Do you ever feel guilty?

[lukeb321]

Somewhat new to this side of fish keeping, been keeping freshwater for over 15 years. I bred angels for years and always tried to keep perfect conidtions for my stock (both parents and fry). I became very interesting in keeping wild angels (altums) but after doing a lot of research and found they were very hard to keep, I decided that maybe I wasnt "supposed" to keep them.
Anyway I always looked at whats born in the wild was born there for a reason. Now that Im starting a saltwater tank, Im thinking about what these fish must have gone through just for our pleasure and at what success rate?
And those that say they "successfully" keep saltwater fish, well is it successful if thier lifespan is shorten by many years.
I also walked through 2 lfs today and saw many dead fish on the bottom. If there was no demand (us) would these fish have died an early death?
Im not here to make anyone feel bad or guilty, just stating some facts (unless you can prove otherwise). Just wanted to know how you think/feel/justify this hobby.
With that said Im still not sure if Im ready to start keeping saltwater fish.
Im VERY open to all ideas.

 

[fedukeford]

Originally Posted by lukeb321
Somewhat new to this side of fish keeping, been keeping freshwater for over 15 years. I bred angels for years and always tried to keep perfect conidtions for my stock (both parents and fry). I became very interesting in keeping wild angels (altums) but after doing a lot of research and found they were very hard to keep, I decided that maybe I wasnt "supposed" to keep them.
Anyway I always looked at whats born in the wild was born there for a reason. Now that Im starting a saltwater tank, Im thinking about what these fish must have gone through just for our pleasure and at what success rate?
And those that say they "successfully" keep saltwater fish, well is it successful if thier lifespan is shorten by many years.
I also walked through 2 lfs today and saw many dead fish on the bottom. If there was no demand (us) would these fish have died an early death?
Im not here to make anyone feel bad or guilty, just stating some facts (unless you can prove otherwise). Just wanted to know how you think/feel/justify this hobby.
With that said Im still not sure if Im ready to start keeping saltwater fish.
Im VERY open to all ideas.
if you are really that worried about shortineng fish lives, and captureing from the wild, try getting tank bred fish, it will limit your options A TON, but it would be best

 

[corally]

Originally Posted by fedukeford
if you are really that worried about shortineng fish lives, and captureing from the wild, try getting tank bred fish, it will limit your options A TON, but it would be best

 

[lukeb321]

Thanks I might just do that. Couple clowns, a Fridmani Pseudochromis, and a Luther's Watchman Goby. All tank bred.

 

[corally]

Originally Posted by lukeb321
Thanks I might just do that. Couple clowns, a Fridmani Pseudochromis, and a Luther's Watchman Goby. All tank bred.

That helps me with my guilt! :happyfish

 

[kleinn]

I had some of the same reservations before I decided to switch to salt (only a few months ago). I've had everything from live-breeders to dutch-style tanks and discus with fresh, but the salt was too much to resist. I've decided to purchase only aquacultured corals, but as far as fish and inverts go....
Here's the way I see it: When I eat a salmon steak hot off the grill, or down a tuna sandwich, or order fried shrimp at a restaurant, I'm not feeling guilty. That doesn't mean I don't really appreciate or respect that animal. Possibly, I respect and appreciate that animal even more so becuase it has a very tangable and immediate benefit for me. It may seem like justification, but that respect and appreciation is even more acute in the home aquarium setting. I will really enjoy, and learn from, these animals- as will all my friends and family- people who may otherwise never be exposed to these beautiful creatures in their life time. These animals are essentially ambassadors for their species, and ultimately the complex oceanic ecosystems they represent. I will make every effort to keep my tank clean and safe for the animals I select out of habit and respect. Wether the fish and inverts themselves have any contemplations of a deficient life experience because they end up in a fish tank instead of the open ocean, I'm not sure. But I do know that the spirit in which I keep them is one of awe, respect and appreciation, and for me that's enough.

