grouper with pimples on sides

[kimcheee]

I've been treating my tank w/ hypo now for about a week and have recently noticed these bumps on the side of the grouper. There are about 4-5 of them protruding out from underneath the skin about 1-2mm thick. The side w/ the most bumps happens to be the same side that he scratches a lot on. Beth told me that it may be a secondary irritation due to his scratching. I was wondering if I should start treatment with maracyn2 or not to prevent a full blown infection. He's eating but hides behind the Emperor filter arm at the top of the tank the entire day floating on his side. His stomach also looks bloated. I've been feeding him garlic soaked shrimp for about 3-4 days already and don't know it this has any correlation to his bloating. The pimples on his side seem to be white-almost like a white puss filled pimple. At first I thought it was a cyst from the ick that may have embedded itself deep within the skin but now more are popping up day to day. Please help before he dies...

 

[beth]

Why don't you think that these are ick?

 

[kimcheee]

Thanks for replying so quickly. The bumps are literaly protruding out from underneath his skin and have never seen anything like it before. Then again, I'm also not experienced to make the call either. The grouper has wedged himself underneath a flat piece of coral and continues to act lethargicly. His behavior definitely says ick, but the pimple like structures on his side are really weird. Whatever you think is right is what I'll do. Thanks.

 

[beth]

I am thinking ick cysts burried beneath the scales, which does happen occassionally. Is the fish still eating? You may need to actually think about doing a fresh water dip with this fish.

 

[kimcheee]

Thanks for all the input. Beth, at first I thought the same as you and wasn't sure if a fresh water dip would've stressed the fish out, since the tank was already at such a low salinity level. Terry, I don't have a digital camera so pics are out of the question. No other fish has bumps like the grouper. He is still eating like a pig, but I started to tone down his feeding since he was looking like a bloated cow. He seems more active today, but the bumps are still on his side. The best i could describe it w/out being gross is to envision a whitehead zit on the side of your face and this is exactly what it looks like. It's very blistery looking. If it is ick, in order for it to die, wouldn't it have to "explode" through the fishes skin once it's reached maturity? What would happen to the fish in terms of secondary infection? The bumps seem to be quite deep and painfully irritating to the fish. Hope this helps and sorry about the lack of a pic.

 

[kimcheee]

I Just got back from a company trip in Chicago today and noticed that my grouper has even more bumps on his side. He's still eating but instead of four or five he has like 10 all over his sides. Please help if possible-he seems to be getting a LOT WORSE.

 

[kimcheee]

Hey Terry
Glad to here from u. The tank is already at 1.009 salinity. Before that I used Copper at 3ppm w/ Formalin and Malachite Green. I was feeding the grouper additional parasitic med's(metranidazole) dipped in food and this all seemed to be helping, until I got hold of this website. In the past, I treated this strain of ick w/the same regimen and would take 2 months for it to die, so instead I decided to go with hypo. So far all the other fish in the tank seem to be getting much better w/ the exception of the grouper. Beth suggested that it may be the ick stuck underneath the skin of the fish. I tried a series of 2-3 formalin dips w/out any success. The lucky thing is that it still swims around actively and eats like a pig. Besides that, the pimples are increasing in number and he continues to scratch at the bottom of the tank. Do you think it could be a bacterial infection?

 

[beth]

No, its not a bacterial infection...scratching indicates parasites. when you say, "pimples" do you mean like white pulslets, or salt looking, like ick? Explain this. Get a magnifying glass and look very closely at the fish to see if you can get a better take on what is going on and describe it in more detail.

 

[kimcheee]

Beth and Terry
Thanks for responding so quickly. The bumps on the side of the grouper look like zits on my face(lol). They are approx. 2-3mm in diameter and stick out of the skin(underneath the skin) like a large pimple. There are approx. 10 on the sides of the grouper and look pink to red, almost like it's been irritated. They seem to be reducing in size over the past day, but I'm not 100% sure about this. From his scratching, some of the pimples have been broken open and look like a popped zit. The way I did the formalin dips was by putting 2-3 drops of QUICK CURE which contains A TRICHELATED FORMULA OF 99.20% FO4RMALDEHYDE AND .75% MALACHITE GREEN, in 1/3 gallon of freshwater(aclimated to the same temperature as the main tank, buffered w/seachem buffer to ph 8.2 and removed chlorine w/sodium thiosulfate) and dipped the grouper for 3-4 minutes. I've continued to feed him shrimp soaked in fresh garlic w/ selecon 1.5x's per day along w/ all the other fish in the tank.
His spirits are good and if it wasn't for the scratching and pimples, you would never know that it was sick. The situation seems to be getting better, but again I'm not to sure. The fish have been in hypo just about 1.5 weeks. No copper nor anyother meds are in the water. 8 watt UV sterilizer being used 24/7 along with Carbon filtration w/ Emperor filter and Fluval 304. Readings for water are all stable.

 

[kimcheee]

Grouper today is defintely getting worse. Some of the pimples have been "popped" open from his constant scraping on the tank bottom. Number of pimples/bumps seem to be increasing. He can't stand to not swim around and scratch at the same time. It's still eating so I decided to feed him parasite food(food w/ metranidazole) to see if treating it from within will help. If anybody has any other suggestions, please let me know.

 

[kimcheee]

I'll start the M2 right away today. Should I use just the rec. dose or go higher? Also
Should I keep doing the FW dips or just forget about them? I'm not really sure if they were helping, but he does tolerate the dips pretty well. Should I keep feeding him the metranidazole food? Sorry about all the questions but I'm at a loss here. Thanks for the advice by the way.