Difference between cyano and coraline please?

[dmschiff]

Can anyone please tell me the difference between coraline algae and cyano.
I know that coraline is good and cyano is bad, and that the color of coraline has a large range. I've also read that coraline is more fixed and does not easily rub off where cyano can be removed. However, I just wondered if coraline hardens over time or is formed that way.
I recently had some growth of a very deep maroon algae. ( I thought cyano is more of a bright red) If scraped it will come off ,but not extemely easily. I'm not sure if it is coraline or cyano. Some of my lr from the lfs is covered in coraline, but it is a much lighter shade of purple. After some time in my tank it darkened a little also.
Does it take time for the coraline algae to harden or does it just form that way?
Any help is appreciated---thanks!

 

[team2jndd]

Consider cyano like a blanket. Coralline is more like a rock. An encrusting algae. Suck water into a syringe. Place the tip into the patch and blast it. If it removes the patch... cyano. If not, coralline. Once you have seen both it is fairly easy to tell the difference. Have any pictures?

 

[dmschiff]

If I can remove it should I try to suction it all off? Any risk of spreading it around the tank and helping it spread? If suctioned out of tank any other steps required to rid it (other than water conditions)?
Some one told me that high phosphates cause cyano. Is this true or are they both a by product of poor water conditons?

 

[jerthunter]

cyanobacteria can be different colors, the kind I generally see is a deep maroon but since you said you had to scrape it off I doubt it is cyanobacteria. If it was cyanobacteria you should be able to brush it off, it tends to form sheets on rocks, across sand and such.
My guess would be that it is a different form of coraline, there are so many types, different colors, different forms, but if you have to scrape to remove it there is a good chance it is coraline algae.
Another difference is cyanobacteria will decline at night and come back during the day, so if the batch looks small in the morning and large at night you probablty have cyanobacteria, if it doesn't chance then it probably isn't.

 

[team2jndd]

If you want to get rid of it you can suction it/ brush it off. However, it comes as a result to dead spots (low flow areas) and poor water conditions. Also, avoid using tap water because this will more often than not cause a cyano breakout. If you increase your water flow and keep up with water changes it will eventually die out. There is also a redslime remover called slime be gone i believe. I have used it once and it worked great. I also lost my perfectly healthy clam shortly after. I have heard others say that it has had ill effects with their bi-valves as well. (clams mussels etc.)

 

[jerthunter]

Originally Posted by dmschiff
If I can remove it should I try to suction it all off? Any risk of spreading it around the tank and helping it spread? If suctioned out of tank any other steps required to rid it (other than water conditions)?
Some one told me that high phosphates cause cyano. Is this true or are they both a by product of poor water conditons?
If it is the cyanobacteria suctioning it out is best. Once it gets a foothold it can be hard to combat but I would recommend the following.
Suction as much as possible out
Turn off your lights for 2 days (your fish and corals will be ok for 2 days)
After the two days do a waterchange and suction out any visible redslime
Lastly rasie your nitates and lower your phosphates.

 

[weberian]

Raise your nitrates? Are you kidding???

 

[jerthunter]

Originally Posted by Weberian
Raise your nitrates? Are you kidding???
Nope, raising the nitrates will help keep your system phorphorus limited. Cyanobacteria can use free nitrogen so even if you have no nitrates it can thrive while the algae that normally competes dies. By having some nitrates you keep the competeing algae alive to outcompete the cyanobacteria.

 

[weberian]

That's an interesting concept, but I do not practice it, and do not have a cyano problem. Very interesting nonetheless.

 

[team2jndd]

Originally Posted by Jerthunter
Nope, raising the nitrates will help keep your system phorphorus limited. Cyanobacteria can use free nitrogen so even if you have no nitrates it can thrive while the algae that normally competes dies. By having some nitrates you keep the competeing algae alive to outcompete the cyanobacteria.
but high nitrates will just lead to other problems...

 

[jerthunter]

Originally Posted by team2jndd
but high nitrates will just lead to other problems...
Well you won't want HIGH nitrates just more nitrates compared to phosphates.

 

[team2jndd]

Water changes fix both phosphates and nitrates just keep up with them both. Cyano detritus and many others are all part of the early tank. It will go away as long as you keep up with the water quality.

 

[dmschiff]

[ By having some nitrates you keep the competeing algae alive to outcompete the cyanobacteria.
My UV steralizer is set at a flow rate to eliminate parasites/bacteria therefore it most likely eliminates most other algae. Could this be the problem? My water parameters seem to check out fine.
Ok! Must be Cyano because it did blast off with a syringe so I suctioned it off. There was about 4 patches of it on a couple rocks and some on the glass too. Funny thing is that half of it is right under wher my protein skimmer returns--don't think it is a dead spot.

 

[jerthunter]

I doubt your UV sterilizer is the problem, it only kills free floating stuff. You may want to consider growing some macroalgae in your sump or even in your display, it will help to remove nitrates and phosphates.
I personally don't agree with the statement that cyanobacteria only grows in low flow areas, it might grow better there but I have seen it growing in some relatively high flow areas. One reason it might be growing alot near your skimmer return is due to higher oxygen levels at the return of your skimmer.
I know many people don't agree with the idea of raising nitrates to lower phosphates but here is why I feel it is effective.
N is needed in might higer amounts compared to P. Approximately 16:1 if my memory is correct. If either is missing algea won't grow, neither will cyanobacteria. In a balanced system algae has the upper hand and sucks up the phosphate as it arrives, however algae does not have the ability to soak up free nitrogen so if you run out of bioavailable nitrogen (i.e. nitrate) and there is still enough phosphate left over the cyanobacteria springs into action. Once it has a foothold it has the upper hand because it can spread so fast. That is why you want to suck it up and turn off your lights for a couple days, this knocks it back down to its place and lets the algae get the upper hand again. Raising nitrates is the last step because this makes sure that phosphates are low. The problem with phosphate it that it is needed in very low amounts, far below what most test kits measure and it is constantly being added and removed as things grow or die.

 

[rambomessiah]

I had a serious cyano problem in my fuge. I sucked as much out as frequently as I could with a turkey baster.I added a power head to increase flow and did large weekly water changes after about a month it was pretty much gone. My nitrates were nil. Just my recent experience.