Frogspawn problem, please help!!

[fishphreak]

Last night my frogspawn was looking kinda funny.
One of it's tentacles looked very dark and bloated.
Now that entire branch is closed up. I have no idea what might be wrong or what to do about.
I have a picture, I hope that will help.
I would be greatful for any advice or suggestions.
Thanks so much,
Jessica

 

[007]

that to me looks like its dying, and has been for a while based on the picture above.
Whats your set up like?
What conditions is the coral in?
How long have you had it?
What are your water parameters?
What else is around the coral?
Need lots more info to be of help.

 

[fishphreak]

I didn't know what info might be needed.
First of all, I have had it for about 6 months.
When I first got it I think it got an infection because I dropped it on the rocks a few times trying to get it in place.
2 of the branches got really dark and discentagrated. So I cut of the branches. That all happended about 6 months ago.
Since then it has looked great..fully expanded, good color, basically looks just like it did in the store when I bought it.
So for the past 5 months the 2 remaining branches have look great. Until last night.
Then all of a sudden last night it looked like that picture.
The coral is sitting on a piece of PVC pipe about 2 inches from the bottom of the tank.
Here is pic of my tank...maybe that will help
Other coral in the tank:
green open brain coral
pipe organ coral
ricordea mushroom
This is my equipment:
2x55 10k PC lighting
1 maxi-jet 400 PH and one other power head but I can't remember which one.
60 gallon power filter (don't remember the brand)
seaclone 100 skimmer
Tank reading:
Temp: 79
PH: 8.2
Ammonia: 0
Nitrites: 0
Nitrate: 20ppm (still working on bringing them down)
Calcium: 380
Alk: 10 KH
I know the trates are high but I am doing water changes to bring them down. And I have a major cyano problem as you can see from the pic but I have tried and tried to get rid of it.
I haven't bothered upgrading the equipment because my 75 gallon will be ready in about 2 months and I am just trying to hold this tank together until then.
I will probably get some Chemi-Clean tomorrow to help with the cyano. I didn't want to have to use anything like that but I have done everything else I know to do and nothing is working. Maybe it is my skimmer and the cc substrate working against me.
Oh, and I only use RO water.
Let me know if I left out anything.
Thanks again,
Jessica

 

[fishphreak]

I know my tank looks bad but it wasn't meant to be pretty. It was just a test tank to be sure I could keep everything alive and well and was able to take care of the inhabitants before upgrading to a better tank.
Jessica

 

[fishphreak]

anything I can do?

 

[007]

Originally posted by FishPhreak
I know my tank looks bad but it wasn't meant to be pretty. It was just a test tank to be sure I could keep everything alive and well and was able to take care of the inhabitants before upgrading to a better tank.
Jessica
I actually think that your tank looks fine. It looks like a new reef tank that is well on its way to "stardom" for lack of a better word.
As for the frogspawn . . . what kind of current do you have it in? They really need a low flow situation. Too much can shred the coral tissue.
If this happened very suddenly as you described, then no there is likely nothing that can be done as this would generally be a sign of some sort of trauma (i.e. getting dropped or something. Maybe something is eating it. I don't really know)
But not all hope is lost . . . they are hardy corals IME and can really take a beating. Try moving it to an area of the tank that is very low current and see how it does. just leave it be for a while and see if it regenerates. It just might . . . you never know with this things.
As for the cyano, read the thread in the sticky post at the top of the forum on how to get rid of it. DON'T use chemicals! Especially with a sick coral!

 

[fishphreak]

Actually, my tank isn't new...it's a year old.
I haven't done much, I just wanted to try a few corals.
The 75 gallon is going to be reef.
Yeah, I can try to move it to a lower flow area. It was in a low flow area until I moved the brain where the frogspawn was and the frogspawn to where the brain was.
I hope it isn't the onset of brown jelly disease.
As for the cyano I have already tried frequent water changes, cutting the lights to 8 hours a day (bumped it back up recently for the corals), pulling out the cyano manually, skimming, replacing carbon filters frequently, I only use RO, and fed the fishies once a day, and replacing my pc bulbs.
I doubt there is much more that I can do but I will read the sticky again. I am sure I haven't tried EVERYTHING.
Thank you for you help and patience,
Jessica

 

[fishphreak]

Just a thought....I am running 2x55 10k pc lights.
Since I have such a low wattage I thought it might be more beneficial to run the 10ks instead of a 10k and an acticic.
Could that me the problem? Might it help to remove one of the 10k bulbs and replace with actinic?
Thanks again,
Jessica

 

[007]

I doubt that's necessarily the problem with your frogspawn. However, I do think that it is a good idea to swap out the older of the two 10K's and replace it with a true 03 actinic. I run a 50/50 and super actinic over my tank. You never know though, that could be the problem. Worth a shot anyway.