 

[merredeth]

I really don't feel much guilt about saltwater fishkeeping.
The main reason I don't feel guilt is my grandkids and step-kids are learning a lot about the ocean by seeing my tanks.
For example, last night neither my niece or step-daughter ever saw a clam bury itself in the substrate. They thought clams were only for eating but have since learned that God intended them to clean up the ocean floor due to how they prevent nite problems.
I live in Iowa and we go to Key West each year so we can enjoy the ocean, but many of the fish that I have in my tanks aren't native to the Keys and the kids won't be doing any scuba diving with me.
When I take care of the tanks or pick out a new addition for the tanks, everyone does some form of research or learns something from my research. The kids have taken more of an interest in science, as they see this requires a certain amount of scientific knowledge. In my home, the tanks are not just about enjoyment but about education and when it comes to education, kids and adults learn better when they observe the lesson, process or action, rather than just reading about something.
That's my 2¢ and opinion on saltwater fish keeping.
Denise M.

 

[fishy7]

Well said Denise.
I have 2 nephews that come to my house all the time. They run up to the tank and just stare and ask a bunch of questions. They have seen star fish, crabs, snails and fish just doing what they do in the wild. I know they have learned so much and have a very strong interest in general.
I feel guilt if I do somehthing directly that impacts their life span. Example: Not keeping with water changes, poor feeding habilts, acclimation...... It's the responsibility of the aquarist to ensure their success every way possible.

 

[stang5_o]

Also, if you think about it, in a well cared for tank, what does a fish or other creature have to worry about? No predators, readily available food that is chosen for each different creatures needs. IMO i think we do the fish a favor. That is however if we go by the rules and dont put them in crowded small tanks, and that we care for them and keep the tanks clean and the water quality good.

 

[dogstar]

There all ways going to be different positions on everything and all depends on your own emotions really. Many people on both sides like members of PETA dont want anything collected and there are many who dont care. They want it and dont research and dont care if it dies, " it's just a fish ", they just go buy something else.
The industry kills alot of animals from bad collection methods and collecting types that cant survives in captivity also. There are laws that protect some species in some countries and its getting better but there will all ways be the one to break these laws because there will all ways be people that want the species for themselves.
' Ignorance kills as well. ' Research, research
All depends on how you feel about it and to what limits you willing to go as to provideing a proper system with proper tankmates and proper care, ect. You will have to live with your self even if the fish cant.

 

[psusocr1]

also those fish on the bottom of the tank that you think are "dead" might not be. ALOT of saltwater fish play dead when in a new environment for while until they acclimate and get comfortable!

 

[crimzy]

Luke, you make an excellent point. We all know, or should know, that by placing these beautiful creatures in confined environments, we are compromising their comfort and possibly their happiness. We should accept that and realize that we are ALL keeping fish for selfish reasons... they are for OUR pleasure not their own well-being. That being said, I guess the goal is to provide the best possible environment that we are able. By making sure the fish appears fat and healthy looking... by making sure it's a good eater and lives in a suitable environment, we do the best we can.
Let's not pretend that we are looking out for the fish's best interests by keeping them in our tanks. But we love the challenge and rewards of trying to maintain them so we overlook the disservice we are doing to the fish. Anyone who argues that they are better off in an aquarium than in the ocean is kidding themselves. So be it... not the only example of people using animals for our needs or entertainment.

 

[merredeth]

Originally Posted by FISHY7
Well said Denise.
I feel guilt if I do somehthing directly that impacts their life span. Example: Not keeping with water changes, poor feeding habilts, acclimation...... It's the responsibility of the aquarist to ensure their success every way possible.

I agree, if I was to become less than diligent on the care of the my tanks, then I too would feel guilty.
I think at some time, we all become guilty of this crime. However, the lessons learned through hurting our wallet and the creatures themselves usually will make a conscientious hobbyist out of them or they will get out of the hobby completely.
Denise M.