Does this sound right? (sump)

[zx636r]

I'm in the middle of putting a sump on my tank and wanted to get your opinions before I got any further. The tank is 30 gallons, I have a penguin 330 hob filter, an aquac romera skimmer, stealth heater, 15 pounds of regular marine sand with 10 pounds of live sand on top, and 20 pounds of live rock. I bought a 15G tall tank to put under my main tank and use it to hide my filter, skimmer, heater, and to just add some more water volume. I mixed salt and 12 gallons of water in the new sump, set the temp and I'm letting it run for a few days to get the water correct before I introduce it to my tank. I didn't fill it up all the way (3 gallons short) so if the power ever goes out the main tank can drain off and break the siphon before things over flow. I also plan on putting some live sand and live rock in there to help with filteration. I haven't purchased my overflow box yet but I was thinking of a CPR with the "aqua lifter" so the siphon will (hopefully) restart in a power outage. Sorry for the (more than likely) confusing post but I was just wanting to get some opinions and see if I was missing anything. Thanks for your time.
Also, if the overflow box is 300 gph, would a 300 gph power head be enough to act as a sump pump? Thanks again

 

[murph]

Sounds like you are on your way but here are a few suggestions.
Power heads are not designed for pushing water up hill. This distance that the pump must push the water back up to your main tank is referred to as "head". For this I would buy a submersible box type pump. There are many brands, quite one, mag drive, surge etc. On the back of the box will be a graph showing what the pump will produce gallon per hour wise at various heads. Calculate the distance it has to pump back up to your main tank and shoot for max flow, which is the GPH capability of your overflow box.
I have no personal experience with CPR overflows but like seaclone skimmers I have never heard a good word about them. For less money I bet you could get your basic U tube type overflow which is what I use and are vary reliable and go with 600 GPH per hour. The return from your sump pump can then be split off to various parts of your main tank and eliminate a few power heads. Make sure there is a small hole drilled in your return plumbing at water level of your main tank to break any back flow siphon created in the main plumbing return in case of power outage. The U tubes in the overflow boxes will hold siphon when power is loss and the system should have no problems starting back up as normal when power returns.
I would also suggest that you buy another container to slide down into your 15 gallon sump. Maybe a ten gallon tank. This is basically a lazy mans baffling system. This second container will be your skimmer house. Direct the flow from your main tank unfiltered into this container. Water will then overflow from there into your main sump. What this does is give the skimmer a constant water level and immune from any upsets from water top offs and evaporation loss which leads to more efficient skimming and no need for the skimmer to "recover" when water changes are made.
After it is all set up fill the sump to capacity and start your plumbing. The water level in the sump should drop and needs to drop below the top of your "skimmer house". Water will then begin to return to your sump, enter into your skimmer container and then overflow to your main sump. Give it a few minutes to settle in and then take note of your sumps water level. To play it safe draw a line an inch below this level and that is your top off level.
I hope I explained that clearly. If not let me know and I will get some batteries for the camera tonight and post a pick. A picture is worth a thousand words and should make it pretty obvious what I am talking about.

 

[milomlo]

Well i would like to see a picture. I am researching sumps/refugs for a 120 I will be getting soon.
I have no idea what to do. I have a 29 gallon now and everything is HOB.

 

[murph]

Ok I will post some pics tonight after work.

 

[zx636r]

Murph, I REALLY appreciate your help. I'm going to take your advice on the CPR and look for a u-tube overflow. You aren't the first person that suggested getting something with a u tube rather than "tubeless". Thanks again for the help, that cleared things up for me.
One more question, when you drill the hole in the u tube. Am I correct in assumming that the hole needs to be drilled right below the water line, so it's covered during normal operation and exposed during an outage (hence breaking the siphon)
Thanks again Murph!

 

[murph]

You don't want to drill a hole in the U tube in your overflow box. That is the siphon that you don't want breaking when power goes out!!!
Use PVC to hard plumb from your return pump that is in the main part of the sump. You cant see the return pump from the pic here but it is in the upper right hand corner. Where the return PVC from the pump enters your display tank drill a small hole in the PVC at your display tanks water level water level or slightly above. Some water will come out of this hole so make sure it is going into your display tank. What happens in the case of power outage is a siphon effect can be produced from you display tank down to your sump and this hole will allow air in and break that siphon.
It will be apparent how the U tub in your overflow box works when you purchase it and once again do not drill any holes in this tub.
The picture here is of my "poor mans" sump and by no means is the only way to go about things and others may chime in with some other ideas.

 

[zx636r]

Thank you again Murph. Now I understand where to drill the hole and why to drill the hole I just don't fully understand how it works to help with an outage. Thats the way I am though, I'm the nerdy type that will sit down and take stuff apart until I figure out how it works, lol. It's not from a lack of your explaining, you have done an excellent job. I bet once I get all the parts in it will make more sense to me. Do you have a good picture of the return from your sump into your display tank where you can see the hole and all that good stuff. Thanks again for all the help.

 

[murph]

Cant get a good pic of my return line to the main tank without moving some stuff but this might help.
Like you said once you get all the parts on hand and see them it should be pretty easy to figure. If you get a U tube type overflow you may be scratching your head on how to get the siphon initiated in the U tube part of the over flow. Make sure the overflow is full of water on drain side and tank side and slide a piece of air line tubing up through the U tube and suck out all the air. Once you start up your plumbing if any air bubbles start to accumulate in the U tube your pump is not strong enough and enough air will eventually gather to break that siphon and your looking at cleaning up some water off the floor so make sure your return pumps up to par.
After the system is running simulate a power outage by unplugging the return pump. The small hole you drilled in the return line will suck a bunch of air and you will know exactly why you drilled it there