 

[tstaub3]

your cal is low(380)should be 420 to 460

 

[sammiefish]

Isn't 380ppm the Ca concentration in natural seawater?
What strikes me as strange is the apparent sudden nature of this change. You state it was fine then all of a sudden... Can you think of ANYTHING you might have changed... is all your equipment working properly etc.?
I can say these things really like light... like was said, change the PC bulbs... 12-18 months max. You could move it up closer to the light as well.
good luck keep us posted...

 

[fishphreak]

I have moved it closer to the light and in a lower flow area.
It looks worse today. The general concensus seems be infection.
I talked to the owner of the LFS and he said that from my pics that I e-mail him he doesn't appear to have any new growth since I got him. That it was merely surviving and that would make it more suseptable to infection.
I feel horrible, I didn't know, I thought it was doing great.
I just thought that since it was so big when I got that it wouldn't get any bigger. It is totally my fault.
I have changed carbon filters and started a lime drip about 2 weeks ago but but I keep testing my water daily and all my reading are good except for the trates and I am doing massive water changes to bring them down.
And on top of everything I am in the process of setting up a 75 gallon reef tank. But after all this I am beginning to wonder if I even deserve to have any corals. I thought I knew what I was doing but after this I am not so sure anymore.
Thanks again for all the help,
Jessica

 

[dubbin1]

Originally posted by sammiefish
change the PC bulbs... 12-18 months max.
12-18 months is way to long for a PC bulb. 6-8 months is about there limit.

 

[fishphreak]

Tstaub3,
I know that my calcium is low. I am in the process of bringing it back up to where it needs to be by doing water changes and a limewater drip.
Thanks for the heads up though,
Jessica

 

[fishphreak]

I would have to guess and say the bulbs are probably about 3-4 months old.
I totally forgot about this but about 3 to 4 months ago my ballast went on the lights and I found the whole fixture including bulbs for less than the price of the ballast so I just got a whole new light.
I can believe I forgot about that as mad as I was about it.
Thanks again,
Jessica

 

[fishphreak]

Might this help:
I ordered the ballast, reflector, and socket (250 watt MH) for my 75 that I am setting up. It is supposed to get here today. I can try to get a bulb for it in the next few days and go ahead and set it up on the 29 until the move if that might help.
Thanks again,
Jessica

 

[007]

dripping lime water is not going to raise your Ca or Alk . . . it will help stabilize it, but not really raise it. You need a 2 part buffer system to raise the levels.
I doubt that your Ca is the problem here. you have a very light bioload in the tank.
Dripping Kalkwasser 101

 

[slowest is fastest]

I hope it isn't the onset of brown jelly disease.
The brown jelly is more the result of a bacterial infection or damage then a specific disease IMO
Could that me the problem? Might it help to remove one of the 10k bulbs and replace with actinic?
Although overall things might benefit from a lighting or bulb change "lighting" is not the cause of the brown jelly
Calcium: 380
Calcium level is also not the culprit.
Water quality can contribute (and even cause) the problem
Livestock can damage the coral (crabs,fish,snails etc)
Diatoms, sillicates, algae... can all irritate the coral
What caused it is (and will probably stay) a mystery. In the picture the brain coral is just above the fragspawn. IMO it is just as likely that waste expelled from the brain landed on the frogspawn and caused the problem. I would take a turkey baster and blow the jelly off the frogspawn then collect as much as you can and remove it from the tank. If you haven't done a water change recently I would now. Continue to clean and remove any signs of the brown jelly until it is gone. Avoid changing to many things(location, light intensity etc) to minimize stress. You may consider increasing the flow around the frogspawn to help with the slime. If you have the ability to run a high quality carbon for a few days that may also help.
Good Luck
SiF

 

[fishphreak]

Well there is no jelly substance yet. It has just come very dark, it looks to me like it is receding from the skeleton, and not expanding it's tentacles.
I just did a 50% water change on Friday and intend to do another water change tomorrow.
Thanks,
Jessica

 

[fishphreak]

The limewater I am using is raising my calcium. I keep checking cal, alk, and ph daily to make sure everything is ok since the solution I am using is 80% calcium.
I am also dripping only 1 drop every 4-5 seconds. It is getting up there just slowly.
I agree with you about limewater being a buffer but I don't believe I have the typical limewater solution. What I am using is, like I said, mostly calcium. It is something the LFS mixes for their tanks to raise their calcium and work as a buffer.
They run a constant slow drip for a buffer effect but it can also be bumped up to raise cal.
Not sure I explained that right.
Again I am not disagreeing with you but what I am using isn't like the typical limewater solution (I don't think). This isn't done in equal parts but I am being careful and checking my levels daily for that very reason.
Don't get me wrong, I am greatful for your response and info. I am sure it will come in handy. I just tried something a little different this time.
Thank you again for all your input, I am very greatful,
Jessica