cycled tank added one fish ammonia goin up

[frogz]

my tank has cycled for a month all levels were at zero i added 3 snails and 3 hermit crabs waited a week no change in water i added a dog face puffer 3 days ago and my ammonia went from 0 to 1.0 is this normal till the tank catches up on the bio load? its a 55 gallon i have a 4 inch sand bed and 40 lbs of live rock

 

[ophiura]

How did you cycle the tank initially- what did you use to get the initial cycling ammonia spike? Just LR, shrimp?? A dogface puffer is a heck of a load on a new system. Watch your feedings. But definitely tell us how you cycled the tank initially.

 

[frogz]

i cycled the tank with 2 shrimp left them in for 5 days everything went to zero
i noticed the puffer is a messy eater i guess thats why ammonia is up

 

[benrock]

Hi Frogz,
Did your ammonia ever spike when you had the shrimp in for five days? I think you may have needed to keep the shrimp in longer than five days for an effective cycle.

 

[frogz]

i thought with the live rock and the shrimp that would have been plenty
the live rock i used stunk with all the die off

 

[puffygrrl]

It's your puffer. Same thing happened to me when my 2 month cycled tank after I added my Porcupine. He shreds the krill and bits get lodged everywhere in the LR! Within the first week my ammonia went from 0 to like 3, I was so worried and eveyone on the board kept saying that Porky's and puffers are too much of a pain because of this - I say I LOVE HIM! Anyhow, although I am sure everyone will jump on me for saying this, I solved the problem by putting a filter on the tank (I had a canister filter leftover form when the tank was freshwater). Anyhow, between that, about 25 hermits and snails and 5 gallon water changes every other week using RO water he's as happy and healthy (I won't say as a clam ) and my ammonia never gets over 0.25 unless I procrastinate on the water change. It's been up and running with him in it for over 4 months now. He'll be more work than any other fish you have, but trust me, it's worth it Good Luck!

 

[benrock]

Did you test and see a big ammonia spike after the five days? I think puffers may excrete more waste than most fish. Anyone know? I thought I read that somewhere a while back. In a good cycled tank that's not overstocked that shouldn't matter anyhow.

 

[ophiura]

They certainly are messier than other fish, and there is a tendancy to feed them more because they can eat with such gusto and have personality. No doubt that the ammonia problems were from adding this type of fish so soon, similar, IMO, to adding 4 or 5 smaller fish to a newly cycled reef system when it should be 1 at a time.
Definitely cut back on feeding, monitor the water quality closely, and try to get out pieces that are left behind. Hermits might be good to add, but don't be surprised if he eats a few.
PuffyGrrl,
I don't think anyone will be down on you for adding a filter?! I don't quite understand this. In fact, for aggressive set ups, I am still a big fan of wet/dry filters because of this exact problem. IMO, LR and LS may not be enough for an aggressive tank. I am worried though that your ammonia continues to be present if you are lax on water changes. To me, it is still a sign of a major issue that needs some sort of real solution.

 

[frogz]

i am running a wet/dry system with bioballs i will keep checking the water
i have to top off about a gallon and a half
every 3 days i guess that will help some also

 

[puffygrrl]

Ophiura: Hello again! You're always on me about my Porky We are doing great though! Since my first posting my ammonia hasn't ever got about 0.25 and I do water changes every week with RO. The filter helps the crabs with the small debris - the only reason I said people would jump on me is many don't agree with the idea of having a filter on a salt tank. Anyhow, things are working out great. I appreciate your concerns and all the help you have given.

 

[ophiura]

But you must have a filter on a salt tank The question is whether your filter is LR, LS and a refugium or skimmer and powerheads for circulation or whatever, or something like a wet/dry. If anyone gets on you for this they are confused, because everyone has some type of filter, though they may not understand the theory behind it. They might not have a mechanical or chemical filter, but they certainly have a biological filter. If not, the system will crash. My only concern is that ammonia should always be 0 in a properly set up tank. If it is not, then you are potentially heading for trouble. That is my only point. It should not take water changes to keep it in check. That is my concern, and it should be a concern. But just MO.

 

[puffygrrl]

Ophiura: I was just checking out the pics page and it's nice to put a face to a name (especially one as famous as yours on SWF ).
Anyhow, what I was saying about the filter is that I have gotten sh*t for having a "freshwater" canister filter on a salt tank instead of a sump or skimmer.
As for "Smiley Jin" I have done a ton of research on the Porky's and Puffers in general. Almost every "expert" I have spoken to has said that a tank with one usually requires a bit more cleaning maintenance than most tanks. The bits of uneaten krill get lodged in and under the rock and can cause ammonia spikes. They all suggested that bi-weekly water changes with some light sand sifting would keep everything in check.
I do appreicate and understand your concern, but I feel confidant about my methodology in taking care of him. If I do start to have any real problems, you'll be the first to know so you can say "I told you so" L8

 

[ophiura]

I have no desire to say "I told you so," and it is complete BS for people to be hard on you for having a 'freshwater' filter...just that you may need more filtration using this than using a 'saltwater' designed filter like a wet/dry. Definitely all tanks with aggressives need a bit more attention to getting the excess food out. No arguments there.