flecks on their clown fish or any other nonsense that keeps the rest of you scientists awake all night with worry. Go ahead, do your water changes, make sure the temperature and salinity are within .00001% of the tank water, add your 15 powerheads and feed your fish 10 different kinds of foods soaked in 10 different kinds of vitamins. Us no water change believers will all be here to laugh in your faces when your tanks crash even though you use RO/DI water exclusively and keep your lights on exactly 6.3 hours per day except for actinics which come on precisely 43 minutes before your main lights (268 watts each as per University of Maine recommendations) and go off precisely 38 minutes after your mains. {EDI: LANGUAGE}
{EDIT: PLEASE NOTE THAT FLAMING AND NAME CALLING SUCH AS THIS WILL NOT BE TOLERATED. PEOPLE HAVE DIFFERENT IDEAS ON HOW TO RUN TANKS AND WHAT WORKS FOR SOME WILL NOT WORK FOR OTHERS. PEOPLE ARE ALLOWED TO HAVE DIFFERENT OPINIONS AND IDEAS SO LONG AS THEY CAN DO SO AS ADULTS. PLEASE RESPECT THIS. THE NAMES USED ARE NOT APPROPRIATE AND DO NOTHING FOR YOUR ARGUMENT OR OPINIONS}

This type of rage is typical while under the influence of Snake oil, Badger milk or Fairy dust, although their use elimnates the need for water changes, occasional fits of rage and temporary loss of composure associated with being wrong can occur. Fortunately there is a cure, its called "regular partial water changes".

 

[dadummy]

Originally Posted by moby
excessive nose hair, decreased credit rating, slurred speech, premature tire wear, IRS audits, tapeworms, temporary blindness, inflamed ego, sleeplessness, drowsiness, sarcastic teenagers, unappreciative inlaws, gout, unbalanced check book, uncontrollable laughing, fits of delusion, memory loss, 20/20 vision, bad breath, and lack of patience.).
That's it!! I don't appreciate you talking about me like that, I thought this was supposed to be a friendly forum..
psssst!! I trimmed the nose hairs, they are still noticable?

 

[phixer]

Originally Posted by mystic7
{EDIT - language}All I know is that there are a few people on this board who also use chemi-pure and don't do water changes, and we spend our days enjoying our beautiful tanks, and I never see them posting here about their coral beauty not eating or the strange white flecks on their clown fish or any other nonsense that keeps the rest of you scientists awake all night with worry. Go ahead, do your water changes, make sure the temperature and salinity are within .00001% of the tank water, add your 15 powerheads and feed your fish 10 different kinds of foods soaked in 10 different kinds of vitamins. Us no water change believers will all be here to laugh in your faces when your tanks crash even though you use RO/DI water exclusively and keep your lights on exactly 6.3 hours per day except for actinics which come on precisely 43 minutes before your main lights (268 watts each as per University of Maine recommendations) and go off precisely 38 minutes after your mains. {EDI: LANGUAGE}
{EDIT: PLEASE NOTE THAT FLAMING AND NAME CALLING SUCH AS THIS WILL NOT BE TOLERATED. PEOPLE HAVE DIFFERENT IDEAS ON HOW TO RUN TANKS AND WHAT WORKS FOR SOME WILL NOT WORK FOR OTHERS. PEOPLE ARE ALLOWED TO HAVE DIFFERENT OPINIONS AND IDEAS SO LONG AS THEY CAN DO SO AS ADULTS. PLEASE RESPECT THIS. THE NAMES USED ARE NOT APPROPRIATE AND DO NOTHING FOR YOUR ARGUMENT OR OPINIONS}

:hilarious This type of rage is typical while under the influence of Snake oil, Badger milk or Fairy dust, although their use eliminates the need for water changes and cures mythophobia, occasional fits of rage and temporary loss of composure associated with being wrong can occur. Consult your local witch doctor before using. Fortunately there is a cure, its called knowledge and "regular partial water changes". :hilarious

 

[bmwaaron]

But would it be ok to use this product as a Carbon pile? I dont belive the waterchange hype but I wanted to use it anyways. I guess my question would be putting the No waterchange claim aside is it still a good product?

 

[phixer]

Ion-exchange media like the one mentioned in this thread certainly has a place, as canister filter media for example. You want to place it in a stream of pressurized water, if its coarse keep it away from your pumps intake because small peices can damage the impeller. A wide variety of chemical filtrants are available to the aquarist. Through absorption, adsorption, flocculation or ion exchange, these materials remove compounds that are found to be detrimental to the overall health of some aquarium animals. Conversly only some water pollutants can be measured directly by typical test kits.
Heres the catch. If chemical filtrants are used to lower nitrate and phosphate levels without conducting water changes, how can they be certain that other pollutants are also reduced? and that significant trace elements like iodine are not consequently removed also. Many are not selective as to what elements they remove. Finally there is the issue of cost, If you spend $3.00 in chemical filtrants to remove polluntants from 10 gallons of seawater, its easy to miss the point that 10 gallons of brand-new synthetic seawater may cost you only $2.00 to replace.

