Fish Dying After 1 month

[pstone7972]

I have a marine aquarium that I started July17th. Everytime I buy a fish it last 1 month almost to the day and dies. the only fish that has lived through it all is our coral beauty. Presently I have a coral beauty and a clown that looks as if its going to die. Its swimming vertically and running into the rock. Any suggestions. Ph is 8.2 nitirites 0 ammonia 0 and nitrates are 40. I have been told the 40 isnt bad for nitrates. I have a protein skimmer that I had off for 1 week because I had problems with it. Also we have a marineland filter. its a 26 gallon tank. any suggestions? also snails die after 1 - 2 weeks in this tank. please help!
~Frustrated Marine Tank Owner

 

[rotarymagic]

Originally Posted by pstone7972
http:///forum/post/2841633
I have a marine aquarium that I started July17th. Everytime I buy a fish it last 1 month almost to the day and dies. the only fish that has lived through it all is our coral beauty. Presently I have a coral beauty and a clown that looks as if its going to die. Its swimming vertically and running into the rock. Any suggestions. Ph is 8.2 nitirites 0 ammonia 0 and nitrates are 40. I have been told the 40 isnt bad for nitrates. I have a protein skimmer that I had off for 1 week because I had problems with it. Also we have a marineland filter. its a 26 gallon tank. any suggestions? also snails die after 1 - 2 weeks in this tank. please help!
~Frustrated Marine Tank Owner
40 is pretty high... IMO.. I keep my tanks at 0 and if I get really lazy, they may go to 10ppm.
What is the alkalinity at? Are you using tap water? if so, is it dechlorinated?
How much liverock do you have in the tank? What kind of sand did you use?
Has copper ever been dosed in the tank?

 

[pstone7972]

Salt level is 1.020 im using RO water, about 10lbs of live rock and a mix of live sand and regular sand. Never have used copper in the tank. My coral beauty looks awsome but nothing else ever last more than a month. I have lost 2 damsels about 20 snails and 1 hermit crab. How do you keep your nitrates at 0, I do water changes every week and cant get them that low.
Originally Posted by Rotarymagic
http:///forum/post/2841653
40 is pretty high... IMO.. I keep my tanks at 0 and if I get really lazy, they may go to 10ppm.
What is the alkalinity at? Are you using tap water? if so, is it dechlorinated?
How much liverock do you have in the tank? What kind of sand did you use?
Has copper ever been dosed in the tank?

 

[rotarymagic]

Originally Posted by pstone7972
http:///forum/post/2841661
Salt level is 1.020 im using RO water, about 10lbs of live rock and a mix of live sand and regular sand. Never have used copper in the tank. My coral beauty looks awsome but nothing else ever last more than a month. I have lost 2 damsels about 20 snails and 1 hermit crab. How do you keep your nitrates at 0, I do water changes every week and cant get them that low.
Try this...
ditch the marineland filter i.e. nitrate trap (ever notice how the biowheel never really gets clean? it's trapping nutrients)
get some good powerheads.. take the fish back to the LFS.
If you collected random sand i.e. your regular sand and its not designed for use in a sw aquarium, you may as well take all the live rock out, siphon the water into the buckets with live rock& a powerhead for each bucket, and dump all the sand out... hose the tank to clean it out since random playsand may have harmful heavy metals in it...
Get another 25lbs of liverock. buy all established live sand or make half your sand bed from new sand out of a bag of aragonite based sand. Make the layer about 1-2inches deep.
Put all the live rock in there. Fill tank, get specific gravity to 1.025 and use a refractometer to check as a hydrometer is not very accurate. Let the tank recycle and start again.
After the cycle is done, get a refugium going, you may need to get some sort of hang on the back unit to grow chaeto or impliment a turf scrubber on the tank to export inorganic nitrate and phosphate (testable stuff) into either macroalgae (chaeto) in a "fuge" or turf microalgae with the scrubber setup. This will keep nitrates&phosphates low or untestable.
Best of luck, sorry for the novel.

 

[pstone7972]

wow I appreciate your help but you went way over my head, im a moron when it comes to this whole fish tank world. The sand I have in it was from a pet store. It was all meant for an aquarium. I hate to start over because I have a coral beuty that is doing well. Do you check anything other than what I check? I use a API test kit, is this sufficient or should I get a better one? I have a power head already In my tank I forgot to say that.
Originally Posted by Rotarymagic
http:///forum/post/2841677
Try this...
ditch the marineland filter i.e. nitrate trap (ever notice how the biowheel never really gets clean? it's trapping nutrients)
get some good powerheads.. take the fish back to the LFS.
If you collected random sand i.e. your regular sand and its not designed for use in a sw aquarium, you may as well take all the live rock out, siphon the water into the buckets with live rock& a powerhead for each bucket, and dump all the sand out... hose the tank to clean it out since random playsand may have harmful heavy metals in it...
Get another 25lbs of liverock. buy all established live sand or make half your sand bed from new sand out of a bag of aragonite based sand. Make the layer about 1-2inches deep.
Put all the live rock in there. Fill tank, get specific gravity to 1.025 and use a refractometer to check as a hydrometer is not very accurate. Let the tank recycle and start again.
After the cycle is done, get a refugium going, you may need to get some sort of hang on the back unit to grow chaeto or impliment a turf scrubber on the tank to export inorganic nitrate and phosphate (testable stuff) into either macroalgae (chaeto) in a "fuge" or turf microalgae with the scrubber setup. This will keep nitrates&phosphates low or untestable.
Best of luck, sorry for the novel.

