*****: good or bad? ( i need lotsa opinions on this)

whipple

Member
Hey all just got back from Pet Co and proud to say no signs of ICH !!!!! But then agian theres a pork thats just sitting there they have a few damsels that look good and two fire fish that seem ok, but all in all they dont have any fish tonight will get theres on monday so we will see then

[hr]
Bill
 

wally

Member
I agree training is a very good thing but who would do it and what would they train? Even on this board we all have very different ideas on the hows and whys. Compare fish books and you will see them contridict each other time and time again. And on the internet well lets not even go there.
It would take a very long time to train someone properly and that costs HUGE money not just in producing the training films, books, whatever but in the labor costs for them to watch/read them. And the stores just do not have the money to do so. Plus in todays job markket you are lucky if someone lasts 3-6 months let alone a year or more with you. So even if you spent the time and money to train them by the time you did you would be looking at loosing many of them to the guy next door who is paying them a dime more an hour than you.
Also I am not trying to be argumentative here just shed some insight into what problems the stores are facing with labor issues. While I do not run a fish store I have been in retail and restaurant management for the last 12 years so I feel their pain. I am currently the General Manager of a large Italian Restaurant and deal with this type of problem everyday.
 

maxx

Member
Dry goods are good when buying actual fish, honestly its depressing on how horribly they treat those beautiful fish. My *****, always has dead fish in there tanks If there not dead, they're going to die. The holding tanks are disgusting 24/7. I would never buy a fish or other saltwater critter (mine carries sometimes) from any *****. Take our advise on this topic. Hope this helps
Maxx
 
I've worked for ***** for a couple of years, and still have ties in it.
"This is not a ***** only problem. This happens with big corporations everywhere, and ***** should place responsibility on the individual store managers."
sam
Like Sam said it is up to the manager. Don't complain here with post here how bad your local ***** is and complain to the manager or complain to the email attached above. My Wife is a Opperations manager at the ***** here in Olympia. Her job is to field you complaints and FIX them till your happy. Here in the south puget sound area I can go to *****,lfs or drive north to tacoma. My lfs has no idea about saltwater fish or reef animails. He puts his live rock in with his main system with copper. So here in olympia ***** is were I go. Just added A colt coral $27.99. Looks great doing great. Nothing from my lfs has ever lived in my tank.
 

ilove2ride

Member
I was wondering if anyone would ever call attention to this problem, my Local ***** everything is dying or has dormant ick, it is horrible whenever i go there I wish I could save "that puffer" or "that tang" That is breathing heavily at the bottom of the tank, also all there small animals are without water or bleeding, sometimes there are birds flying loose and the manager doesnt even care-
Okay I'll stop now. Anything I can do? :mad:
 
my local ***** in cleveland TN, is terrible. all fish are usually dead or dieing. all kinds of infection,dead fish in tanks,unbelievable outbreaks of algea.its a sad situation <img src="graemlins//dead.gif" border="0" alt="[dead]" />
 

kris walker

Active Member
Hi again Wally,
I just want to argue :) (just kidding). I totally realize the parallels you see as a manager of a restaurant, but I don't agree that training a newbie good husbandry practices is as time-consuming or expensive as you make it out to be. I think making a good fettucine alfredo is a lot more difficult. :)
And just to remind you, there are lots of things that are debateble in this hobby as you point out, but those same things are often minor things because they both seem to work with only minor differences (e.g. maintank DSB vs sump with macroalgae). So if a company went with one system that works and bundled it into a training video that is sent out to every *****, then I really don't see the problem. As I mentioned, a reference book is also needed, so ***** could just sell a few more good saltwater fish books and take one off their shelf for their own use. On-the-job training exists whereever you go, but it isn't that hard, especially during the times when there is nobody in the fish section of the store (this is quite often around where I live).
Just my 2 cents,
sam
 

treble

Member
Well last time I went to the ***** down here in Denver CO, it was like.............pretty damn bad. They had 2 yellow tangs for example, both covered in ick and you could actually see there ribs, they would not move. They had clown tanks, that sucked. They had a panther grouper that swam like a plane that was going to crash. I also found an undulated trigger that even had ick! I mean triggers are one of the most hardy speices ever created by god! The person theredid not even bother to aclimate, the fish are put under HUGE amounts of stress.....
 

