Crab Question

[sgt__york]

are emerald or Sally light food crabs reef safe??? will they hurt any corals, coraline algea OR other snails/crabs?
I've heard they ARE reef safe, and yet another say they are NOT reef safe. I notice many reef packages of 'cleanup crews' include emerals crabs - but NOT sally light foots. However, they then offer light foots as extras.
I have a cleanup crew due in on Tuesday. I'd like to know for certain BEFORE putting them in the tank, and then having to hunt them down OR lose coraline, etc.
The crew i have coming in are:
10 Scarlet crabs
20 blue leg crabs
4 emerald crabs
2 sally lightfoots
20 Astreas snails
10 Cerith Snails
10 Trochas snails
Does anyone see a potential problem with compatibility (crab to crab OR crab to snail) OR to other parts of the tank (ie, coraline algae, sponges, corals, etc)???

 

[hondo]

they are considered reef safe but as with all crabs it is hit and miss. I have had both in my tanks and currently have a sally lightfoot and have never had a problem. But many on this board will tell you horror stories about either of these crabs taking out fish inverts in their tanks. If you are looking for an abosolute "yes they are reef safe" your not going to find one with either of these crabs, but chances are good you won't have any problems. Where did you get the clean up crew from and what other items are in it?

 

[ed r]

I agree. Many people have good luck with crabs and shrimp. I have not. I stick with snails and conchs now to stay "claws free". It will just depend upon your tank and your crabs. Keep an eye on them. Perhaps you will be among the many lucky ones. I hope so.

 

[sgt__york]

Hondo,
The 'crew' is just those and quanties stated above. About 40 snails (3 varieties), and 30 crabs - (4 varieties). The crew cost about $120 with shipping. i hate to mention other vendors here, but feel free to email me and i'll tell you who i got them thru. I priced them here, and originally wanted to purchase them thru here - but the $59.99 for shipping alone (as compared to free shipping) made a 'huge' price difference.
I've had someone recommend a queen conc as well - but figured my 'load' is so low right now - i'll wait to see how this cleanup crew handles things.
I'm in the process of CAPTURING 4 damsels outta the tank right now.. LOL. I'm putting in 2 percula's and a very small blue hippo. That's about it for now.
Oh yea, w/the cleanup crew (add'l price) i have my first coral coming in also - a green star polyp and a yellow polyp.
I probably won't add anything else except a cleaner wrass; another tang (later); and some other wrass or small fish for color - and call it a year. I'll then begin adding more coral next summer/season.

 

[hondo]

gesh, I can't beleive I didn't see that part of the email. sorry to say but your blue leg hermits will eat most of your snails in order to get their shells. It may slow things down a bit if you throu=w some empty shells in the tank for the crabs to move into but eventually the blues will take out your snails. I went with the fighting conch instead of the queeen as the queen gets too big. Good luck with the GSP and yellow polyps. I have GSP and at one time had the yellow until a camel shrimp made a feast of them (I got even as my new Hawkfish made a meal of the camel)

 

[sgt__york]

rofl.. everything that goes around, comes around eh? lol
hmm... the blue shells might give the snails hell eh? Will they do it for FOOD or just their shells primarily?
Do you know much about the scarlet crab's behavior (or any other of the crabs) in relation to the snails?? Most of the "cleanup crew" packs i saw had a combination of crabs and snails - OR is that so the crabs will tear the snails up so you will order more??? LOL
would be a big help to know BEFORE putting them in the tank. As it is now.. i'm playing HECK catching 4 damsels out of my tank. I've caught 1 of em so far.. been at it about 2hrs now.. LOL I've stuck a huge clear rubbermade box in the tank, with some food in it (turnes most of the pwerheads off) in hopes of luring em in the big open space.. then got a net to chase em further in. Dang things are too smart for my good so far.

 

[hondo]

the blues will attack the snails for both food and for their shells. the scarlet are easily the best hermit as they don't seem to bother anything. My scarlets I hardly ever see as they seem to like staying in the rock crevices eating the trapped detrius. I agree with your thought I think the online vendors always include blue legs in their packages because they know they will eventually take out the snails and you'll be back for more snails. Good luck with the damsel hunt, my personall choice would be to borrow a hungry panther grouper from a friendly LFS and let nature take it's course and then return the grouper when the job is done (should only take a day. If that is not possible I usually catch hard to catch fish at night when it's completely dark and use a penlight with a red gel over it (this doesn't work if your fish sleep under rocks though). good luck with the hippo as they are one of my favorite fish I have never had (they seem to be Ich magnets so I have sayed away from them), and you can't go wrong with a pair of percs.

