Crushed coral cleaners

[maxpain]

I am just starting at salt water fish and coral. I have a under water filter with two jets and and external filter as well. Because of the underwater filter I had to go with crushed coral instead of sand. My questions is what kind of clean up crew should I go with? Its a 55 gal, with some live rock, and crushed coral instead of sand. Also how big of a role does the crushed coral play in things; like what would be ok in a sand but not crushed coral?

 

[aarone]

well i can tell you right now, that the UGF (under gravel filter) will cause nothing but problems for you. they are ammonia and nitrate traps. Nothing can get around this. Not sure on the cleaners for CC. most people just vacuum it like gravel.
aaron

 

[wwfstyle]

This is true I did have cc in my 75 with an UGF and I had troubles with nitrates. I had to do major water changes twice as much with a vacuum hose. Yeah it looked nice but I was looking for more of a sit down and enjoy tank. I highly recommend removeing the UGF and add some LS to the tank on top of the CC. In my 75 I have about 60 lbs CC and 75 LS. All you have to do then is get a sand shifter star and hermits and maybe a few crabs. I have had this set up now for close to 3 months now. I have not yet touched the bottom of the tank. but if you stay with the CC then a sand shifter star may help some and lots of hermits. One of my favorites is a salley light foot crab. I maybe wrong on the clean up crew but that is what would start out with. Hope this helps you out some. Rick

 

[thomas712]

Although I agree with the others and have some pretty strong thoughts with regards to the UGF, I have seen people useing brittle stars, dragon gobies and other gravel/sand sifting gobies to clean the sugstrate if it isn't to large. I have even seen sand sifting stars in tanks with crushed coral and the various hermits. The best gravel cleaner of all though will be the vaccum syphon, watch out though, because your stars may be underneath the gravel and you could wind up killing them as you vaccum.
Thomas

 

[maxpain]

So the outlook looks grim. I went to aquarium place by my house, really nice and one of the higher up guys suggested this set up. Wonder why he would do that if the UGF is so bad for a salt water tank? Now I got to choose weither or not to tear everything out of the tank(should be ready for fish this tuesday if I dont) and start all over.

 

[aarone]

Originally posted by maxpain
So the outlook looks grim. I went to aquarium place by my house, really nice and one of the higher up guys suggested this set up. Wonder why he would do that if the UGF is so bad for a salt water tank? Now I got to choose weither or not to tear everything out of the tank(should be ready for fish this tuesday if I dont) and start all over.
He did that to make money. I would switch the tank to a substrate of dead and live sand.
aaron

 

[maxpain]

Well for now I have no choice, I will have to leave it in because, I dont have the $ to buy sand. But when I do take it out would I have to completely drain the tank? What would I do with the live rock I currently have in the tank? And what would I do to replace the powerheads that I have attached to the UGF, to keep the waterflow up? This is really a let down, because if I do have to drain the tank to do this I am out alot of $. Spent over a hunderd on sea salt, and crushed coral. Spent a hundred on live rock, and would have to spend more money on sand and somthing for water flow to replace the power heads.

 

[thomas712]

It can be done without losses, you can simply remove the crushed coral while it is still in the tank, you can do this over time or all at once if you like without draining the tank. If you did drain the tank you only have to put the water in tubs or buckets and when you have the crushed coral out you can put the water back in.
Then you can add the sand or soak the sand in your water from the main tank from a water change to pre season it so to speak, this would help reduce cloudiness and give it some bacteria base.
Thomas

 

[thomas712]

Kip you don't type slow but maybe could you just get back to your regular vocation? Man I want your job.
Algea green with envy.
Thomas

 

[maxpain]

Ok just want to clear a few things up here, I can remove the CC with water still in the tank, but when I add in the sand, how would I do it so that the tank doesnt get all cloudy. After I have removed all the CC, would I just put the sand on top on the UGF, because you said my powerheads could still be used, is that how they would be used? How much pounds of sand should I get for my tank, its a 55 gal, and you said to mix the said. An finnally, could my live rock be harmed in the process of all this action? Wow, lots of questions on that one.

 

[thomas712]

The idea here is to remove the UGF, never use a UGF with sand, it just will not work well, rendering the UGF even more use less.
The sand will act as a far better filtration method than the UGF in my opinion.
Thomas

 

[fshhub]

Originally posted by Kipass4130
Can you type on a message board and talk to angry customers and do secheduling all at the same time?... oh yeah.. and network troubleshoot...

Kip
i can, in fact that would be a step or 4 backwards for me, can i have it?

 

[thomas712]

With regards to the UGF. Here is my over cut, over pasted, very tired of hearing it answer the the UGF.
As for undergravel filters, I've been through this, won't go through it again. Why?
1. Frequent water changes to try to get the ditrus and nitrates out.
2. If you put live rock on it you will build up more dead ditrus spots that will pump out more nitrates in you system. This just makes them simply non reef compatible. They were meant for a crushed coral bottom and are no good with sand.
3. You run the risk of Carbon dioxide poisoning that builds up underneath.
4. Although it can help with the bioload it is only low bio load friendly.
5. With what can seep out from underneath the algea blooms can be spectacular leading to what is called New Tank Syndrome even if you think your tank is seasoned, and if you do not vaccum well you will simply reintroduce the waste back into the water colum. This can reek havoc on your water chemistry and your PH.
6. Even though you use the best strongest powerheads on it, it will just pull the waste and ditrus down into the substrate traping it till it decays and fouls your water or waits to be removed by you and the vaccum tube. Much better to use sand and good water flow to keep the ditrus in suspension in the water to be removed by the protein skimmer or machanical filtraition.
7. No matter how you slice it the UGF is just a ditrus trap. If anything deserves the name nitrate factory it is the UGF.
Just my OPINION.
Thomas

 

[thomas712]

Kip you need help there is no doubt, I recommend you hire me to take care of the computer needs. I'll post on the board and this will give you time to take care of the customers. Then when nothing is going on we can argue about water chemistry
Thomas

 

[wwfstyle]

Max you where asking about what to do with the PH from ur UGF. I went to home depot and got some pvc pipes and drilled holes on the part that is next to the sand, with an 90 degree put another piece of pvc to the desired hieth for ur PH. Just make sure you put this project up alittle from the sand like 1-3 inches. If you drill all around the pvc pipe you will create a current through ur LR and have little or no dead space. I think for my contaption may have cost $5 for my 75. You dont evan need the glue just stick together and let the water do it's thing. I'm sure other guys have different ideas on what to do with the PH. Rick

 

[appleton]

dude I have crushed oyster shells in my 125gal 2 inches deep,and no prob in 27months. just do your reg top annd water changes. have not lost anything except for seuside jumpout.