 

[mystic7]

Oh, being called a lunatic because I believe in my method of fish keeping is just joking around, eh? Seems like every time I bring up my no water change method everybody here goes through the roof, but I'm supposed to keep a sense of humor? You know where you all can stick it.
The Hippo does NOT have hlle, all Hippo Tangs have those markings on their heads, this one happens to be 7" long, it's not a 2"er like most of you have, so they're more obvious.
The Majestic was practically dead when I bought it, the LFS said it was just in shock, but I could see it was worse than that. He said he'd replace it if it died so I took it, and it died. My water quality has nothing to do with it, or else my fully thriving Blue Face would be dead too, right!?! But again you ignore the parts that don't jive with your beliefs.
I know you're all just upset because I've exposed your stupidity in paying hundreds and thousands more than necessary for a fairly simple hobby, so instead of kicking yourselves in the --- you have to take it out on me. That's ok, but if you'd saved all that money you could buy yourselves professional therapy. Don't get mad now, keep your senses of humor. It's all in fun, right?
One final point about the shrooms, I've stated many times I don't recommend my methods for tanks other than FOWLR's so all of your "accusations" against my methods are, to say the least, lame.

 

[emmitt]

Your excuses are lame. You say your tank is so great and healthy but yet everything is sick or dying. This came sick, that was in shock, i knew those would die but so what. Those are all your lame excuses for why your tank isnt healthy. I hate to break it to you but that tang has VERY noticeable hlle. Before you rant about us feeding all different foods and vitamins, you should check what your fish need to be healthy because they aren't. By the way, the fish doesnt have to be dead to be sick!
I dont know where these thousands you think you are savings is coming from. It cost me less than $5.00 and 15 minutes to do a water change. Big deal. Lot easier than making up excuses for why things are dying in my tank and buying replacements.

P.s.- we are not railing on you, you are calling us names for doing water changes. Keep not doing them and keep telling yourself its the fishes fault and not your tank's. LMAO

 

[bmwaaron]

I was told by my LFS that since Chem pure is in a bag that I can actually just lay it over the sponge in my sump, Do you think this is an ok practice or do I need the canister filter to place it in? What is the best way to do this?

 

[mystic7]

Originally Posted by emmitt
Your excuses are lame. You say your tank is so great and healthy but yet everything is sick or dying. This came sick, that was in shock, i knew those would die but so what. Those are all your lame excuses for why your tank isnt healthy. I hate to break it to you but that tang has VERY noticeable hlle. Before you rant about us feeding all different foods and vitamins, you should check what your fish need to be healthy because they aren't. By the way, the fish doesnt have to be dead to be sick!
I dont know where these thousands you think you are savings is coming from. It cost me less than $5.00 and 15 minutes to do a water change. Big deal. Lot easier than making up excuses for why things are dying in my tank and buying replacements.

P.s.- we are not railing on you, you are calling us names for doing water changes. Keep not doing them and keep telling yourself its the fishes fault and not your tank's. LMAO
Everything you said is total B.S. If you place a fish in a tank after proper acclimation and it just sinks to the bottom immediately, I'd say the fish was in pretty bad shape to begin with. This LFS has since shown itself to be a hack, even his QT tank (I'm sure you have one of those) is filled with ick which is why he hasn't replaced the Majestic yet. And again, the Blue Face that I bought at the same time is doing great. Explain that, and don't say dumb luck. The Hippo was purchased from some guy whose tank it got too big for, it had those marks on his head when I bought it, and he's been doing great for 5 months now, he NEVER scratches himself on the rock, none of my fish do, and my cleaner wrasse, which are impossible to keep as I'm so often told here, is doing great, he eats everything I throw in the tank, and he's been around over 4 months himself.
I NEVER called anybody names for doing water changes, again you ignore the parts of my posts that don't fit in with your agendas, I've even stated that I don't recommend my method for anybody, even experienced hobbyists, and I've been nothing but respectful. This of course is a red flag for others to feel they can say whatever they want about me, snake oil and all that garbage. And, for the last time, since everybody seems to conveniently forget, I had a 140 gallon 25 years ago, I used the same method, using 25 year old technology (no skimmer, UG filters, etc.) and had the same success. And I'm not the only person here who uses this method!
If you want to continue doing water changes, PLEASE, by all means continue. But it's obvious that SOMETHING bugs you about my methods, and it ain't the welfare of my fish. I don't believe that for a second.

 

[emmitt]

You are right. Your tank is perfectly healthy. All the problems and death's are clearly the fault of who you buy your fish from. You also have saved us alot of trouble by finding a easy cure for ick, raise temp, feed extra and poof...... no more ick, cured. LMAO
p.s.- I would have thought after at least 25 years experience you could pick out fish that arent so close to death that as soon as they are acclimated they sink and die!

 

[moby]

psssst!! I trimmed the nose hairs, they are still noticable?
LOL,dadummy, I think you got them all, but you should stop trying to use them as a "comb over"!