wally

Member
Originally posted by Surfin Sam:
<strong>Hi again Wally,
I just want to argue :) (just kidding). I totally realize the parallels you see as a manager of a restaurant, but I don't agree that training a newbie good husbandry practices is as time-consuming or expensive as you make it out to be. I think making a good fettucine alfredo is a lot more difficult. :)
sam</strong><hr></blockquote>
Very good point Sam. A basic understanding would be a good thing of at least simple things like the nitrogen cycle. A good LFS I know of in Cleveland has care sheets on a lot of topics and that would also be a good idea.
And if you are ever in Erie PA stop by and I will make you a wonderful fettucine alfredo.
 

jakob4001

Member
well that's true coraltrapper; we should file our complaints directly w/ ***** managers instead of posting to here about our complaints;but CLEARLY the patern w/ ***** is a national issue & NOT just a store to store problem; I am sure your wife does a great job for her region; but what about the rest of the chain; being as you have more direct contact w/ her of course, could you not voice that there seems to be a NATIONAL concern about quality & care of thier live aquaria department; I mean, if I was aware of problems w/ my place of business on a national level, I'd want to try to address the problem asap instead of waiting for it to solve itself at some point; true some ***** managers will take into account your concerns, but too often it more of the deaf ear or blind eye syndrome; locally have noticed that as a live aquaria chains go, ***** has done little to improve livestock quality as compared to PETSMART even though PETSMART does not sell SWF
 

daluminum

Member
WOW ***** is doing better.. I went into the store today.. they have now setup a seperate show tank from the sales tank. its a 30 gal. with a few clowns, a purple tang, flame angel, a couple of dottybacks, some of those fake coral things.. a a carpet anemome. (Bought from LFS) and a bunch of their usualy $5 anenome's.. looked great underneath the single 24" marine glo bulb that lit the whole tank.. wow.. I wish I would have known I could keep that much stuff with no light in a 30 gal.. I wouldnt have wasted all the money I did.. :D :D :(
 
***** was just bought out two years ago. They changer nation wide to care about there aniamals. You are all talking about "Blitz Stores" getting new managers or being closed down becuase The "New *****" Dose care and my be it is a west cost thing. I've herd of petta and other organazations help keep the anaimals safe. ***** is talking about keeping only tank raised Saltwater fish.
 

