DSB questions, including how quickly should you thicken a sandbed up to make it DSB?

hairtrigger

hairtrigger

Active Member
My sandbed right now is about an inch and a half maybe. I am trying to get it to about 4, maybe 5 inches. How quickly should I add new layers?
Should I add them at about an inch per addition?
Also, DSB's only start being effective at 4 inches right, anything under that is pointless except if you want to breed nitrates right?
 
ags

ags

Member
I thought if your tank was established and you added say another 2 inches on top of an existing 1 inch dsb the tank would experience a spike and mini cycle? Don't have anything to base this on other than posts that I have read. Is this wrong?
 
nicenakago

nicenakago

Member
It may have been a coincidence... but I did experience that myself.
Another reason to add it slowly would be to give smaller life a chance to escape being burried alive.
Think about how hard it would be to get out your front door if you were snowed in 10' vs. 1'
The bacteria on the portion of the rock that you bury WILL die. but if there are amphipods or sand dwelling snails, or anything else that can't survive under more than a 1/4" of sand... I would add maybe 2 cups a day... spread out evenly.
 
benj420

benj420

Member
I've been adding about a 1/2 inch per week to my 20 gallon and it seems to handle it OK. Any more than that and the ammonia spikes.
Also, I use a canning funnel and the large tube from my syphon to minimize clouding. Put the syphon tube in the tank and rest one end on the bottom. Put the funnel in the other end and pour a cup or two of sand into the funnel/tube. I wait for a minute or two for it to settle in the tube and slowly pull the tube upwards. I get much less clouding this way. Then, when I'm ready in a week to do the next layer, I spread out what's left of the mounds of sand and start the next layer. Works for me.
The above method is for dry sand. In theory, you could do LS all at once, but i agree with the previous statement that you may be killing off some of the critters that can't dig themselves out of 5 inches of sand.
 
brianf01

brianf01

Member
I think he is adding it on top of live sand.
I did the same thing, but got impatient and just added about 2 inches at once to my refugium. It probably wasnt too good, but after about a month everything was back to normal.
You could try mixing it with the live stuff if you add a bunch at once. I had to transfer 40 lbs of live sand to my new tank, it seemed like after a month all the worms and whatnot were as good as new, and the sandbed was totally mixed and mushed around. I am no expert, but it seems that animals like this live in a place where sand is constantly moved and piled on and blown away. I would think a couple inches would be ok. Now if it is the optimum way to do it, I dont know.
Is it true less than 4 inches is a nitrate factory???!
 
benj420

benj420

Member
I'm not sure about this one, but I fear that it will cover up all the good stuff too deep to survive. I could be wrong, but everywhere I've read if you are setting up a new tank with some dry and some LS, you always put the LS on top.
Bang Guy, where are you when we need you? I know you will have the answer for this.
 
bang guy

bang guy

Moderator

Originally posted by Benj420
Bang Guy, where are you when we need you? I know you will have the answer for this.
Most sand critters can crawl through 1/2" of sand on stored energy. I would give a week between layers. If you're adding all live sand (not recommended) you might as well pour it all in at once unless you're going to buy it 1/2" at a time.
For dry sand this is my recommendation:
pour a couple-few gallons of used tank water in a 5 gal bucket (or larger). Slowly pour in dry sand until the sand level is just under the water level. Feed the sand some flake food (honest) and stir it in. Stir it every day for a week and then add the appropriate amount to your sand bed. If you need to do more than a bucket at a time then use two or three buckets.
What this does:
This will coat the sand grains with bacteria. The bacterial coating will lessen the sandstorm effect when you add the sand to your bed. It will also make it easier for your existing sandbed infaune to crawl through the sand.
For agagonite based sand this is vitally important!!! Uncoated aragonite sand grains are a perfect site for Calcium precipitation. If the Calcium in the water precipitates onto the sand grains many undesireables will happen. Your Ca level will plummet to below 350ppm, Your ALK level may go to less than 1 Meg/L, your PH will drop significantly, and any "dust" that settles can form a hard cement like shell wherever it accululates. This shell can kill your live rock and smother your sandbed causing a crash.
Don't panic... Aragonite that has been coated by bacteria is harmless, even if ingested or passed through the gills of your fish.
 
katara

katara

Member
Less than 2 weeks ago I had the chance to buy live sand for $1 a lb.Since I only had about 2 inch sand base I added it in my tank cupfull by cupfull(16oz.),all 40 lbs of it! After the first couple of cupfulls my tank became so cloudy I coudn't see where it was all going so I just dropped it in by the front glass(and I had removed all the corals from the ground up to higher land.It took about 10 hrs for the water to clear up and once it did I replaced the corals and gently evened out the sand.By the next day every hermit,shrimp,etc was accounted for..Good luck!
 
entice59

entice59

Active Member
i want to add more sand into my tank but if i add new sand on top of old sand in my tank... wouldnt that be bad? since im just overlapping crap? should i stir it up?
 
hairtrigger

hairtrigger

Active Member
Bang... people keep telling me you are supposed to vaccum the top layer of the DSB to remove straight fish crap. True, or not?
 
fshhub

fshhub

Active Member
NEVER EVER STIR OR VACCUUM a DSB, jsut an opinion, and one that I would stake a crash on.
chances are, it will give you more headaches than it is worth, and even if it did not, YOuw ould only be removing and killing all the stuff you don't want to. The crap is food for the stuff in the bed anyhow, Let it there!
 
hairtrigger

hairtrigger

Active Member
Bang... I am going to follow your advice about using dry sand and putting it in a bucket with some flake food. Thanks. Sounds like good stuff to me. :D
And as far as vaccuming the top layer of the DSB... I won't do that. But, what removes the fish crap? Basically, just have a killer clean up crew of hermits, brittles, snails, etc?
:cool:
 
hairtrigger

hairtrigger

Active Member
"Yes hairtrigger... that is excactly what you need to maintain a deep sand bed. That's it and no more... a killer clean up crew."
Did I just answer my own question correctly? WHY CAN'T YALL BE AWAKE ALL NIGHT LIKE ME? I NEED ANSWERS PEOPLE. AND I NEED EM NOW. :D
Not really, I am still at work. But, I am curious. :cool:
 
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