I was told by my LFS that since Chem pure is in a bag that I can actually just lay it over the sponge in my sump, Do you think this is an ok practice or do I need the canister filter to place it in? What is the best way to do this?
Either way will work, but it is more efficient to place in a canister where the water is pushed through it with more pressure.
Moby

 

[shrimpdady]

I do not agree with mystic one bit about not doing water changes, but it is not our purpose to flame him for his methods.
I have gone back and read almost every post this guy has made and he has not once flamed anyone for doing water changes nor has he tried to make his way of doing things to be "the right way".
Mystic has posted threads with legitimate questions and all he has gotten is grief.
Leave him alone and just answer the question asked or don't post.
Anyone else feel like this thread needs to be locked?

 

[emmitt]

Originally Posted by ShrimpDady
I do not agree with mystic one bit about not doing water changes, but it is not our purpose to flame him for his methods.
I have gone back and read almost every post this guy has made and he has not once flamed anyone for doing water changes nor has he tried to make his way of doing things to be "the right way".
Mystic has posted threads with legitimate questions and all he has gotten is grief.
Leave him alone and just answer the question asked or don't post.
Anyone else feel like this thread needs to be locked?
All he has gotten is grief??? He hasn't flamed anyone???
The reason you dont see anything is because the mods deleted all of the names he called us. I won't repeat them obviously but they were there which is what made me respond. All you have to do is scroll up and you can see where the mods deleted his rantings.

 

[moby]

I think that for those of us that have been doing this along time have to keep in mind we should be careful what we advocate in a forum for new hobbiest.
New fishkeepers are easily influenced by the things we post on this forum, they simply don't have the experience to know what is common practice and what are the exceptions.
The above quotes are orignally mine, and I think that is the main point I was trying to make.
I agree shrimpdady, we should be less critical of others methods, however I think we should also provide sound advice based on the responsible methods of fishkeeping. I certainly meant no harm to mystic and repeatedly made light of some of the comments by myself and others.
Advocating no water changes is irresponsible advice,IMO I think everyone should know this.
The flaming gets out of control because some perspectives of this hobby are simply wrong or foolish and newbies are often not experienced enough to know when they are being led astray. Much in the same way a lot of LFS have over the years BS'ed a lot of inexperienced hobbiest.
If you post a methodology which flies in the face of logic you should be prepared for the backlash, although personal attacks really do serve no purpose and I will curb my sarcasm in the future. (okay, I'll try to anyway)

Moby

 

[phixer]

:hilarious Personally I think this kind of dialog is fun. Besides isnt that what these icons are for

 

[shrimpdady]

I know it's hard to keep a level head when you feel that someone is completely wrong about something, but remember that the other person surely feels just as strong about what they believe in as you do about what you believe in.
No matter who is right, when you have two people who are very opinionated (I am one of them which is why I don't get into these types of discussions except to try and step in and and hope things will get back on track) they will get into a heated arguement.
Someone has to be the "man" and just stop replying and the other person will get the hint. Who cares who gets the last word?
In the words of the great Forrest Gump, "That's all I got to say about that."

 

[mystic7]

Originally Posted by ShrimpDady
I do not agree with mystic one bit about not doing water changes, but it is not our purpose to flame him for his methods.
I have gone back and read almost every post this guy has made and he has not once flamed anyone for doing water changes nor has he tried to make his way of doing things to be "the right way".
Mystic has posted threads with legitimate questions and all he has gotten is grief.
Leave him alone and just answer the question asked or don't post.
Anyone else feel like this thread needs to be locked?
THANK YOU, ShrimpDady. I saw the response immediately after yours, guys like him/it just see what they want to see. As you said, I've made dozens of other posts where the subject of no water changes comes up and I have always stressed that I don't recommend my methods, especially for reef systems, but there are idiots here who only see what they want to see. Notice how he "had to respond" after my insults but totally ignored the posts that caused me to respond the way I did. All of those other threads ended up with people ripping into me, it's like they feel they have to defend their methods. I certainly don't, all I've ever said was chemi-pure and no water changes has always worked for me, period. And for the record, I do NOT have a tank of death! All of my fish are doing fine. What other fish did I ever lose that you're all so smugly laughing about? Here's the list: One Yellow Tang and one Flame Angel that I myself acknowledged that I put in too soon after setting up the tank using Biospira, going against my better judgement. Once Rock Beauty that I bought out of quarantine at the LFS because non-dwarf angels are near impossible to come by here so I grabbed him. He wasn't ready to be moved, the LFS acknowledged this and replaced him. And one Majestic Angel that I told the LFS at the store didn't look good, I bought him with the Blue Face Angel, the Blue Face is doing great, the Majestic sank to the bottom of the tank and died a few hours later.
So again, ShrimpDady, thanks for being the ONLY person on this board with any sense of courtesy and common sense. I appreciate it. The rest of you can do what the admin will probably censor anyway.

 

[phixer]

 

[emmitt]

Now that is funny, phixer

 

[moby]

And I too would also like to apologize now for anything that has not been said yet but might be said someday by someone to something that might hurt somethings feelings in someway somewhere, somehow.
Hey Phixer, remember this? I knew this would come in handy!!
Thanks!

Moby