 

[rotarymagic]

I think API test kits an inaccurate, but they are cheap and do ballpark..
Salifert and Tunze kits, while not cheap are extremely accurate.
I check for ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, phosphates, pH, alkalinity daily when starting a new tank.
Make sure your alkalinity is high enough too..
You really need alot more rock too for biofiltration and there may not be enough oxygen in your tank... Try hooking up a surface skimmer to one of the powerheads to draw from the water surface and blast it below the waterline. There's alot of possibilities with why your tank isn't doing well. These are all a start.
What kind of heater are you running and what are tank temps day and night?

 

[pstone7972]

I keep the temp at 76F all the time. Its just a generic heater that came with the tank. how do you get your nitrates down? im just so frustrated and I shouldnt be. I want my fish to live!!!
Originally Posted by Rotarymagic
http:///forum/post/2841694
I think API test kits an inaccurate, but they are cheap and do ballpark..
Salifert and Tunze kits, while not cheap are extremely accurate.
I check for ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, phosphates, pH, alkalinity daily when starting a new tank.
Make sure your alkalinity is high enough too..
You really need alot more rock too for biofiltration and there may not be enough oxygen in your tank... Try hooking up a surface skimmer to one of the powerheads to draw from the water surface and blast it below the waterline. There's alot of possibilities with why your tank isn't doing well. These are all a start.
What kind of heater are you running and what are tank temps day and night?

 

[lion_crazz]

The first thing I would want to figure out is why you have 40 ppm nitrates. That is probably what is causing you the most problems.
I did not see it asked. What kind of water are you using?
The snails die because of the salt level being too low, by the way. Shoot for about 1.025.

 

[pstone7972]

The nitrates are that high because I cant get them lower. Any suggestions? I use RO water. The 1.025 is what is has been and I recently lowered it to the 1.020 at the recommendation of a marine fish store. Im new to this so trying to figure out what to do. My clown fish is basically dead now, lying on the bottom gasping for air. the coral is acting just fine.
Originally Posted by lion_crazz
http:///forum/post/2841705
The first thing I would want to figure out is why you have 40 ppm nitrates. That is probably what is causing you the most problems.
I did not see it asked. What kind of water are you using?
The snails die because of the salt level being too low, by the way. Shoot for about 1.025.

 

[majestic987]

hi sorry to hear of your loss. Now that it has happened, have any of the dying fish had any skin spots, salt speckles, any noticeable markings on their bodies. It sounds to me like you may have a host for parasites (the coral beauty), he may have a healthy enough immune system to not show signs however he could be carrying them for all your newly introduced fish. Nitrates are also very easy to control by making a refugium, research them. Use chadeo macro algae and your nitrates will drop and stay low. Do this before you try any new fish, also pay attention for spots if you have ich in your tank every newfish will get it when introduced

 

[rotarymagic]

Originally Posted by pstone7972
http:///forum/post/2841712
The nitrates are that high because I cant get them lower. Any suggestions? I use RO water. The 1.025 is what is has been and I recently lowered it to the 1.020 at the recommendation of a marine fish store. Im new to this so trying to figure out what to do. My clown fish is basically dead now, lying on the bottom gasping for air. the coral is acting just fine.
Quit listening to that store, they're giving you bad info if they're telling you to lower salinity when you're trying to also keep inverts.
Get more established rock in that tank! ...get it out of a longterm running tank and put it in yours, ditch that biowheel and any mechanical filter. they trap nitrates and phosphates.
Run a lit refugium, I don't think you understand the concept of a turf scrubber, so we'll keep it simple.
something like a CPR aquafuge will work where it has a pump that pumps water into a hang on the back water vessel that has macroalgae in it (chaeto!) and has a light on the top... run the light on a schedule that is reverse from your display tank light i.e. DT light on, fuge light off.
Raise the tank temp. Keep the tank at 80F. It should help.
Do you have any full tank shots? (FTS for future reference)

 

[pstone7972]

none of my fish have had any signs of physical disease. this am the clown was swimming just fine and this evening was on its death bed. If the coral beauty is a host what do you suggest. she looks just fine, no ick or anything present to the eye. I googled chadeo macro algae and didnt see anything. is there another name for it? Do you agree in raising the temp to 80 F? no im over buying fish and them dying. I dont know how long to wait though, I guess ill try and get my levels perfect before getting any new fish.
Originally Posted by majestic987
http:///forum/post/2841727
hi sorry to hear of your loss. Now that it has happened, have any of the dying fish had any skin spots, salt speckles, any noticeable markings on their bodies. It sounds to me like you may have a host for parasites (the coral beauty), he may have a healthy enough immune system to not show signs however he could be carrying them for all your newly introduced fish. Nitrates are also very easy to control by making a refugium, research them. Use chadeo macro algae and your nitrates will drop and stay low. Do this before you try any new fish, also pay attention for spots if you have ich in your tank every newfish will get it when introduced