somfishguy

New Member
*****...
I'm sure many petcos could do better in the display of animals / staff.
Algae is often caused leaving the store display lights on 14 hrs a day, large fishloads. The kicker is staff, most the horrible algae stores are probably on auto-pilot. Has no-one back there to scrub.
As for fish quality, you kinda get what you pay for. Is that cruel to say. Acclimation is usually only thermal, just floating the bags. There is no quarentine, and most of the systems are linked together, cheaply. Larger bulk of water gives more stability at the price of seperation. Disease can be easily spread, hard to eradicate.
But lets point the light at the reader, how many of you quarentine? And i've heard ever excuse in the book. Ironically Hobbyist who buy from private shops have the experiance and desire to quarentine, beginners or say, idiots, who can't / won't should buy from the private stores (since they sometimes quarentine for you ), and the experts should buy from *****( since they can usually handle it)
More money should be spent on a backroom... recieving animals should be quarentined and or held for a period of atleast two weeks in the back room, this would shield your eyes from the die off associated with shipping stress. LFS's don't have this and can look better because more staff means more people pulling dead fish, although some do probably quarentine. LFS central systems also seem to have better seperation, they tend to use sterlizers, ***** seems to have pulled them because of bulbs costs for replacement, and now relies more heavily in copper for salt. Which has problems.
Knowledgable staff, you only get someone who knows what they're doing at night, when you find someone down on their luck, and needs a job bad. Car exploded, lost job, etc. You can't afford to feed a gerbil on the slighty above min wage a rookie banks. Alot of workers are slackers. Should have a good training class, some fish stores call their employees fish certified, or they train them, and then test them, but you have to pay them too.
I would like all salt fish to be captive bred, but if you find why they're not, breeding some of them is like cracking the human genome. We don't have the technoligy or methodology yet, hopefully that will change. I hope all are caught using consienciest methods in a replinishable manner, not cynided and fished to extinction. Collection points should be mac certified
Shipping, you know there is an effort to make airplanes charge by boxes instead of weight, water weighs alot, so they put more fish in less water. They should definitely ship with more water and less fish to the bag. Also, i wonder if they use a slow release ammonia neutralizer, probably not because it adds cost, but that would probably help.
what else, oh, stuff, go to any hobbyist store and you can get specilized materials. Better more specific diet, and medication. This should damn well be provided by the store, but isn't. Without a quarentine facility, better more aviable meds, and a trained person who wants to be there.... You have it
If they did all these things, that would just turn them into a speciality store. It would raise the price, isn't the reason you went there in the first place... a cheap cheap fish.
I do think things can be improved, it depends so much on action. ***** does say they want to improve...
allow night 'specialists', higher paid people who know what they are doing, allow more budget for fish - order what is needed (speciality items included). Bring back the sterilizer, bring back more frozen food selection, retrofit a small back area for salt and injured fresh atleast...
Better shipping and distribution would be a plus too.
I think ***** could do this and still make money... maybe not as much... i hope they improve and still keep the prices down, but i wouldn't mind paying a few dollars more a fish to have a better chance... wouldn't you? if you think so too tell ***** that... pay alittle more and get more
talk to gm if you want, but these are really corporate rules that managers are following... this has to be addressed at the top
for now..
deal with devil... ask the history of the fish and if its eating, but don't get mad if they don't remember each fish offhand, but do ask to see it eat... ***** can't hold or quarentine so if you absolutely can't ever ever have a q-tank, pay more for some other store to do it for you and only buy from that store... and pay {makes hand gesture for flipping through money} deal with someone who knows... preferably specialist... if you can't, days off whatever then you're on your own - judgement... thats why they need higher paid night specialists!
thats my 2 cents and a guppy....
any thoughts?
 

chipmaker

Active Member
Originally Posted by spankr
80% of *****'s have horrible conditions
15% of *****'s have ok conditions
5% of *****'s have good conditions
Saltwater Fish suffer more than the freshwater fish do, IMO.
I agree forthe most part with above statement. I have to say that our local *****, takes extremely good care of their saltwater critters than they do with their freshwater critters. Their freshwater fish are so deploreable that I would not even buy a feeded goldfish from them to feed to an extremely hungry Oscar..........
Their saltwater fish on the other hand are beautiful and wll kept, and extremely healthy, as good as any and could not see how they could be improved.
Our localpetco does have problems with keeping employese for some reason and at most there is no more than 2 or 3 working in the store ant any given time and that includes the manager....but I don;t thnk they really do all that much business as the Petsmart a few miles down the road is always packed with customers, prices are a lot lower, however they do not handle any saltwater livestock.......but we do have what is Alabama's largest saltwater fish and coral and equipment store, so its not all that bad......
As for *****, I certainly would not be afraid to buy a fish or coral from them. I think they sometimes stock some fish etc that have a small family of buyers, as compared to what they really should be stocking. Right now they have 10 Niger Triggers, and 5 Lionfish and a few large eels a bunch of Tangs.........and a heap of assorted damsels ($2.69 each).........but little to no gobys, blennies and other assorted fish more suited to a community or reef tank. They are getting i more and more assorted corals every week and while their prices are in line with the local strictly sw shop here, they seem to sell quit a bit of them as their stock is always changing from week to week........
I think it all depends on the managers attitude and just how well trained workers in these stores are........Fortunately the saltwater keeper takes pride in maintaining this section. Too bad I can't say the same about the freshwater section.
 
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