overanalyzer
Active Member
Originally posted by doodle1800
think a damsel or 2 might be in order?
Congrats on the clear tank - but only buy the damsels if you want them long term!!!
HD Sand / Cloudy Water Q
- Thread starter doodle1800
- Start date
Originally posted by doodle1800
think a damsel or 2 might be in order?
Congrats on the clear tank - but only buy the damsels if you want them long term!!!
beaslbob
Well-Known Member
doodle
glad the tank is clear.
I recommend you not put any fish in there until the LR has been in there at least three weeks. that allows the fish born parasites to die off from lack of host.
Personal preferance. I like mollies for cycleing. hardy, cheap, have babies in the tank, and are constantly cleaning the tank expecially the water surface.
glad the tank is clear.
I recommend you not put any fish in there until the LR has been in there at least three weeks. that allows the fish born parasites to die off from lack of host.
Personal preferance. I like mollies for cycleing. hardy, cheap, have babies in the tank, and are constantly cleaning the tank expecially the water surface.
doodle1800
Active Member
black mollies? freshwater? I know they are brackish type fish but its ok in a full saltwater? Acclimation is a must I bet..
overanalyzer
Active Member
doodle - after you add yoru LR you will have a mini-cycle (maybe). I would test your water and wait it out. Then I would only add fish you want. So if you want black mollies in your SW tank .... fine - get them. But do not cycle with them, do not add them unless you want them.
Personally I know people who keep them in seahorse tanks because the seahorses will eat the young, but otherwise I would not add them to a SW tank - especially with so many other beautiful fish out there.
Also -- never cycle with live fish. Cycling is a harsh chemical process and you do not need to have a live fish to start or go through a cycle. All that you need is a something to kick off the chemical process of the ammonia spike.
Some individuals claim that cycling with live fish is the best way to go because it produces a better cycle - which is pure fabrication. Cycling with LR seems to go fastest and does everything you need. You can also use fish food or raw shrimp.
HTH
Personally I know people who keep them in seahorse tanks because the seahorses will eat the young, but otherwise I would not add them to a SW tank - especially with so many other beautiful fish out there.
Also -- never cycle with live fish. Cycling is a harsh chemical process and you do not need to have a live fish to start or go through a cycle. All that you need is a something to kick off the chemical process of the ammonia spike.
Some individuals claim that cycling with live fish is the best way to go because it produces a better cycle - which is pure fabrication. Cycling with LR seems to go fastest and does everything you need. You can also use fish food or raw shrimp.
HTH
beaslbob
Well-Known Member
Originally posted by doodle1800
black mollies? freshwater? I know they are brackish type fish but its ok in a full saltwater? Acclimation is a must I bet..
They don't have to be black. I used 5 different types in my 55g. Kinda liked the silver lyre tails. And they are extremely hardy.
I do not agree with cycling with anything other than live fish. Only with live fish do you get the complete waste products necessary for the system. Additionally, something dead rotting in the tank produces spikes. After the spikes go down, it is possible to have a smelly couldy mess as bacteria die off. In addition to being a more constant bioload, live fish also contribute carbon dioxide. this is necessary for the plant life which either you added or is on your LR.
One key I have found out is to not feed the fish until nitrItes spike and then come down. Only takes a week and I have never lost a fish during that process.
reefnut
Active Member
Originally posted by beaslbob
Only with live fish do you get the complete waste products necessary for the system. Additionally, something dead rotting in the tank produces spikes.
This is false information. Please if your going to provide false information please put IMO, or somthing to that effect so others can see it is NOT fact.
doodle1800
Active Member
I appreciate everyone's help here and respect everyone's opinions.
Reefnut - you forgot to put IMO in front of your "this is false information".
Is anything really a fact?
Reality, what a concept.... (Steven Wright)...
Reefnut - you forgot to put IMO in front of your "this is false information".
Is anything really a fact?
Reality, what a concept.... (Steven Wright)...
overanalyzer
Active Member
Originally posted by beaslbob
They don't have to be black. I used 5 different types in my 55g. Kinda liked the silver lyre tails. And they are extremely hardy.
I do not agree with cycling with anything other than live fish. Only with live fish do you get the complete waste products necessary for the system. Additionally, something dead rotting in the tank produces spikes. After the spikes go down, it is possible to have a smelly couldy mess as bacteria die off. In addition to being a more constant bioload, live fish also contribute carbon dioxide. this is necessary for the plant life which either you added or is on your LR.