 

[rotarymagic]

Originally Posted by pstone7972
http:///forum/post/2841746
none of my fish have had any signs of physical disease. this am the clown was swimming just fine and this evening was on its death bed. If the coral beauty is a host what do you suggest. she looks just fine, no ick or anything present to the eye. I googled chadeo macro algae and didnt see anything. is there another name for it? Do you agree in raising the temp to 80 F? no im over buying fish and them dying. I dont know how long to wait though, I guess ill try and get my levels perfect before getting any new fish.
it's called Chaeto..
Misspellings hurt everyone.
I run my reefs at 81F.
You need more rock and to ditch that biowheel seriously.. and any mechanical filtration.
post up some full tank shot pics so we can see what your powerhead situation looks like and the rock too.

 

[pstone7972]

Attached is my aquarium, it needs work I know, suggestions? for christmas im getting the special lights.

 

[rotarymagic]

more ESTABLISHED rock should be added to the tank, about 25lbs should suffice. do not buy uncured/recently "cured" rock or it will send the tank back into a huge cycle and most likely kill off all the inhabitants.
Sand bed looks ok.
Raise tank temp.. I'd recommend getting a surface skimmer hooked to a power head and ditching the filter you currently have unless you can mod it into some sort of fuge like can be done with aquaclear 110s..
What kind of powerhead are you running? I just see a blue intake and then some sort of flared outflow on the far right...

 

[rotarymagic]

a CPR aquafuge looks like this, but I think one's with skimmers built in suck... that skimmer is terrible.

the one without the skimmer for the large size is around 180bucks new or so... if you can build one yourself or have one built, you'd save alot of money..

 

[pstone7972]

The thing on the far right is a deltec protein skimmer and under the clear this in an aqua clear air head. the filter is a marineland for a 100 gallon tank. i was told to over clean and you cant go wrong. I was told the mariland filter is good because you can put all sorts of media in it. by looking at rock in a store can you tell if its cured or not?
Originally Posted by Rotarymagic
http:///forum/post/2841805
more ESTABLISHED rock should be added to the tank, about 25lbs should suffice. do not buy uncured/recently "cured" rock or it will send the tank back into a huge cycle and most likely kill off all the inhabitants.
Sand bed looks ok.
Raise tank temp.. I'd recommend getting a surface skimmer hooked to a power head and ditching the filter you currently have unless you can mod it into some sort of fuge like can be done with aquaclear 110s..
What kind of powerhead are you running? I just see a blue intake and then some sort of flared outflow on the far right...

 

[rotarymagic]

Originally Posted by pstone7972
http:///forum/post/2841820
The thing on the far right is a deltec protein skimmer and under the clear this in an aqua clear air head. the filter is a marineland for a 100 gallon tank. i was told to over clean and you cant go wrong. I was told the mariland filter is good because you can put all sorts of media in it. by looking at rock in a store can you tell if its cured or not?
buy rock that's covered in coralline algae.. coralline algae does not live well in a cycling tank i.e. ammonia spike, nitrite spike, nitrate spike..
With the marineland filter, if it has a biowheel, toss that. Add a bag of carbon (chemipure works and you may also want to add a bag of purigen) and then a bag of rowaphos for the meantime till you get a fuge going. Is your deltec skimmer dialed in correctly? seems strange that you'd get ridiculous nitrates like that when running a good skimmer and changing water... how much are you feeding and how often?

 

[ophiura]

So if I understand correctly, you are saying the fish is fine in the morning, and dead by night? What other fish have you lost? Had this always been the same pattern? How long have you had the coral beauty?
Did you do any cleaning around the house today? Any painting or carpet cleaners or anything? Alternatively have you done things like that maybe 2 or 3 days before your fish losses?
IMO, nitrates at 40 are not great - but its not fatal either. At least not suddenly fatal. I've worked with fish only systems at 150+ nitrates and they are fine...it is chronic diseases that I would be concerned about there.
No signs of nipped fins or anything on the dying fish?

 

[pstone7972]

that is correct no physical signs of the fish being sick. I have had the coral beauty since august and we got the tank in july. Havent used any cleaning products around the tank. the coral did have what looked like a white hole in the side about a month ago but that has healed up nicely. the clown fish was acting normal swimming around and by evening was on its death bed. Im at a loss of what to do, I have been told so many different things.
Originally Posted by ophiura
http:///forum/post/2841843
So if I understand correctly, you are saying the fish is fine in the morning, and dead by night? What other fish have you lost? Had this always been the same pattern? How long have you had the coral beauty?
Did you do any cleaning around the house today? Any painting or carpet cleaners or anything? Alternatively have you done things like that maybe 2 or 3 days before your fish losses?
IMO, nitrates at 40 are not great - but its not fatal either. At least not suddenly fatal. I've worked with fish only systems at 150+ nitrates and they are fine...it is chronic diseases that I would be concerned about there.
No signs of nipped fins or anything on the dying fish?