 

[sgt__york]

hmm... get'n a touch worried now.. already confirmed they (cleanup crew) has gone out, and will be here in the morning.
I'm beginning to get a lot of 'conflicting' reports on CRABS.
Obviously different ppl have different experiences - but i would think species 'tendencies' should be established.
My concern is the interaction of crabs with 1) snails; 2) fish - specifially a jeuvinile blue hippo tang - who likes to lay flat beneath rocks 3) cleaner shrimp and 4) corals that will be coming in the future (going to stay w/mostly soft corals)
RE: Crabs and SNAILS - i'm being told that 'hermit' crabs tend to leave snails alone unless they are desperate for a new shell - that keeping a stock of larger sized shells will help stop that. YET others are saying they are predators and WILL hunt any snail they can find.
I'm being told that 'scarlet' crabs tend to stay on the rock - while blue legs tend to scavanage the substrate. YET others say they are all hermits and will act the same.
RE: Crabs and CLEANER SHRIMP - direct conflict - LFS said all crabs will go after shrimp - should have used more shrimp instead of crabs for a less hostile tank. In fact described it as - "get ready for civil war in the tank - war of the crabs." Yet ANOTHER person at the LFS said hermits won't mess w/cleaners, and that everyone should get along! (Sure, it isn't his tank).
RE: Juvenile blue hippo - some crab takes out my tang - he's gunna experience a new food chain level - as i'll feed him to my dog!
Someone here mentioned I might have gone overboard on quantities. Given a 75 gal, how many snails, crabs, shrimp, etc are 'general rules of thumb'??? Right now it's 40 snails, 36 crabs (see desc below or above).
I'm in great limbo about what do to about the incoming crabs. I'm sure the more ppl that respond, the MORE different and conflicting reports i'll get.. LOL BUT... practical experience speaks louder than opinion, imho.

 

[hondo]

First off don't worry about your hippo getting eaten by hermits as that would only happen if the hippo died of other causes. The only thing you need to worry about is the Sally Lightfoot or the emeralds being nasty (remember it's hit or miss with these guys). Like I said before I have had both and never had problems with either but others have so you need to watch them and see if they cause problems. Of course if they do have fun getting the sally out of the tank as he will make the damsel seem easy to catch. As for the quanties I think you are right on the money as some will not make the acclimation and will die and others will die for unknown reasons so what is left should be a good clean up crew. Everyone has different opinion about different crabs but the general concensous is that scarlets are the safest and keeping some extra shells in the tank will help a little.

 

[hondo]

Forgot about your shrimp question. I keep both cleaner and CBS in my tank with a sally and there has never been a problem. Basically if your sally and emerald are nasty they will try and take out anything they can catch if they are normal you have no worries. Never heard about crab vs shrimp war.

 

[broomer5]

I view the clean up crew ( snails and hermits ) as inexpensive janitors - I don't get too attached to them - and if you asked me how many I have in my tanks - I could not answer.
I will right an inverted Turbo if I see one struggling upside down.
I pick up a few occassionaly when I go to the lfs for supplies, and add them to the tank(s)
When setting up a new tank - I order a lot from this site.
Blue legs, reds, scarlets, all pretty much the same to me.
They fight it out on the sand and in the rockwork - as they need new shells - but I don't get to worried about it.
They eat detritus and crap on the sandbed. Good thing.
Sally's - I will never have one again. Ate coralline alage non-stop and was a mean machine.
Emeralds - great in my book - never bothered anything but algae.
Snails - What can you say bad about a snail.

 

[sgt__york]

Thanks guyz.. appreciate the info.
boomer, I tended to stay away from the turbo's as they cannot turn themselves over. The Astreas were cheap, and the other 2 (cerith and trochas) seemed to be specialties in quantity food eaten per snail and their appetite for not only algae but sino bacteria's as well. And all 3 can turn themselves over. I'm hope'n the little extra spent on these varieties will be made up for in longevity in the tank (and need for fewer replacements).
Regarding the crabs.. well.. let the games begin i guess.. LOL
i'm thinking of holding 10 blue's back - give them to a friend or hold them in the sump for a bit. I'll give it a go w/the rest of em. I had hoped for a little variety in color and species for pleasant viewing.
Crabs, snails and 2 corals coming in tomorrow.. can't wait Feeling a bit like Xmas lol
Hobby takes a lot of patience, but it's so much fun to add new things, and watch them grow
Thanks again for everyone's help, assistance, and listen'n to my ramblings of experiences and comedy