One key I have found out is to not feed the fish until nitrItes spike and then come down. Only takes a week and I have never lost a fish during that process.
OK - EDITED - please QUIT spreading false information.
Statment 1: I do not agree with cycling with anything other than live fish. Only with live fish do you get the complete waste products necessary for the system.
You do not need waste products during the cycle - the cycle is a chemical process. Once it starts adding waste prdocuts or other items to the cycle has the potential to lengthen the cycle and not improve it in any way. Fish waste products may increase the bacteria in your tank but you do NOT need fish waste products to cycle a tank and there is NO real benefit from using fish other then asthetic value.
Statement 2: Additionally, something dead rotting in the tank produces spikes. After the spikes go down, it is possible to have a smelly couldy mess as bacteria die off.
Uhm - something dead and rotting kicks off your cycle. The bacteria dieing off is part of the cycle - which takes roughly a month. You should not have cloudy smelly mess if you cycle with LR or a piece of raw shrimp. Once the ammonia spikes you can remove the piece of raw shrimp. This should solve any issue of cloudiness.
Statement 3: In addition to being a more constant bioload, live fish also contribute carbon dioxide. this is necessary for the plant life which either you added or is on your LR.
Your tank will support slow and gradual increases in terms of plant and animal life. Adding a fish does not appreciably increase the CO2 in your tank unless you have a small tank and a large fish..... which is not a recommended approach.
Statement 4: One key I have found out is to not feed the fish until nitrItes spike and then come down. Only takes a week and I have never lost a fish during that process.
Not false - but just down-right cruel to animals. First you subject mollies which are natrually fresh water to brackish water fish to a harsh chemically enhanced salt environment - then you put them into an environment with incredibly high levels of toxic checmicals (ammonia then nitrItes) and then you starve them??
Hey Folks - please take a look @ beaslbob's tank. I will find and post it below. I might have only 13 years of fish keeping experience and I might not advocate the cheapest easiest way out but I will put my results up against his EVERY DAY OF THE WEEK.
IMO I would not listen to a word he says .....
overanalyzer
Active Member
Picture of beaslbob's tank from a post in late june:
overanalyzer
Active Member
a pciture of my - LR cycled - non-molly having - slow and patiently built 20 Gallon nano......
broncofish
Active Member
I beleive the proof is in the pictures. Sorry Beaslbob I would not keep spreading your word as truth, when your tanks are just ugly. I agree with seperate aproaches, but when it fails so badly why do you stick to it, and even worse tell other people to do it your way when it....well it.....produces ugly tanks with nitrates that are through the roof.
Sorry Beaslbob I would not keep spreading your word as truth, when your tanks are just ugly. I agree with seperate aproaches, but when it fails so badly why do you stick to it, and even worse tell other people to do it your way when it....well it.....produces ugly tanks with nitrates that are through the roof.
doodle1800
Active Member
ok - lets summarize here if we may... whether I did things right or wrong.
Purchased an American Pharmaceuticals tap water filter and filled tank in about 6 hours.
I mixed a 50 gal bag of salt without sand.
I poured in 2 bags of rinsed HD playsand.
Water got very cloudy.
I put a hanging filter on it with biowheels.
I wiped sides down with a cleaner block.
And after 4 days I put a skimmer on it. (no reason why I waited other than I didn't have it yet)
After 4 days I put some LR in there - about 8lbs so far. 25lbs more coming today. Also 5 lbs of base rock.
I also added 3 cups of LS from another tank.
And the tank is perfectly clear today, 5 days later.
I'll take pics this weekend..
Purchased an American Pharmaceuticals tap water filter and filled tank in about 6 hours.
I mixed a 50 gal bag of salt without sand.
I poured in 2 bags of rinsed HD playsand.
Water got very cloudy.
I put a hanging filter on it with biowheels.
I wiped sides down with a cleaner block.
And after 4 days I put a skimmer on it. (no reason why I waited other than I didn't have it yet)
After 4 days I put some LR in there - about 8lbs so far. 25lbs more coming today. Also 5 lbs of base rock.
I also added 3 cups of LS from another tank.
And the tank is perfectly clear today, 5 days later.
I'll take pics this weekend..
overanalyzer
Active Member
sounds good to me doodle - though a lot of people advocate not runnign a skimmer during hte cycle!